What's fair? Team of working mums and annual leave in school holidays

[Lovingmylife]

I started a new role not so long ago and we are all working mums. Most with school age children, two with babies/preschool and two with older teenagers.

Our manager has told us that too many of us want Easter holidays/May half term and so it's causing a bit of a hoohaa.

Manager has said she will do first come first served unless we come up with a better solution.

Ummm where I worked everyone puts in holiday requests in November for holidays till September. Then it was by date received and seniority.

What about those without children? Are they just supposed to suck it up and not get an opportunity to take leave at Easter or Summer?

Do men fuck about like this at work? No, probably not.

A lot of the men (and women) in DH's department have school aged children and/or a teaching partner. They try to work it out between them and have a minimum number of staff they must be around each day, so try not to go beyond that. But it can be tricky in some situations.

First come first served is unfair tbh, there's always someone that takes what they want while everyone else is discussing it. There isn't really a fair way to do it really, especially in the summer when those without children want leave to, and should be equally entitled to it.

The school holidays are initially reserved for anyone with school age children, then opened up to anyone at the end of January.

Shit management.

First come first served everywhere I have worked. Just because you don't have kids doesn't mean you don't want (even need) school hols either. We allowed couples getting married to get first preference last time I worked in a big place, ever since I've been the only one with kids thankfully

Aragog
I know that. In hindsight I should have clarified what I meant as it wasn't clear.

I dislike it when, for example, those without children are expected to never have holiday in August / find it impossible to get time around Christmas because all the parents think they should have priority.

What I meant is that I wouldn't be expecting those who don't have school aged children to be part of the school holiday scramble to get every half term etc off because it wouldn't make sense for those not tied by school holidays to holiday at the most expensive times.

First come first served is very unfair, esp. at this point.
presuming everyone is around to participate, and only the 2 periods to sort out (Easter & May half term)

Lottery system
First person drawn gets their first preference.
2nd person drawn gets their first preference unless it's unavailable (then they get 2nd preference)
& so on until all employee absence slots are full.

Totally agree Semperldem !

Unfortunately for me I have two dc, so for now have to be in the pot with the rest of the people in my department who need leave in school holidays. My department is shrinking so it's getting worse and worse for over subscribed leave at peak times. I recently adjusted my working pattern to alleviate the strain of 6weeks summer leave stress.

Can't wait till my children are older so I can holiday at quieter times of the year!!

Yes Haggar

That happened to my dh. Same person always getting in there first for Christmas then going sick if they were unable to get the leave😕

We operate 1st come basis. but perhaps a team meeting to discuss and see if a compromise can be met ie if you have time off at Easter you cant have 1st pick of May half term off.

Pick names from hat to set order of requests. Eg Julie first out the hat, her first request is Easter week1, pam is next and wants Feb half term, sue is next and wanted Easter week 1 but takes Easter week 2 instead. Back to Julie who wants summer weeks 2&3. Pam agreed to summer 4&5, sue is a bit pissed off she missed the best summer weeks so she chooses the best Christmas week and round and round till all allocated.

1st come 1st served is the least fair was to do it imo.

We are allowed 3 weeks of school holiday overall so it means all staff (large employer, mainly female) get fair allocation.

I work in a team which supports other teams in the office, except they also ask some of my team to cover other teams' holidays.

We have a new policy of "taking into account the firm's needs as a whole" when booking A/L. Which I get but it's really fucking annoying.

The person who comes up with a solution to this eternal problem should be nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize!

Managers who say 'first come, first served' are just taking the easy way out - for themselves. And I say that as a manager.

My old team generally did very busy periods on a lottery basis but with a bit of manual trickery and discussion to try and make sure that everyone got as many of their requested days as possible. It worked well and there were no complaints that I’m aware of despite being a big team with multiple managers.

In my current team it’s just not really an issue as we can plan workloads around holidays, I’ve never known anyone to be declined their holiday request.

I actively volunteered to do Xmas eve & NYE last year... and the days inbetween (mostly). I truly didn't mind (aren't I lovely :) ).

I'm a manager and if there are a number of people wanting time off I would probably ask them what they wanted the leave for. I would probably prioritise those who had actual plans rather than those who were wanting the time for childcare at home, unless they had absolutely no other arrangements they can make. Usually my team are mature enough to sort it out amongst themselves though. If they really can't do that and all wanted the time for the same reasons, then it would be first come first served, unless there were good reasons that they needed those dates. For example, My DP is an NHS worker and annual leave at peak times is like gold dust. If he is lucky enough to get it then if I don't get the same dates then we can't go away. He can't easily find another date. It's things like that that need to be taken into account.

We negotiate between ourselves so everyone gets as fair a 'share' of the most wanted leave periods as possible.

I strongly object to giving those with school age children priority for half term weeks & Easter. Why shouldn't I be able to take those dates off with the bank holidays thrown in? I work in a tightly scheduled environment. We are asked for our preferred dates 18 months to 2 years in advance. Everyone is allowed 2 weeks of guaranteed time off and the rest are all9cated after everyone has their first choice. If someone tried to book each half term & Easter, the dates would be shared out equally.

I think alternating is much fairer as the same people always rush to book all the dates they want and p/t workers may not get a look in. There's so many weeks the kids are off.

We have "first come etc" but we can book one year ahead from the 1st of each month. It is also all done online and can be accessed from home - therefore everyone has the same chance.

We don't have anyone with young kids, but christmas and new year is a minefield. We have two related staff members who have never worked christmas and new year in 8 years. I have only had one christmas off and that was due to illness. I have booked next christmas off as we can do it online up to a year in advance. Don't know what will happen as we are usually only allowed two lower level staff off at the same time. Shouldn't have to be this sneaky but resentment creeps in.

The school holidays are initially reserved for anyone with school age children, then opened up to anyone at the end of January.

That is outrageous, I can't believe workplaces can get away with this, and that managers find it acceptable.

The problem with first come first served is someone in my office takes a laptop home and books it at 1 minute past midnight the year before just to get it in before anyone else. It gets really stupid.