Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Chat

Join the discussion and chat with other Mumsnetters about everyday life, relationships and parenting.

Original poster

Homelessness and alcoholism

66 replies

vivacian · 11/01/2020 10:29

There's a man sleeping rough at the top of our street, refusing assistance from any services because he wants to drink. When he's fairly sober he's fairly civil (I chat to him). When he's in his cups he's aggressive.

My approach with beggars is to give them my time, but nothing else such as money or clothes that will prolong their time on the streets. With this guy, I struggle. I am tempted to buy him socks and gloves despite knowing that anything he is given that he can sell, he sells.

But it got me thinking. Some homeless people just want to drink. Would it better to house and feed them, give them access to showers, toilets and health care and accept that they are going to drink themselves to their deaths?

OP posts:
Nannewnannew · 11/01/2020 11:04

AmazingGreats well said, if only the Government would acknowledge the very great problem we have with alcoholism in the U.K.

mrscatmad31 · 11/01/2020 11:07

My own brother is homeless and an alcoholic, he has had or been offered so much help over the years. He doesn't speak to me if he sees me (we haven't fallen out) because I don't give him money and never have done (I don't have much to spare anyway) nothing I or anyone else can give him would help, he needs to realise he has a problem and needs to stop drinking which I don't think would ever happen unfortunately

AmazingGreats · 11/01/2020 11:14

@WorraLiberty

We don't have anywhere like that locally just church run winter night shelters

Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:16

In my area (not sure how it is everywhere else) alcoholics are not eligible for mental health support until they have stopped drinking.

Same here.

The hostel situation is unclear here. People refuse to go in to them on the grounds that they are all dry. Others refuse to go in to them on the basis that they are riddled drink and drugs.

For the record, I have never bought him anything. If you ask what he wants or needs all he wants is 80p for a cup of tea (and no, he doesn't want a cup of tea).

OP posts:
WorraLiberty · 11/01/2020 11:17

AmazingGreats, not everywhere does have them. Most of the ones here are run by the local council.

But the point is, they don't turn people away (and ime nor do the church run shelters) simply because the street sleeper is addicted to alcohol or drugs.

If the alcohol, drugs, mental health issues etc are causing them to be violent or aggressive, then that's a different matter.

Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:18

The hostel situation is unclear here. People refuse to go in to them on the grounds that they are all dry. Others refuse to go in to them on the basis that they are riddled drink and drugs.

That's unclear of me too. People who would rather drink won't use the hostels because a condition of using them is no drink or drugs. Others who are interviewed in the local press about why they are on the streets and begging explain it's because they don't want to be around drink and drugs in the hostel. The charities say that this is wrong, it's just that they'd rather be on the streets feeding their habits.

OP posts:
WorraLiberty · 11/01/2020 11:20

OP if there are places available in shelters/hostels, the majority of them won't turn him away simply because he's an alcoholic (not sure about 'dry' shelters as I've never heard of them).

They'll turn him away though if he displays any of the harassing behaviour you mentioned in your opening post.

Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:22

@mrscatmad31I'm so sorry to hear your story. It was an interview on Richard and Judy about 25 years ago that formed my opinion of not giving anything other than your time. They were interviewing a dad who was pleading with viewers not to give money to people begging. He said the hardest thing was accepting his child's alcoholism and waiting for them to "hit rock bottom" and then realising that complete strangers were giving money and prolonging the agony.

OP posts:
Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:25

@WorraLiberty I'll take your word for it. I don't have first hand experience of working with such charities, just that of a friend who does.
I'm sorry for inadvertently spreading false stories that hostels don't allow alcohol on the premises.

Either way, there are places and some people refuse them.

OP posts:
Coughy4u · 11/01/2020 11:29

I mean, if.i was homeless its tempting to want to escape and numb it all. Im not sure what the value or point of talking, all they want is money for booze and drugs.
There is so much help out there but its only if he wants to help himself. There really is no reason to sleep on the streets in the UK.
You can take the horse to water but yoi cant make it drink. Stop interfering and give your resources to those who want them.

WorraLiberty · 11/01/2020 11:33

No need to apologise OP. I expect a lot of people may think the same.

But sadly alcohol and drugs often go hand in hand with street sleeping. There are many different complicated reasons for that.

Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:33

Stop interfering

Who is interfering?

OP posts:
Inappropriatefemale · 11/01/2020 11:34

As bad as it is that he is an alcoholic and homeless (is he really homeless or does he just beg, the majority of beggars in Edinburgh pretend to be homeless but they’re not really and just want drug/drink money) then he will spend his money on whatever he wants and you can’t blame him really.

The alcohol is probably all he has to look forward to, it’s easy to judge but imagine being homeless then drugs or drink would temporarily make you feel better and an addict can only stop when they want to, not when someone else wants them to.

I feel that we have to accept that they will drink themselves to death, it’s nice that you want to help him but if he doesn’t want it then what can you do.

Be careful with him in that you don’t ‘annoy’ him into getting help iyswim?

Inappropriatefemale · 11/01/2020 11:36

I once lived in a B&B when I was homeless and the last who worked there on her own didn’t like when we guests came in drunk, there was plenty of us that smoked weed and she was okay with that but she had a real fear of drinkers and she liked a drink herself.

Inappropriatefemale · 11/01/2020 11:37

Lady not last

Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:42

No need to apologise OP. I expect a lot of people may think the same.

Actually @WorraLiberty it makes this thread pointless. If there's already hostels for drinkers, then introducing hostels for drinkers wouldn't help address the problem of drinkers living rough.

OP posts:
Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:44

As bad as it is that he is an alcoholic and homeless (is he really homeless or does he just beg, the majority of beggars in Edinburgh pretend to be homeless but they’re not really and just want drug/drink money) then he will spend his money on whatever he wants and you can’t blame him really.

Yes, he really is (and therefore one of the minority - our local person begging was given a brand new flat and still commuted back to our area to beg). I don't blame him for spending his money on drink, I just choose not to give him that money.

OP posts:
Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:45

an addict can only stop when they want to, not when someone else wants them to.

I know. That's literally the premise of the thread Confused

OP posts:
WorraLiberty · 11/01/2020 11:46

Some of the hostels around here are terrifying though. Even the drinkers are scared of the other (more aggressive/violent) drinkers, so end up sleeping on the streets because they actually feel safer Sad

It's not uncommon for them to have what little possessions they have, stolen while they sleep.

UYScuti · 11/01/2020 11:48

What should we do with people who are in so much mental pain that they can't function without continual anaesthetic?

Original poster
vivacian · 11/01/2020 11:51

Sad what do you think is the answer @WorraLiberty? How can we provide a safe night's sleep for everyone?

OP posts:
UYScuti · 11/01/2020 11:52

That people are allowed to fall into homelessness at all is a tragedy
without a place to call home you are not fully human and once you have gotten to a place where you feel you are not fully human it is very difficult to get back into society

WorraLiberty · 11/01/2020 11:58

what do you think is the answer @WorraLiberty? How can we provide a safe night's sleep for everyone?

We can't because there simply isn't the money to provide so many single, secure units or enough services to help people.

That's the sad truth.

There are single secure units here but they're normally given to young homeless people with children to look after and even those are few and far between.

Nanna50 · 11/01/2020 12:09

@Coughy4u
There really is no reason to sleep on the streets in the UK.

There are many reasons. Can you explain why there is no reason?

Inappropriatefemale · 11/01/2020 12:11

I think the PP means that there is always hostels willing to take you in and the council would find you somewhere and so why sleep on streets.