London parents - Free bus travel for children suspended from October half term

[Poundpup]

I just came across this article whilst browsing the BBC site and it seems that free transport for under 18s will be suspended temporarily directly after the October half term. With exceptions for those travelling to school more than 2 miles away.

Does anyone know how much a child's fare is? As nowhere seems to indicate what the incoming children fares will be.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53694922

Well yes, I will make sure my ds oyster is always topped up so he can still get the bus whenever he wants to...although this is another expense I can ill afford but like everything, I'll make sacrifices elsewhere. Would be nice to have some clarity about the whole thing though so I know where I stand.

However, my ds often tells me that kids in his school have no money on their lunch accounts to pay for their food. If parents either can't afford it, or are too forgetful or lazy to top up their kids lunch account, then I can't see them doing it for their children's oyster card either.

Barely slept last night ( when I found out distance on Google maps, their school have just relocated to their permanent site). The irony is if only we lived two blocks away they would have qualified. Someone living just 2_3 minutes away will keep the privilege regardless of their financial situation so long as they meet 2 miles. What people outside London need to realize is we never saw this coming. If I was to apply for a school now I would consider the travel costs

Yes exactly @safalina and the fact that it is really hard to find out the details of what's going to happen

Once again who will suffer from the decision to suspend/end the free travel? Is it not the children? There will be a myriad of reasons why some children will not be given money to get to school. The children should not have to miss out on getting to school, and being able to have access to education, due to the Government's inability to think things through properly.

I believe this is a political decision. We know Tories like to play the divide and rule tactic.They will never do something that will impact their voters/base. If you pay attention to the current narrative it's Londoners vs the rest. Brexiteer vs remainers BAME vs others. This will impact BAME more than any other group. I wish people could see what's going on. London is expensive place. Since 2011 estates have been sold off and instead of social rent there's affordable which if you are unlucky and loose you job will be unfordable. Extra curricular activities are much more expensive here( I know because I have relations out of London,).

When have the Conservative Government ever given a fig about BAME People?

Does anyone know if it's 2 miles as the crow flies or 2 miles on the shortest walking route?

Nothing wrong with walking two miles to school in a city. Plenty of kids do that all over the world.
Many of the kids at my sons' school walk or cycle far more than that each day.

For goodness sake get a grip. There is no free transport outside of London, child fares are 2/3 adult fare from age 5. Free school transport is only available (over age 8) if you live 3 miles, yes 3 miles from your nearest school via the safest walking route. If you choose a school that isn't the closest, tough, unless sn and it's the names school. A kids bus fare is £2 each way or £16 a week, at age 16 you pay adult fare even if you are just into year 11 thus very much compulsory school age. It's crap but no subsidies from government here unlike in London, no bail out during covid either.

minnieok that's a bit harsh. This is the equivalent of you discovering that your £16 a week will from half term be now (for example) £30 a week. Have you budgeted for that? Can you afford that extra? Had you known this a year ago you could adjust your households budget. Or if this was when you were deciding which schools to apply for would you had maybe chosen different ones? This is the situation for London parents.

Please please anyone affected by this who lives in a TFL area, drop an email to your MP. You can find out their name and email address here by putting in your postcode:
members.parliament.uk/FindYourMP

It’s kept in confidence if you ask the MP to keep private details like your name. MPs do need to know about how harshly this will affect parents though so the MPs can advocate for parents in Parliament. Boris Johnson’s government are intent on this happening and it’s only MPs and people writing to them and calling them that can stop it.

Anyone else who doesn’t live in London/TFL area but you believe that the capital city and major cities should be affordably livable for children and families (which any sustainable major city HAS to be- or big sections of the workforce will leave or have to commute in for hours which is terrible for family life..) then please write to your MP.

I would be very happy to write to my MP about campaigns for free transport for kids outside London- please add links to this thread.

Wherever you live in the UK, our country having cities that are only affordable for tourists to visit and only super rich people to live in, is very much the direction we are going in. That is a tragedy and not sustainable for a functional city.

London has extreme wealth in parts but also some of the worst poverty in the country and a very very high cost of living.

It also has some extremes of the issues that other major cities have that make life very difficult for kids without access to public transport.

Intense traffic to get through on foot or by bike, intense air pollution and pockets of antisocial behaviour can all make public transport healthier and safer ways to travel for the most vulnerable kids.

And at the weekends, I’ll post this again because it bears repeating: the extremely high costs of London mean that many families are often far flung and may have to move frequently due to housing costs, disrupting family relationships and childcare arrangements. And paying for the kids’ travel can make all of that much harder.

People should not have to move away from their families and support networks just because they have kids, and life becomes unaffordable in any town or city, this is a perfect example of this happening.

We should not accept a race to the bottom where we support that services are lost somewhere just because they aren’t available somewhere else.

Let’s call for free transport for children everywhere in the UK. Why not?

Other places- look at Paris- are bringing in subsidised travel to help parents. Let’s not go backwards in the UK. www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-01-18/paris-metro-will-soon-be-free-for-kids

www.childinthecity.org/2019/01/11/a-plan-for-free-public-transport-for-children-in-paris/?gdpr=accept

We should all be asking our local MPs to advocate for UNICEF child-friendly city status in our communities to equalise things for children. This scheme is for making change in any community- doesn’t have to be a city - please raise it with your MP if you are writing to them: childfriendlycities.org/what-is-a-child-friendly-city/

Thanks, sorry this was so long.

MinnieOk there wasn’t a London bail out for COVID on fares- they took away free freedom passes for senior citizens and kids free travel in lockdown. Senior citizens get their freedom passes back but kids will not get their travel back because Boris’ government made it as condition of not letting TFL fail financially, because they have TFL over a barrel.

www.london.gov.uk/coronavirus/coronavirus-covid-19-faqs/what-are-new-rules-children-and-young-people-under-18-travelling-and-when-are-you-going-make-these

Central government have been trying to get a way into TFL for years and covid was a great opportunity.

As for the free travel, if you only get it if it's your nearest school then hardly anyone will be eligible as so many schools here are oversubscribed that kids end up all over the place.

I read that two thirds of London children use public transport for school. Many get the tube, there will be longer distances involved but they won't get free travel as not nearest school.

Children in poverty will be impacted obviously more than children not in poverty.

I suspect the cost of all the councils setting up and trying to administer free travel will be more than just giving the free travel. Councils are already struggling.

It's a political move, which will result in loads of negative consequences.

As for the free travel, if you only get it if it's your nearest school then hardly anyone will be eligible as so many schools here are oversubscribed that kids end up all over the place. I don't think that can be true because for many their closest secondary school may not be accessible because of having a very small catchment area/be partially selective. And also, remember in London a lot of schools are single-sex and many parents opt for such education over mixed, so surely that needs to be added to the equation. And how can you apply Ts&Cs retrospectively?

It's a political move, which will result in loads of negative consequences.

Absolutely. More unfairness and social division based on where you were born and who to. The bad consequences of this for kids and families are totally foreseeable and inevitable.

That's the point NMA how on earth are the councils supposed to work out who is eligible, if (if) the guidance outside London is used? I mean it would be incredibly complicated, it would have to be done on a pupil by pupil basis, referring back to the records from the time from the pan London admissions org etc etc.

This is part of why they need to say what the rules will be. The councils need to have this in place by October!

I don't think anyone has the appetite to go back and examine if the school was the nearest one with an available place at the time the family joined the school , so it does sound like it's just going to be on distance as it is when concessions are stopped.

The public funds into TfL that pay for concessions for children (and the disabled and the elderly) are paid for out of London council tax - there are extensive negotiations about the deal each time it is up for renewal. London the free fares at point of use, because Londoners chose to pay for it by other mechanisms. Covid has driven a coach and horses through that, and suspending concession for non-disabled children was the least unpalatable cut

Well they surely can't apply an outside London model/guidance given that it's never been an issue previously. Pretty sure they can't work out distance 'as the crow flies' because that's not necessarily safely walkable unless you have special powers (flying!). Personally I feel it will be too unwieldy to implement at such short notice.

they took away free freedom passes for senior citizens and kids free travel in lockdown

?? I don't think they did

Child concessions will change in October, but they've been unchanged so far

Freedom passes could not be used during defined peak hours at height of pandemic, but they were not abolished

Pretty sure they can't work out distance 'as the crow flies' because that's not necessarily safely walkable unless you have special powers (flying!)

You can have 'as crow flies' as you means to measure distance for admission. But for transport it has to be by safe walking route (that already applies, everywhere in England)

What constitutes a safe walking route in London is in itself a very knotty question.

Freedom Passes are now not valid during the morning peak

Quite why the over 60s should get to travel free across London all the time escapes me

Don't get me started on the nominee free travel passes that TfL offers employees

Would love the option of a paid bus service! Where I live the council run coach to school has just been cancelled and there are no local buses that cover the route needed. Our children are being sent on a muddy unlit walk of 3+ miles.
Look

They'll use the standard definition of paved and lit.

I expect there would be a way to appeal if you think the measurement or permissible route is wrong, but we'll have to wait for full details to be out to be sure