I'm not racist but...

[MIdgebabe]

I guess most people accept that the statement "I am not racist but " usually comes before a very racist remark.

But I have noticed another phrase common on here

"I'm not racist, I just don't like "

Why is it similar? Because you can't really know why you don't like someone. You may think it's a rational dislike, but all the evidence is that it's actually an unconscious decision on top of which you add rationality.

All the evidence? Because BAME people know they are more likely to be disliked / police searched / lose out at interviews than white people. Because we know that people who are chosen in blind tests are not chosen if the tests are not blind, no matter how unbiased the people doing the choosing think they are.

It's really difficult, and it is hard / daft to attribute to individuals a behaviour that emerges from people on average. And most people want and try to be non-racist

But when a BAME person suspects that racism underlies something, denying that , which happens on here, or claiming "not me" seems a very racist thing to do.

😳

Nicola1892 - yet I've met some lovely Muslim men over the years. I dated a Muslim man for 6 months and he had lovely friends. The relationship only failed as it was long distance which didn't work for us at the start of a relationship. You can't make judgements on an entire portion of a society based on a few. That's what racism, sexism, elitism, homophobia etc is.

There are just as many white men /Christians who sexually assault, harass and threaten women as any other ethnicity or any other religion.
I don't agree that bad people give a minority of people a bad name. Bad people give bad people a bad name.

@Nicola1892 - I had the same experience with white Irish men (lived in Digbeth as a student back when prostitution was rife there - ‘exotic’ Indian teens living by themselves were often top of their target tree). But I don’t hate all Irish or white men. What a narrow minded racist view you hold

The core issue with this ‘I’m not racist but...’ seems to be that people aren’t prepared to won and explore and change their racist thoughts and behaviours. It is seen as a taboo so of course they won’t admit that, like most the world, we are born into sets of cultural beliefs which are inherently racist by nature.

We need to feel we can admit this and start really changing our personal/family/community cultures to eliminate the racist stuff which lies beneath the surface.

Denying it’s there does no good to anyone.

‘Own and explore’ not won- sorry

The two most unpleasant people I've ever met in my life were Chinese. But I don't dislike Chinese people as a result! I just hate they two pricks.

Nobody ever says this about white people! Nobody ever says 'oh a white man mugged me so I dislike all white men.' But if that man were black.....🤷🏻‍♀️

It’s surely racist (and you know it) if you need to precede any comment with I’m not racist but/ it’s not racism but I don’t like...

Muslim men are not a homogeneous group anymore than agnostic men, Jewish women, Catholic children or Anglican lesbians. They are unique individuals.

I’ve worked with and met some lovely Muslim men but as I whole I now stay away from them, if that makes me racist then fine. And yes I’ve have been called names because I’m a white women etc I wouldn’t shout abuse at someone or not speak to them because of there race/religion but would I move to Bradford..... no

I live in a town with a large Muslim population, feral youths (majority white) are the biggest scourge on the town. Horrible you stereotype like that Nicola.

@Nicola1892 Islam isn’t a race so I don’t see how that’s relevant.

This thread will not go well

A fairly common phrase I hear at work after a colleague has expressed racist, nationalist views etc is “oh, but you’re alright”. Which they seem to think excuses their hate crime.

It’s not that simple. There are large grey areas.
Try these statements
“I’m not racist against Middle Eastern people, but I don’t like FGM.”
“I’m not racist against Jews, but I disagree with circumcision of male babies”
“Im not racist about the Muslim religion, but I think polygamy is harmful to women”
“I’m not racist about the Christian religion, but I think marriage is deeply anti-feminist.”

@Nicola1892 you are certainly entitled to your opinion. Especially if the experiences were that bad for you.

I had a similar conversation “It’s not racism to expect a hospital doctor to be able to communicate with you and have an understanding of your society”. 2 hours later I felt satisfied that I had explained that yes that is racism to assume the Muslim/Asian/foreign dr won’t be able to find common ground. By using examples like the very able oxford educated plum in mouth consultant who couldn’t understand my grandad (piss poor miner) said but we worship the ground he walked on. Taken to hospital in Vietnam i communicated in terrible french with a dr who made me feel safe and succour with a bit or pointing and handholding. I do think racism is inherit and has to be consciously overcome - like sexism pretending it doesn’t exist doesn’t make it not exist.

Except those things aren't exclusive to the examples you gave DoctorAllcome.

I am half Asian (Malaysian mother) and people who would never utter a word against black or Indian people etc think it’s ok to make comments about the Chinese!

‘A bit Chinky’ used to describe eye shape of one of my children when they were small, for example!

To the Muslim men bashers - you lead very sheltered lives, clearly. I’ve travelled the world to countries of different faiths and I haven’t come across single man who behaved as you describe. That isn’t my experience of living in London - one of the most ethically diverse cities on the planet. Pricks come in all guises but your narrow mind should prevent you from seeing the bigger picture. I am sure there are men who are rapists who happen to be Pakistani/Nigerian/ Indian/ etc and Muslim. What makes you think their religion is the definition by factor to your harassment? Would you think the same of a white convert? Would they suddenly turn into rapists? No - thought not. You are a racist.

@Moominfan
You make a good point. For you and Nicola1982, your dislike of Muslim men is not racism but prejudice.

Racism is a firmly engrained belief that one race is superior or inferior to another race.

Prejudice is when you pre-judge a member of a race/group based on prior experience with a member of the same race/group. Because your prior experience was one of trauma, your wariness is prejudice not racism.y

I think there is a difference between discussing cultural differences, such as FGM, and making an assumption about all people of a particular race ( or more likely skin colour) because of that practise.

It would be good to be able to focus on the issues and accept that people brought up in a different culture may think it's ok/normal , and accept that not all people brought up in that culture agree with it , and realise that most BAME people in Britain today are brought up with British culture

What makes you think their religion is the definition by factor to your harassment? Would you think the same of a white convert? Would they suddenly turn into rapists? No - thought not. You are a racist.

Wasn't a white convert that raped me it was several Muslim men. I'm assuming Pakistani origin.