Just thinking, is ginger-bashing a form of 'shadism'?

[binkyboinky]

Like they have in India... ppl of the same 'race' prejudiced against others of a different "shade". Anti-ginger is white-people-shadism?

DP is ginger and we were talking about the US racism and he says he "gets" it bc he's ginger. Of course it's not the same thing. But Just occurred to me.

can't sleep..

Ginger is only used by the rascist Brits

Are people anti-ginger? Genuine question, not being shitty..
Other than light teasing (DH is ginger and has only ever been on the receiving end of friendly banter - I appreciate this may be different for others), what hardship or discrimination has your husband faced in his life based purely on his ginger-ness?

I think your dp is a knob for saying that. Is he going to get shot while he jogging?
Is A cop going to kneel on his neck until he is dead?
Is a cop going to burst into his house and shoot his mum in the back .. (that's a uk one folks)
Are teachers going to make assumptions about him..
Are police going to stop and search him on the flimsy est of pretexts?
On the basis of his hair colour ?

No he is safe in his white hetero male privilege.

@Destroyedpeople I agree. I said it's not the same thing. Yes he doesn't truly get it. Anti- gingerism is not systematic racism. At all. But Is it racism or shadism though? I'm rambling... soz for typos, haven't got my flasses on

But what is anti-ginerism? What hardship has he experienced? Who is against him?

Well ginger isn’t a race. It’s not really a shade either (Indian Shadism is really not that different to racism, dravidians tend to be darker than aryans. They’re ethnically different and there is an element of institutionalised oppression of the dravidians orchestrated by the invading aryans which over time has morphed into shadism). However anti-ginger sentiments similarly have roots in antisemitism and English prejudice against the Irish.

My brother was always horrible about and to ginger people, including giving other boys a kicking for it at school.

I haven't spoken to him for years, but had a look at his fb the other day.
He is now a proud parent to a ginger child...

No it isn't because it's not a genuine prejudice. He hasn't lost anything or been perceived in any negative way because of it. For example, if he interviewed for a job, can you genuinely imagine the interviewer thinking "well that guy seemed smart but he's a ginger, and you know what they are like, so let hire this brunette instead". Never happened.

Sorry tell him from me he is a knob and to do some reading up on the Atlantic slave trade and American history. Also he might look at 'why I am no longer talking to white people about race . Which is more about the UK.
Is he one of those men who really 'gets' feminism?

Also a lot of Brits seem to think that violent racism is an American thing when they need to look closer to home as well. Britain has had a massive role in the Atlantic slave trade but if you mention it to many brits their eyes glaze over and they start going on about William Wilberforce. Who was undoubtedly a good chap but is the only mention of Atlantic slavery in our school history books...
There is this kind of denial and 'othering' of racism..

(Sorry, my last post was in response to pp saying it's a racist brit thing/questioning if there genuinely are any issues. My brother also happens to be hugely racist).

The ginger hate is stupid prejudice based on pigmentation, sure. Not the same as what's going on in the US / systemic racism though.

God this isn’t a racist thing or even closely related. Kids get picked on for being ginger, having freckles, having facial hair. Most of these insults die away when people reach maturity. I’m not saying kids bullying others is right, but it doesn’t compare to racism

Nobody is being denied any privileges due to their hair being ginger. Somebody being a dick to a ginger person is just being a dick.

India's caste system, which I think you're referring to, is (AFIAK) a derplg ingrained class system. Hair colour is not a factor in class and not comparable.

Trying to create an -ism for yourself based on such petty things is a bit crass imo, especially when thinking about recent events.

Its slightly amazing how thinking about them could spur some people to say, 'BUT how are people racist towards white people?'

Deeply, not derplg...

I'm a redhead. I don't like the term ginger - perhaps because of the negativity associated with it. I was bullied quite badly as a child and I still get random strangers shouting insults at me in the street from time to time, but on balance, I have probably had more positive comments about my appearance over my lifetime than I have negative.
I don't know where anti ginger prejudice comes from, but it has crossed my mind that there could be a racial element because of the association with Celtic people. For instance I live in an area where historically there were a lot of Irish immigrants, and most of the red haired people around here are likely to be descended from them. So maybe anti ginger sentiments around here began as anti Irish prejudice, but I doubt the teenagers yelling insults at me think about that now, its just because red hair is "different". Is there as much teasing of redheads in Scotland, Ireland and other countries where it is more commonplace? I would guess not, but don't really know.
Obviously it is unacceptable and it can be very serious, with bullying leading to tragic outcomes in some cases, but I don't anti ginger prejudice is comparable to racism. My hair colour has caused individuals or groups of people to pick on me, but it hasn't interfered with my education, my career prospects, my standing in society in general and it certainly hasn't put me at risk of police brutality. It is not ingrained in society like racism is. In my experience, anti gingerism is mainly kids picking on someone who is different, these days fuelled by internet memes etc. Plus some adults- mostly generally unpleasant and not terribly bright adults if my experience is typical - don't seem to grow out of this stupid prejudice. It is unpleasant, but rarely has a serious impact. "The system" isn't anti ginger though, but it is deeply racist.

If you look more deeply at why red hair is viewed negatively by some people, there is a racist core to it. In the middle ages, red hair was associated with Jewish people. Traditionally Judas Iscariot was painted with red hair to link red hair with being a traitor.

I agree with MrsAvocet about anti Irish and anti Scottish sentiments sometimes being expressed through negative comments about red hair. Of course I am not saying that when people make rude comments about red hair, everyone knows the historical background but red hair can be associated with 'otherness' and being different.

For what it's worth, I took OP's husband's comments as trying to empathise with the dreadful situation in Minneapolis and the death of George Floyd, not that he was equating the multiple examples of police brutality to African American citizens and all the other terrible legacies of slavery with a few mean comments about the colour of his hair.

is Tim Minchin's take on the subject!

It is a peculiarly british trait.

Ive had abuse shouted at me on the street and had total strangers ask what colour pubes I have. Constant teasing at school which culminated in me punching another girl because she wouldnt stop. Oh and that was in sixth form where you would think we were too grown up for that. Kick a ginger day.

But I havent been followed by security in shops, been targetted by police, denied jobs and systematically disenfranchised.

I would say that we experience low prejudice, with roots in racism, but its not the same as what ethnic minorities experience and to say otherwise is frankly insulting.

Id recommend he reads why Im no longer talking to white people about race.

It is not a 'peculiarly British trait ' I can assure you.

What nettie said is way closer to the truth than any 'anti celtic' nonsense. You will find negative comments about red hair v common in Poland for example.

As a ginger family I can honestly say we've never encountered any "shadeism". People often ask if my hair colour is natural and that's about it

@Destroyedpeople Ive only ever experienced it in the Uk. But Ive never been to Poland. Lots of other countries though.

Yes it's definitely a thing there....

Anyway ...in these 'lots of other countries' how do you know they're not being rude about your hair colour? Genuinely curious ...unless you are multi lingual?

It’s an anti Irish thing. So yes it is racist, in the sense it’s an expression of systemic oppression and denigration of the Irish. But you can’t compare currently getting ribbed for being ginger to the violent destruction of black bodies by the state.

It's more of an anti Jewish thing than an anti Irish thing.there are redheads all over the British Isles esp in coastal areas due to the vI king invasion.