What's a good "starter" dog for someone with a bit of a dog fear?

[NellyF1]

What's a good "starter" dog for someone with a bit of a dog fear and who is new to owning a dog?

Interested to know about the breed, gender, etc. that would be best.

Ideally not a very loudy or aggressive breed.

Also, how much does all the maintenance (living costs, food, vet, etc.) costs come to? Can he/she be left alone during the day from 9-5? How often must he/she be walked, is there risk of them pooping in the house unattended?

I can’t believe anyone would be this naive. One look on the dog board woujf have told you everything

There's no such thing as a "basic google search" when buying a dog. A dog is a living, breathing, loving animal with complex needs and there are too many variables. One website may say it's fine to leave a dog 9-5, another won't. Because all dogs are different. And a lot of google searches will lead here, interestingly enough. You may be comfortable with making your decisions based on a google search, but some people want to ask real human beings for anecdotal responses and don't need links to soft toys on amazon or to be told to get a tamagotchi. Really, who looks more immature in that scenario anyway?

I’ve just done a basic google search “can dogs be left alone“ and no result says an unequivocal ‘yes’

There are results that say yes for up to 8 hours, but with caveats re long term health issues, and cleaning up mess, etc.

General consensus is

“An adult dog can be left alone for up to four to six hours a day, as a very general rule of thumb. However, this number can vary widely on several factors, such as: Your Dog's Training.“

So no, not 9-5 every day.

So some basic are search, then ask for more nuanced advice. Not come to MN for a unanimous decision on ‘what dog should I get’.

It’s about an animals needs, not a humans wants.

I've just done a basic google search for which dogs can be left at home all day while you're at work. Apparently there are loads. Found a result instantly: www.cheatsheet.com/culture/the-best-dog-breeds-for-people-who-work-all-day.html/

You can always find exactly what you want to find on google. I wouldn't want to leave a dog at home all day though, so I'd seek further advice if I wanted a dog. Some people aren't sure, so they ask. Some people will use that link above and just go for it.

Anyway, goodnight.

Yep, fair enough. I guess we all go to our bias 🤷‍♀️

G’night

How about volunteering at a rescue or doing something like "borrow my dog" where you're matched with a dog and take it for weekends or short breaks. This will help you to overcome your fear and build up your knowledge of what dogs need. Additionally if you volunteer you might naturally form a bond with a dog and eventually decide to adopt it.

Thank you @WhatCFeryIsThis and @HirplesWithHaggis

Exactly what I was thinking - there’s probably lots of clueless people who just go ahead with getting a dog without even considering these questions. For someone who has never had/lived with a dog, none of this info is obvious. I’d known of a lot of colleagues who both work 9-5 and have no dog sitter etc hence my question.

People getting worked up over a hypothetical dog being poorly looked after by me is just odd. I was literally just throwing a few feelers out there - even budget constraints alone meant it would be at least another year before it would have even happened even if my lifestyle suited it.

@WhatCFeryIsThis your reasoning on why I posted on Mumsnet rather than a google search initially is spot on - that’s exactly why

Can you spend time with a friend who has a dog to experience what it's like. To be honest I don't think any reputable breeder or shelter would let you have one

@NellyF1 mentioning leaving a dog home during the day while you go to work is like a red flag to a bull with doggy people, even though you’re right that absolutely loads of people do it. It’s not ideal, but you could pay a dog sitter to come in for an hour a day. I’ll probably get pounced on for saying this, but I think if you got a rescue dog that would otherwise be sitting in a kennel at a shelter then you could improve its quality of life even if you weren’t home 24/7. Dogs are expensive and a lot of work though, so just be prepared.

I think you are getting a hard time, OP. Before we got our doggie, my husband and I spent a long time looking at what breeds would be good for people who hadn't owned a dog before - I'd certainly have asked on a forum if I'd known about such things back then. We had many happy years with our dog, who recently passed away at a grand old age.

Have you thought of signing up to 'Borrow my doggy'? This might offer a chance to interact with different dogs and give a taste of what it's like to look after one, without any long-term commitment.

If it helps, we have a Labrador and he costs us as follows:

£50 a month dog food (because he's big and eats a lot, we buy Skinners Field and Trial which is great food but not at premium prices)
£25 insurance
£80 on doggy daycare (this was usually more pre lockdown)
£20 miscellaneous stuff like dog chews, new toys

We never leave our dog for more than 4 hours. Never. Pre lockdown we'd make it work with a combination of home working and doggy daycare plus a relative having him one day a week.

He also needs a long walk every single day, regardless of the weather. I love my dog with all my heart, but it's not the cost of him or leaving him on his own that's the hardest. It's having to walk him every single day even when you can't be arsed or you're busy. So factor that commitment in.

Otherwise my Labrador is the most loving, affectionate, hilarious, most well behaved dog ever. They're big dogs but very easy to raise and live with. Super easy to train (they are fat bastards so will learn quickly where food is involved), brilliant at recall and off lead, great around other dogs and kids etc. His barks rattle the walls though they're that loud and he hates people ringing the doorbell on 'his' house. He must've been a GSD in a past life because he has a very strong intruder alarm sense.

No idea why people are getting so arsey with OP who is trying to find out and educate themself BEFORE embarking on possible ownership.

Google does not provide all answers to every question, and can provide a lot of untruths and, indeed, lies; so asking a forum of people is often better.

This happens a lot on MN: poster seeks to be educated on something so they can make an informed decision/ understand something better, but are shot down for not already knowing. Ridiculous.

OP I agree with others that all other questions are irrelevant if you’re out all day for 8 hours+. That’s not suitable for a dog. They need company as well as toileting.
As, when and if you do have the right circumstances to provide a home for a dog I’m sure you’ll be a great owner as you care enough to find out the necessary info in advance.

Please, just don't

Sadly, the dogs boards and MN in general are the worst places to ask for any advice about dogs. You'll find yourself wading through pages of crap about how you should never be a dog owner, if you have a dog you should give it to a better home, you're evil for even considering getting a dog and one has probably suffered somewhere because you even asked the question. In amongst that are some gems from experienced dog owners like the ones below, but they tend to get lost in the ether. You'll come away with some mental scarring. On the plus side though, you might be less afraid of dogs after getting bitten by humans

I have a deerhound/border collie cross. Agree with CooperLooper regarding costs. It is my first dog and I did a lot of research. Between us we took the first 3 weeks off work to settle him in. We took turns getting up regularly in the night to toilet train him as a puppy. For the first 18 months he was very bad with recall and we put a lot of effort into training him. Eventually, this paid off and he is a great dog and a big part of our family life. I work part-time and sometimes work at home. He goes to doggy daycare if no-one can be home all day. He isn't left for more than 2-3 hours and that is very infrequently. Think of the commitment like you would if having a child - of course I'm not saying it is the same - but needs lots of planning and long term input. I agree with what people say about borrow my doggy etc. You could also visit a shelter and consider fostering.

I don’t think a dog is for you op.

For starters leaving it alone 9-5 would just be unkind, dogs are too social. That is no life for a dog.

Even leaving a cat 5 days a week 9-5 isn’t ideal as some cats like a lot of company.

"but I think if you got a rescue dog that would otherwise be sitting in a kennel at a shelter then you could improve its quality of life even if you weren’t home 24/7. Dogs are expensive and a lot of work though, so just be prepared."

This was my favourite perspective. I don't have a dog, I have never owned one, but my partner and his father used to train them and owned many over the years. I understand that some dogs sit in shelters essentially waiting to die. I wouldn't expect any dog to be happier waiting in at home for 8+ hours than they would with constant attention, but conversely I could imagine a dog that has been sitting there for so long with no home, would love a warm place to live with a friendly face to look forward to seeing every day, food, treats and hugs. I don't understand why it's better to tell people not to even consider rehoming some of these animals. That's why I think it's best to ask the people at the shelter, who hopefully know the dogs and know what they would want for them in a new home.

Google does not provide all answers to every question, and can provide a lot of untruths and, indeed, lies; so asking a forum of people is often better.

Which is why I actually said “So some basic research, then ask for more nuanced advice. Not come to MN for a unanimous decision on ‘what dog should I get’.“

A friend of mine uses ‘borrow my dog’ and she and her husband spend every second Sunday with the same dog, which they really enjoy.

I have a Jack Russell who, prior to lockdown, was left from 9am to 2pm four days a week and he was fine. However our last neighbour had a beagle who would howl continuously from the second they left the house, so it varies wildly.

Leaving aside your point about it being left in the house, I know several people with greyhounds and all of them are chilled out, lazy lumps (the dogs, not my friends ). I love my little whirlwind but I sometimes wish I’d gone for a greyhound!

I'm stunned that the majority here believe it's actually better for a person not to ask these questions in the early stages of considering getting a pet

I think most people know you don't leave a dog alone from nine to five surely? I agree though that it should be mandatory to sit a (practical and theory) welfare and knowledge test before owning a dog though, a bit like a driving test.

To take the op at face value; op I suggest you need to overcome your fear before even considering becoming a dog owner. Dogs and horses tune in to their owner's emotional state, which basically means if you are fearful, they will be too. And fear can manifest in several ways in a dog, from very subtle fear signals (turning away, lip licking, yawning etc) to running away to growling and right through to full on attack. Suggest you volunteer at a shelter or volunteer for the Cinnamon trust and read a few books/look at some videos by the Dog Trust.

a stuffed toy version.

please don't. I have neighbours like you and I really, really hate them. And I'm sure their dog does too.

dog owner charter for 15 years:

• walked twice a day
• never left alone for more than a couple of hours
• all faeces picked up and carried until you reach a suitable bin or get home. If you don't like carrying bags of warm shit, don't get a dog.
• prepared to accept massive restrictions on where you can go and how long for
• needs to be on a lead on public roads at all times
• needs to be closely trained and controlled.
• house will reek and be covered in fur but that's your problem.

Get a cat?

@ItsLateHumpty

Google does not provide all answers to every question, and can provide a lot of untruths and, indeed, lies; so asking a forum of people is often better.

Which is why I actually said “So some basic research, then ask for more nuanced advice. Not come to MN for a unanimous decision on ‘what dog should I get’.“

I didn’t quote or name you, so I’ve no idea why you think I was referring to your comments specifically.

"I think most people know you don't leave a dog alone from nine to five surely?"

No.

I have a friend in a managerial role with two huskies, which are possibly the most demanding and moody dogs I've ever met. (Beautiful, though). She sometimes takes them to work with her. Sometimes, she leaves them at home. She works long hours. She has webcams, two way interactions set up, food dispensers, the works. She loves her dogs more than she loves her husband. If I had considered getting a dog based solely on my experience of knowing her, I would get a dog and leave him or her at home all day while I was at work. Thankfully, my own anxiety and empathy means I wouldn't be comfortable doing that without asking for more opinions first. I wouldn't want a husky. Perhaps huskies are better accustomed to long periods of time alone. I have no clue why some people here think potential dog owners should have an automatic knowledge of everything dog. Having a dog isn't a basic human requirement and it's not taught at school, so thank god for people asking beforehand. I hope people never stop asking. I hope the people with sarcastic, rude or hurtful remarks about people asking can bugger off and find a new hobby.