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DLA to pip

101 replies

Graphista · 18/09/2019 14:58

Currently managing this change. Have support from advisors but I'm a bit worried that their advice seems contrary to what I'm finding online and which some kind mners have given.

Ideally I'd like to see a sample of a COMPLETED form to get an idea of how much info is expected and what info/how things are worded but I'm really struggling to find one online.

Can anyone help/advise?

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backaftera2yearbreak · 18/09/2019 20:03

What your looking to do is show if you can do something safely, repeatedly, in a reasonable amount of time. Do you need to be encouraged to do it, do you need assistance, do you need supervision to keep you safe? What dangers, if any do the tasks pose to you?

tierraJ · 18/09/2019 20:13

You can phone the DWP & get an extension if you can't complete the form in time, I had a two week extension.

baldpate · 18/09/2019 20:16

@flyingarcher you can do it Flowers we were the same - once you’re discharged from the paeds you see no one so have no up to date info, the only current things we had were physio and drs notes and his school statement which is sketchy at best :( so I sent everything from dla too. The assessment was awful and scored 0 points. Mandatory reconsideration was no better but we kept going and got the decision overturned at appeal. It’s a horrible system designed I’m sure to make people give up. Sending good vibes your way

Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:18

I'm kinda following the rethink guide to write amendments to the form advisor has already done and I hope she doesn't take offence and will add these notes

But I am remembering when I did my last application (DLA - admittedly several years ago now) and I am remembering the first advisor I had and the advisors I had after them back then and they seemed...

Much more on the ball? Prompting me to add more and more detail, to include where conditions other than my main reason for claiming affected the things they were asking about.

Ok, feeling a bit guilty for thinking this but...is it possible they are hoping it becomes necessary to appeal and then they do the appeal and that's successful and gets them more funding? I mean I know I can be very cynical and I try not to be but there's just something...off?

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:20

RabidRabbles - my concern with your suggestion is that it goes against all the advice I've previously been given and read online about "don't include best days info" because dwp have a tendency to jump on that and say " well you CAN do X so you don't get the days you can't taken into account"

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:20

I would avoid “better” and “bad” days instead write “ the majority of the time” and then describe the issues you have on your “bad day”.

I tend to agree

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:24

"Can you physically convey food to your mouth, chew and swallow?" Physically yes. Mentally I worry about food poisoning, did I unwrap the packaging "safely", am I going to choke if I take a bigger bite

"Can you cut up your own food?" Physically yes, mentally don't trust myself totally with sharp knives at the moment

"Do you need someone to be with you to keep try and safe when you eat?" I only eat when dd home in case something "goes wrong"

"Do you lack the motivation to eat? Do you need to be encouraged to eat?" Definitely, I don't feel/notice hunger pangs or thirst triggers, I lose track of time, I lack motivation and energy and the rituals involved are exhausting and offputting.

That's me about to eat now after dds said "have you eaten today yet?"

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:24

@monkeytennis97 jump on! I hope the posts are of help to you

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backaftera2yearbreak · 18/09/2019 20:25

So you have family who remind you to eat? Would you eat otherwise?

Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:26

Also you need evidence from those involved in your care like clinic letters & care plans etc

I'm REALLY stuck for this as I barely see my GP (who is lovely but extremely popular and so very busy)

And because of mental health teams cock up I don't have a keyworker at the moment and haven't even been able to give a name on the form - even after directly ASKING them for a name! Whole other saga but means timing couldn't be bloody worse!

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backaftera2yearbreak · 18/09/2019 20:26

Do the rituals you have interfere with your ability to eat?

10brokengreenbottles · 18/09/2019 20:27

A friend was advised the more detailed the better, especially if there is a chance they may do a paper based assessment on you.

My friend used this guide

Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:27

@Flyingarcher I'm so sorry you're having to go through this too - and yes where it's conditions that there are no treatments for but which will never improve its incredibly hard to know what to put in terms of evidence!

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:32

What your looking to do is show if you can do something safely, repeatedly, in a reasonable amount of time.

Safely - what I consider unsafe most others would consider safe. Except the stuff relating to my physical condition but it's mainly the mental health at issue

Repeatedly - my whole life is repeating! I have "a number" which is how many times I must do a ritual, if I am interrupted I have to start all over again - can't just repeat the 2nd repeat

Reasonable amount of time - nothing I do happens in a reasonable amount of time. Takes me about half hour to be able to stand from seated, can take hours to get up courage to leave room though. Going to the toilet takes about an hour. Doing anything stressful that would take others maybe an hour or two takes me a full day

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:35

"So you have family who remind you to eat? Would you eat otherwise?"

Hard to say. I have to eat with one of my meds and I have Alarms set to remind me to take them but I'd probably just have a couple biscuits if dd wasn't prompting me to have something more

"Do the rituals you have interfere with your ability to eat?"
Yes I'm extremely nervous about food and food hygiene and eating "safely"

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 20:35

@10brokengreenbottles thanks for that I'll have a look

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curlykaren · 18/09/2019 20:37

Graphista, I'm totally understanding of your reticence to use CAB, I've had fucking abysmal advice off them in the past and my PIP award actually went up on review when I did the form without them. I had a very productive assessment today at a local pain management clinic and have been given some website details that deal with this exact issue. I can't get myself off the bed at the moment but if you send me a PM I will reply with the website details later. All the best x x

Graphista · 18/09/2019 21:05

@curlykaren bless you I hope you are feeling much better soon. Thanks but please don't cause yourself any difficulties on my behalf!

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Graphista · 18/09/2019 21:34

Wow! Just reading the rethink guidelines and it says people with MH conditions don't normally get points for toilet issues! It's the main thing I have difficulty with and from talking with other sufferers this is really common!

I don't think it's rethink believing that to be the case I think it's a comment on dwp attitudes

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backaftera2yearbreak · 18/09/2019 21:40

It depends what your toilet issues are. Do you need physical assistance to get on and off the toilet? Do you have an “involuntary evacuation of your bladder or bowel?” If you have OCD does going to the toilet take longer than someone without ocd because you have to do the same thing every time. If you don’t do the same thing does it cause you distress?

NotaRealLawyer · 18/09/2019 21:52

Graphista
Definitely use the Benefits and Work website. There is a fee as it is self funding, but well worth it. They go through each question and how to respond, it is excellent. Also a forum there to ask specific questions.
It's a dreadful form to fill in. Benefits and Work site goes through the pitfalls and how to answer.

Timandra · 18/09/2019 22:56

The evidence can be you explaining something that backs up what you're saying you need help with. It doesn't have to be proof.

My DD can't cook a meal so the evidence was that I have to provide food she doesn't need to prepare herself - I could say what this was - and describing occasions when she hasn't eaten because nobody prepared food for her.

Graphista · 18/09/2019 23:05

@backaftera2yearbreak very much the latter mainly LOADS of rituals which mean all told it takes me about an hour. But I also sometimes have difficulty getting up from loo - VERY undignified but I sometimes have to slap my legs to "wake them up" so i can stand.

Well TRIED to join benefits and work but as they only accept 2 methods neither of which are companies I am happy to deal with. But from looking at their "help" they WON'T accept normal payment methods! Sorry but that is utterly ridiculous and I'm sure a real barrier to potential users!

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BlankTimes · 18/09/2019 23:57

@tierraJ

It's never easy to know how the face to face interview has gone, but the DWP rely on that even sometimes in the face of contradictory medical evidence.

You must request a copy of your assessor's report, only then will you be able to read their comments and know how they have awarded points for each question.

I hope you've had a fair assessment, if not, you'll need to challenge every part of it that's wrong, sentence by sentence if needs be.

Some assessors use chit-chat phrasing to obtain information, then they make a load of assumptions based on your single answer, for example, they'll ask if you have a dog. That's all, just the simple question 'Do you have a dog?'

When you see their report and if you answered yes, then the report can say things like 'Has a dog therefore walks it at least twice a day, so no mobility issues at all. Score 0 points for the mobility section.
Can feed the dog so is able to bend down to put dog's food bowl and water bowl on the floor. Therefore no problem with upper body movement, flexibility of arms and and no back problems.

I helped a relative and the amount of wrong assumptions like the example above was staggering. The assessor took one answer to a question and then just assumed a whole load of things from that and presented the assumptions as facts in her report and the DWP backed her all the way.

We went to Tribunal and it was successful.

Some people have a competent and understanding assessor and sail through the PIP process and are given a fair award at that point. I hope your assessment was one of those.

However, if it wasn't do go all the way to Tribunal if you need to, it's a long demoralising slog, but in the end you will be given a fair and independent hearing.

Graphista
When you fill in the form, it's best to assume the person who will be reading it knows absolutely nothing about your condition, so you then explain in detail how it impacts your everyday living, specifically with regard to the questions on the form.
I see the Hertfordshire advice pdf file says the same thing "Provide plenty of detailed information about your condition and how it affects
you.
The person who decides your claim probably won’t have specialist knowledge of your condition, and people with the same medical condition can have very different needs and difficulties.
Things that seem obvious to you may not be obvious to the person who decides your claim. It is the effect that your condition has on you that matters, not what the diagnosis is."

I found it easier to prepare the answers in a word document, I like to write and review quite a lot, so for me that worked as I could edit it until I was satisfied I'd written the best description for every question.
On the form I wrote in every box 'Please see attached information'
and I'd numbered and typed the questions, same as the form then added the typed answers.

Also be prepared for "sneaky" techniques used by the DWP.
Relative received a letter saying the reply had to be "within one month of the date of this letter" yet the letter had taken over 2 weeks from that date to arrive, so the "month" you think you have to respond is suddenly less than 2 weeks. And there's a Bank Holiday in that time.

I sent all replies to DWP by tracked mail, it's about £7, but I think it's worth it.
That meant when they wrote to me saying my reply had arrived outside their time limit, I was able to print the screenshot of the Post Office's website showing the name and signature of the person who had signed for it at DWP and also the time and date it arrived there, which was four days before their "one month" deadline.

As baldpate said "It’s a horrible system designed I’m sure to make people give up"
I agree, but as long as you familiarise yourself with the system you have to engage with and try to remove as much emotion as you can and deal with them factually, you'll have an easier time.

It's absurd that we should be wishing people good luck whilst they are trying to attain some help with their disabilities to make their lives a little easier. It needs a much better system than this one, but unfortunately this is currently all we have, so for everyone that's going through PIP assessment right now, Good Luck Flowers

Graphista · 19/09/2019 01:07

@BlankTimes thanks for taking the time to write that it's immensely helpful.

I do forget to include a lot - because I'm living it daily and so the "smaller" stuff I just forget to include.

I've emailed my advisor with notes I've made based on the rethink guidelines as I found them easiest to follow and to relate to my situation
Which is mainly affected by MH issues (currently)

I'm just sad and worried that the advisors I've got now don't seem anywhere near as good as the ones I've had in the past. Don't get me wrong pleasant enough as people but just not as well up on the forms and system as the ones I had in the past were.

I get the feeling they're far more used to dealing with physically disabled and are more comfortable dealing with that side of things, but I live in an area where I know there are a lot of people who suffer with mental illness and this is the main place here that does this, everyone on local SM recommends them so weird

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