Anime, gender, sexuality, 13 year old girls...

[SolivagantAdventures]

I have NC for this.

My DD is 13 yo and about to start Y9 in sept in an all girl secondary school. Towards the end of Y7, we started noticing some changes in her mood, the way she spoke, the things she spoke about...

She had developed a very close friendship with two kids in her form who started identifying as boys. My DD 'came out' as pansexual. She also started showing an interest in manga and anime.

We didn't make a big deal of the sexuality aspect of things beyond telling her that we loved her no matter her sexual orientation, and felt that anime was a healthy enough interest; we actually bought her books, movies, toys...

However, we also found that DD had been self harming and engaging in very dark topics with one of these kids, e.g. 'I am so ugly I should just die' and that this kid had coerced my dd into 'coming out' to us.

Fast forward to the end of Y8, and DD seems to have really settled herself into this identity. She has been ordering costumes for 'cosplay', she's obsessed with anime. I now feel whether I have been naive and I should educate myself. Problem is, DD is very defensive and will not share this side of her with us. In fact, she barely speaks to us at all, about anything.

She has recently fallen out with a good friend she's had since she was 5 years old, and she's very cagey about what's happened.

DD has very low self esteem. She thinks she's ugly and her way of coping is by not looking after herself. She resents us asking her to exercise and this has become an issue at home as she's been putting on weight. She'll happily spend all her time in her room with the door closed, playing minecraft and whatever else she does.

It's such a minefield. DH and I are trying to encourage fresh air, activities and exercise as a way to look after her body and mental health, but just getting her to do a 30 minute workout a day involves a lot of chasing, arguing, stroppiness.... I am worn out.

I am not sure what I'm asking here. I guess I'd like to hear from others with similar aged daughters who are also involved in anime and are gender/sexuality questioning?

I am concerned that because of covid-19, she will stay in her form for all her classes so the influenced that these 2 kids seem to have on her will get even stronger. She's on the waiting list to see a counsellor.

Sounds hard OP.

Is she spending lots of time online/on social media? If so I would get her off it ASAP, or monitor it very closely.

I would look up the work of Abigail Shrier. She has a new book out about huge numbers of transgender teen girls being partly the result of a peer contagion - resulting from a mental Health crisis amongst teen girls, and self harm is common amongst them too. I have the boom on pre order On amazon, but she has done lots of Interviews/podcasts about it.

I'm not sure about the anime aspect but would be worth a look.

This must be very difficult for you

What help and support did the school provide in year 7. Pastoral team work particularly.

If she's going to an all girls secondary next year, will those two girls who now identify at boys be with her? I'm interested to know how single-sex schools will deal with transgenderism in kids.

Sorry, I know that isn't much advice! It sounds rough. But I'd drop the pressure to do a 30 minute workout, if she already has low self esteem and feels ugly, she may see this as you confirming that her body isn't "good enough" and it could make it worse. I don't know much about manga/anime but maybe she'd be up for a martial arts class instead? Obviously when normality resumes...

Turn off the Internet and make sure she has no mobile data on her phone. A few weeks of no outside influences before she starts school again.

I have a DD the same age. She loves watching anime too but hasn't shown interest in dressing up etc. We recently had some behaviour changes and it all came to a head on holiday where it transpired she wasn't keeping herself safe online. Fortunately I caught it really early but I was shocked how quickly it had escalated. Since then we've removed her access (not permanently but we've said we need to re educate her on e safety). I wouldn't go as far as saying she's a different child but things are already so much better. I am sharing this as you said 'Minecraft' and whatever else - she could be being seriously influenced either by these friends or people online. Please check this as she does sound easily influenced / confused.

I find my DD goes through mad phases where she wants to run every day (so too much) and then this fizzles out to nothing! They do seem to go from 0 to 120 and back down to 0 very quickly at this age and obsessions are easy to take hold.

I can't help you on the sexuality questioning as I don't have direct experience in this but you sound supportive and loving. I think accepting her and also saying that you will support any changes are important (she needs to know if she makes any changes / adjustments in her decisions then these will be supported too).

Also puberty and lock down has been a hard time for people and some of these behaviours might naturally ease a little with maturity and new friends.

In your shoes id work on your bond and spending quality time together rather then needing to know stuff. Don’t lecture.

Make sure WiFi is on child restrictions so not accessing dangerous stuff which could draw her in

Access weekly counselling for her. She needs an independent responsible adult to talk things through. The councillor with my DS helped him in many ways including enabling him to take small steps to take care of his own mental health and spending time with me. We were able to reconnect and then he reconnected with exercise and his voluntary work and school. It’s taken time.

The councillor or GP may recommend CIPs if things are really bad.

www.nhs.uk/conditions/stress-anxiety-depression/mental-health-helplines/

Also can you speak to the school and see if she can be assigned a different class next year? It may be good for her to not be so influenced by her two friends - give her space to think for herself. Counselling seems like a good idea, push for this.

Thank you everyone.

She's been in an all girl secondary school since year 7. Two girls in her form now identify as boys, they requested a change of pronouns and name, wear trousers instead of skirt (an option for all students anyway) but nothing else changes. I have heard of other girls in other forms also identifying as boys.

The pastoral team at school haven't done much, we did bring this to their attention but what can they realistically do, which is why DD will see a counsellor privately (which she's keen to do, by the way).

I really struggle with he whole 'drop the pressure to exercise' suggestion because she is putting on weight. I already make an effort to make sure there's healthy food at home and we cook from scratch. How can I not expect her to exercise? I strongly believe that not exercising will affect her mental health negatively and she'll end up hating herself even more.

Also talk to pastoral and head of year about a possible form change. It might be better to split all the girls up and put them with others they get on with in other forms.

I agree about needing excersise for mental health. Could you ask her to plan what she would like to do each day as it would be better for her to create her own structure rather then have one enforced.

What does she like? What are her interests? If she likes dogs get her voluntarily dog walking. Follow her interests.

It sounds like depression and self esteem issues.

Sorry I read some of the latest posts after I posted my reply.

As much as I'd love my DD to be away from these 2 students, the opposite is going to happen. We had requested that when they shuffle forms for Y9, they made sure DD was not in the same form with these 2 students. Unfortunately the exact opposite is going to happen as they're not going to shuffle forms at all, and they're not even going to separate for lessons, because of Covid-19.

Requesting that they put my DD in another form is something that she wouldn't agree with in a million years, as she'll end up being the only one moving, and having to go into a brand new class.

Are you exercising with her? And eating genuinely healthy food that is nutritious yet low in calories - also with her? I think she would want you to do all of this stuff with her rather than be told to do it.

I think you need to create a stronger bond and spend quality time together first and once your relationship is a bit better ask her to start structuring her day. Ask her to make the plan - exercise, time with others, self care, sleep, giving to other

Ask the school again for your DD to move form. Email the head and head of lower school if necessary. Explain your reasons why

Dropping the exercise request is important. If she is into anime, she is staring at impossibly skinny, bambi eyed women all day. She already thinks she is ugly and has been self harming. If you are pushing daily exercise because she has gained weight it's a recipe for her to interpret that as you believing she is fat, ugly etc. Eating disorders are very common. Please just ignore the weight issue entirely.

I do agree that getting out if the house is important for mental health though. Starting with screen free time, and no exercise outdoor time eg picnic at the park, or a bbq with family/friends that your dad likes might be a good no pressure starting place to get her back into the habit of being outdoors.

I can't ask school to move my DD. They would. But my DD would hate that. She will end up in a form where she doesn't know anyone. No one is moving this year, that's the problem.

I try to exercise with her but she doesn't want to. I exercise myself regularly, and DD knows I make myself do it because I believe it's good for me, not because I particularly enjoy it. Honestly, I have gone through countless I am so worn out. self-care plans with her, I have encouraged to write up her own, it becomes constant chasing, nagging, conflict.

*dd - not dad sorry

I'd contact the school right away and tell all, including the names of the "dark" friends, and ask them to provide DD with some support.

Another vote for turning off the internet here.

I just wouldn’t let her skulk about in her bedroom all day.
She has to engage with her family. Healthy eating, self care and sport.

Instead of saying you need to do 30 minutes of exercise, can you not just say that as a family we’re going to go for a walk to get some fresh air and escape the lockdown?

I would also limit internet exposure and if she doesn’t want to come out for a walk make sure you disable all of her devices so she can’t spend all the time festering in her room online.

She is still a child and you need to be unpopular with her and get her out of her room and socialising with her family.

I wouldn’t try talking to her about it all if it just makes her clam up. Also she’s unlikely to open up to you much anyway, you are her parent, but perhaps if you could find other topics to discuss on walks and at mealtimes her mood might improve?

Try and get her into cooking with you? Or get her to cook for you? Treat her like a grown up and give her some family responsibilities she can help with? Laundry? Cleaning? Maybe do some big spring clean type project together or put her in charge of? I.e sort out the garage or something? Housework counts as exercise.

Really anything to get her out of her room without making it about her and doing some activities that will help her self esteem.

Have you considered what kind of new absorbing interest might redirect DD's attention ? Maybe, joining an out of school group like Duke of Edinburgh awards.. Getting a rescue dog . Volunteer conservation work. Cooking classes. Art group.

Yes, I am desperately looking for activities that she can join, but there's virtually nothing out there, partly because of Covid-19, partly because she doesn't want to do those activities, partly because there really isn't all that much for this age group.

When things are 'normal' she does yoga once a week and she's part of a drama class on Saturdays, which she really loves. Yoga is no longer happening, a diluted version of the drama thing has been happening online.

Does she have siblings op? She seems quite isolated.
PPs are correct in that you need to address diet if weight gain is really an issue. Tbh you're not selling exercise to me. It's important for mental health too though
You need to find ways to open up conversation and showing genuine interest in the things she's interested in so that she'll start to talk to you. She needs to feel accepted by you so she can start to accept herself.
Bit left-field but any chance of getting a dog? Any pet might be great for her emotional state and provide a comfort and confidante but dogs have ways of getting teenagers out into the garden and even walking daily.

Definitely sounds isolated, she could with a new hobbies and engaging in some outdoor activities. I love anime and was obsessed from a young age. Do you
Know what sort of anime she is watching just so I can get a rough idea.

Sorry fat fingers!!