How can we help DD learn to annoy people less

[Belleende]

We have DD1 aged 4. She is a bundle of energy. Doesn't stop from when she gets up until she goes to sleep. She is funny, curious and has an indomitable spirit that I hope will serve her well. I love the bones off her.

However, she can be really annoying. I know all 4 year olds can be a pain in the arse, but she just gets in people's faces constantly, and doesn't learn when they react accordingly. I worry it will affect her ability to make and keep friends.

If one of us is just sitting having a cuppa, she will be poking and prodding at us. If she sits on our lap, she will always do something like smush her face right into mine, or try and stick her fingers in my mouth, or climb all over me.

Every time she does this, I lift her off and explain I don't like it and why. On the rare occasions she is less irritating I always recognise it and tell her that I am really enjoying it and why. We have been doing this consistently for months but she just doesn't seem to get it. Her two year old sister has more cop on.

We have used some of the techniques in how to talk so little kids listen. These worked really well for things like settling disputes, or getting her to go to bed, brush teeth etc, but had zero impact on her being annoying.

I now feel like I am just telling her she is annoying all the time, which I don't think is helping or working or fair, but I don't know how to help her. It is exhausting. Any tips for relentlessly energetic 4 year olds with low personal boundaries?

Get firm. No need to be awful, but be firm. Ramp up the whole, wow, this is lovely, well done, great sitting type of thing, but be very firm about the stuff you don't like. Some kids need to learn the tougher way I'm afraid.

She sounds great though, I reckon this is just something to be tackled.

She sounds like she craves attention. I’d focus on giving her attention/spending quality time before she gets annoying. I’d also teach her what to do/say when she wants to play with you so she can get your attention in a normal rather than obnoxious way. Finally, if you just want to read a book with a cup of tea, I’d tell her that she needs to play on her own as you’re reading a book + promise when you’re going to do something together, eg after lunch.

My daughter does this at meal times. I moved to sit away from her. She learnt pretty quickly to rein it in.

Look up sensory seeking. Some kids have more of a need for touch and tactile playing. You can help by creating other ways for her to get sensory input like fiddle toys, stress balls, wrapping her up tightly.

If you don’t think sensory seeking fits then it’s probably her trying to get attention - are you on your phone when she does this by any chance?

Just sit her beside you say things like mummy doesn't like when you do that and anticipate when she is going to be a bit in your facey, distract her. It sounds like she just enjoys the attention and gets over excited.

Well the good thing is you aren't defending her when others find her annoying. That's will help her in the long term.

Agree with sensory seeking and activities for this. Maybe buy her her own mini sofa or something or bean bag and make it clear everyone has and wants their own space.

I have one of these! She’s 8 and still pretty annoying. You just have the be firm, and consistent, and as other posters have said, give lots of affection in appropriate ways to model the behaviour.

I think limiting her sitting on your lap might calm her avlittle bit compliment her "nice sitting" and yes get her something to fiddle with keep her hands occupied.

They grow out of it. When she's a teen she won't even speak to you. Kids are annoying.

Thanks for the input all. There is definitely something sensory going on. Despite being noiser than a pneumatic drill at times she is really noise sensitive.

She also can't figure out when she feels strange. She can't tell you she feels I'll or is in pain until she pukes on the floor. Have been doing yoga with her which she loves. Maybe creating her own space in our shared space will be beneficial. Not sure I can wait til she is 12 for her to become a bit more civilized.

At this age I think all kids have come with their own brand of annoying. Some are highly strung, some are whingers, some are really inflexible and some just happen to be really in your face and have no sense of personal boundaries. She is a little cracker tho, it's a shame other people get to see the annoying her more than the amazing her.

Im sure people don't find her annoying she is just a little girl. is she at nursery ? Ask them for some help if need be always look for support where you can. Setting her a boundry is great all children look for them you can set them gently for her and try and not see her as to much of a pain or your mindset will be she is a pain.

Oh and try and not explain to much to her she will tune you out if you are using to many words and if she does have sensory issues she might not be able to process what you are asking of her so keep it short and clear.

We have used some of the techniques in how to talk so little kids listen. These worked really well for things like settling disputes, or getting her to go to bed, brush teeth etc, but had zero impact on her being annoying.

That's ^^ good but don't forget, it's perfectly ok to show your annoyance if you're actually annoyed.

Talks about feelings and things do have their place but sometimes you can swing the pendulum too far and it can get a bit 'robotic' for want of a better word.

Let her see your annoyed face and she'll soon cop on.

worraliberty have done all that and for all other issues with pretty good success, but she really hasn't progressed at all in terms of respecting personal boundaries. I reinforce mine religiously. I tell her exactly how she makes me feel. I have a chair of peace and serenity, when I am sitting there she can only approach me calmly and gently. She might remember one in every 4 approaches, and even then after 30s she is poking me in the eye.

Her peers tell her in no uncertain terms when she is bugging them, but she doesn't seem to be able to adapt, she just keeps going. Every other challenge, with some help she has learned and adapted, just not this. If anything she is getting worse as she is bigger now, so having her clamber over you is less and less fun.

I think we just keep going, but I do have to tell her she is being annoying less. Not a nice label

Not saying she is but my 22 yearold has developmental cordination disorder (dyspraxia) and she was like this . Speak to her nursery/school in the new year maybe get some investigations done

If you just tell her that her friends sometimes like to play quietly she might remember.

My son is still like this aged 12 and he is high functioning ASD. He has always craved attention and will not back off even when you tell him to. Ignoring seems to work best with his annoying behaviour and praise etc when he is on his best behaviour.

I'd focus on trying to provide other sensory distractions like pieces of fabric of different textures sewn together so that she can fiddle, possibly some sort of music player that she can listen to with head phones, get the ball in the cup type games etc.

If you can help her get her anxiety levels down and give her something else to interact with, her behaviour will hopefully follow suit.

I think you're doing lots of things right here OP and you sound like a really switched-on parent.

I wonder if you have a strategy for when you see other people? Are you setting that up for success? So for example, I'd only really see friends, family members outside where there's room to run and roam. That gives you a better chance of re-directing the behaviour (DD, instead of poking me, why don't you and small cousin run off over there and see who can find me four different kinds of leaves) rather than seeing others in a confined indoor space, if you know what I mean?

They are very wise words Lonny she is definitely a creature of the wild outdoors. Doesn't work when your elderly parents are visiting and it is pissing down.

She is being absolutely adorable today. Reckon she knows I am moaning about her on Mumsnet

She sounds like a sensory seeker. Google it and you'll find strategies to deal with it.

My 11yo is still like this. It's so wearing. I'm afraid I do tell him to stop being annoying and then feel terrible because he has absorbed the label which is the last thing I wanted. He has ADHD and I agree with the sensory thing. I have managed to identify (finally) that when he's in this sort of manic state he's actually disregulated, which is what leads him to be hyper and seek sensory input/any kind of attention. But I am then stuck as to what to do about it. My next task is to help him identify things which help him self regulate, and any activities which specifically lead to this disregulation feeling. Minimise the latter (as far as possible) and try to find a better word to describe the state he's in so he can recognise it for himself and help him apply the things that help. Obviously for a 4yo you'd do the recognising and redirecting.

Get a copy of the book too fast, too bright too loud, too tight. That should be useful. You've just reminded me I should reread mine!

Social stories may work. You can write one yourself.

Lots of repetition. She does sound like she may have an element of neurodiversity such as ADHD or dyspraxia or mild ASD. The lack of social imagination (ie, the ability to think what someone else might be thinking) is possibly there. You have to be bigger, more direct in your reactions until they get it. Subtlety and being too wordy about stuff doesn't work.

My 7 year can be a bit like this. He has ASD. Things that help so far are fidget toys, stretchy bands and magic putty, plus lots of deep pressure touch and physical games like pillow fights. Seems to fill up his intensity tank.

I think you should try to be firmer and focus on her being "polite", not annoying. Annoying is a very negative word, where as being polite is positive.