Weird situation with DD and friends

[Ahardyfool]

DD is 19 and have some issues with anxiety and processing skills. She is also 2 years recovered from an Eating Disorder just to set the scene so I’d describe her as very naive and somewhat ‘behind’ developmentally for her age. Not massively but it is somewhat relevant to this situation.

She is working at her first job and has her first ‘proper’ boyfriend as of March this year. The last couple of months she and her BF have been hanging out with another couple - the friendship was between DD’s BF and the lad in this couple initially and a fairly new friendship between them also. So now they hang out as 2 couples. They don’t do much but the lad has a car whereas the others don’t and he also has a pool at home so they go out and eat, or chill out in his pool, etc. They’ve also been camping as a group recently.

The issue is that the other couple have started to massively control everything. They wait for my DD after work in the car outside our house, today they followed her back from work and INSIST Dd comes out with them virtually every night and if DD says she fancies a night in they barrage her with messages until she agrees, sometimes becoming quite aggressive.

DD has tried to set some boundaries as it’s getting a bit much (not her greatest skill as she’s very easily persuaded and a people pleaser) and she’s also feeling she never sees her BF just the two of them. The other couple have verbally laid into her - at ken point a week ago she was being made to apologise to them all for being moody and off with them. I was pretty irate about that ridiculous load of rubbish but left DD to sort it out her own way. We have her some words of advice but left her to decide how she’d like to work things out.

Yesterday DD was very distracted at home and it turned out the girl in the other couple was messaging her and berating her for not wanting to take a day off work to come out with them all. DD again tried to get them to back off and spend the evening at home but agin they pressured her into hanging out with them. They often pressure her to take days off work to suit them (she works a Saturday - they don’t) but so far she has resisted as her job means a lot to her as does her credibility as an employee. I am proud of her for this.

I am highly suspicious (with some evidence of this) that she pays for much of what they do as she is brilliant at saving and works hard whereas the others either don’t work, work less hours or have debt.

Today DD told me that they have told her she should work different days at work (daughter changed her days due to an issue at work and is happy with arrangements) and that the issue shouldn’t be an issue and she must rearrange her work schedule to suit them. Wtf?

They also told her to stop taking her antidepressants and that they are just sugar and don’t do anything. Again WTAF?!!

Am I being unreasonable to think something is quite sinister about all this. I realise daughter needs to woman up a bit and have better boundaries but that’s no excuse for this trio trying to constantly harass and gaslight her is it?!

@Treaclesweet that’s exactly what I thought... why wouldn’t her bf want to see her OP? - it’s really obvious to us that he’s using her and I think you’re judgement is clouded by this clever bf who is pretending to support her. If anything I’d say, he’s calling the shots here, if he were to constantly text her, you’d probably end their relationship so he has to act the cool one in this and gets his mates to do the coercing.

*your 😖

There are a few books and websites that should help your daughter around friendships and romantic relationships, something like this may be useful
www.amazon.co.uk/Aspie-Girls-Guide-Being-Safe/dp/1849053545?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

Also it may be worth getting her involved with other people - I know there are some good groups for autistic teens and females, but any hobby or book group may help. She sounds very vulnerable, and in her case she may actually appreciate if you lay down the law and either ban these people completely. Keeping her busy with family things and getting involved with others may help her self - esteem. She's probably spending so much time with this gang of three that she's questioning herself (three against one) and just accepting their rules and opinions. It's be good for her to spend time with others, and who hopefully give her some differing views.

You need to work very hard to maintain a good relationship with her.

I've been where you are except that it was DD's BF doing it. DD has AS and was 18 at the time. He was telling her that I was too controlling and she needed to step away from our family in favour of his.

I made him welcome in our house (it nearly bloody killed me) and never spoke negatively of him around her (I vented privately to friends). When she was with me, her phone pinged constantly with texts from him. She had to respond to every one immediately. I had to let that happen.

I waited for appropriate times to ask why he would do certain things, e.g. why would he keep accidentally leaving bruises on you, why does he need money from you when you're a student and he has a full time job, why doesn't he want you to visit home, why doesn't he think it's a good idea for you to finish your degree? I didn't give her any answers. She had to work those out for herself.

She told me later that those questions stayed in her head and kept eating away at her and that, because I didn't criticise him, she was more able to stay in touch.

Don't try to pull her away unless you are certain that you will succeed. If you fail, they may make sure she cuts contact with you. As an adult, she has every right to do that.

You need to tread very carefully. Whatever happens and however she behaves, keep the lines of communication open and make sure she knows you love her and will always be there for her, no matter what.

Would she be willing to set up a DD so most of her money goes straight in to a savings account? I'm trying to think how to make her less attractive to them.
It sounds like she is unhappy with the situation so she might be willing to have a chat with you for some excuses ready when she doesn't want to go. If she does go can you pre arrange a time when you will call her and use a code word to see if she wants collecting?

I think the best option, and it won't be easy for you, is to help her to say no. Let her know that you have her back and will support her in any way she wants, including taking over if necessary, but that you will go along with what she says. Discuss the things they try to get her to do, in a non judgmental way "so they want you to change your hours. Do you want to?" "No" " why do you think they want you to do something you don't want?"

It might be worth seeing if there are any other groups she could get interested in - you can find groups for almost every niche these days (I love steampunk!) so there is a good chance that you could find something that would get her commiting time away from this group.

Some great advice from Goldmandra there.

I would be taking her away for a fortnight to assess the situation and give her some breathing space to think about things. I know she is an adult but she needs ‘saving’ from this situation. She’s obviously asking you for help as she’s told you what’s going on, with her past I think it would be in her best interest to step in. IF you can’t afford a holiday is there any family members your daughter could stay with?

Your daughter need help with what you have said, she could relapse on her eating disorder or her depression will worsen. I feel really sorry and concerned for your daughter and I don’t even know her.

I think taking her away for a while is a great idea if you can manage it and she's willing to go.

What is she actually saying to you? If she's telling you all this in the same way you're relating it here- that she's telling them no but they're convincing/ harassing her into going then I think you are quite right to help her by stepping in, picking her up from work, 'visiting relatives', 'getting her to look after db' but physically being there when this happens and encouraging her to not read/ reply to their messages for those few hours. So if they approach her at work you're right there to help and step in, if she says she's at home with her brother to help her parents out and not looking at her phone and they turn up you're in to send them packing. She is 19, an adult but if she's telling you all this you can still step in with a plan 'Right, so I'll pick you up, we'll do (something nice together) and don't look at the messenger, if they come knocking I'll send them away saying you're busy' etc.

I was going to ask how the bf fits into this and whther your dd could say to him "God, our friends just won't let up will they? Shall we book a few nights just the two of us?" and see what he says - but from your update it sounds like he's a bad lot too. They all sound horrible! Definitely have some girly evenings in with your daughter ("Sorry, I can't come out, my boring old mum's insisting on hanging out") and I second all the advice - let them see you picking her up, ask her questions rather than telling her how it is.

I’d make it clear to your daughter that she has done nothing wrong but that bad people are sometimes drawn to kind hearted people like her and it’s ok to ask for help in dealing with unpleasant people.

If you daughter also has ASD you could also phone your local Safefuarding Adults Team for advice. The exact things you describe would be classed as mate crime abuse of a vulnerable adult.

This went beyond a "friends" issue and into a "my dd needs me to support her" issue as soon as it veered into the bullying it has become - her age is irrelevant adults get bullied too and need others to stand up for them, eg bullying at work.

Quite honestly at this point I'd be having words with the other "friend" myself, letting her know I knew what was going on and it was to cease immediately.

I'd also be speaking to dds boyfriend as he should have spoken to "his friends" way before it reached this stage - is he bullying her too I wonder?

With your dds history it would be a terrible idea to allow this to continue a moment longer!

And that was written before the SHOCKING post at 1919 where they treated your disabled son like shit! Who the HELL do they think they are?!!

Unease? I'd be losing my shit! Not with dd or even in front of these jumped up little power hungry idiots! But in private/here/with dp (if I had one)/friends - yep!

My dd had a similar situation around the age of 13/14 it's basically "mean girls" bullshit and was incredibly hard to navigate. With hindsight I WISH I had stepped in more often (I did on occasion have words with her ESPECIALLY if I heard her talking shitty to dd in MY house!) and told "mean girl boss" to back right off!

Thankfully dd "saw the light" following a more obvious incident of bullying she witnessed said "mean girl boss" do - supported the victim to report to school and basically she removed herself from that group and started to hang out much more with the girl that is now her best mate - who never had time for bully girl and had been saying to dd for ages to ditch her.

BUT my dd didn't have the medical history yours does and if she did I DEFINITELY would have stepped in and I most DEFINITELY would have taken these little arseholes to task for the incident involving your son!

"it's like an abusive relationship" it may not be about a romantic relationship but it IS abusive. And there may also be issues with the boyfriend - op have you discussed red flags, controlling behaviour and relationship emotional abuse with dd?

I'm absolutely no expert in the field but I wonder if contacting charities that support families with children with asd might be able to advise? Perhaps you're already in touch with them as DS has a DX? Given the difficulties people with asd can have in interpreting social cues they may be able to give you a way to explain such abuse and manipulation to dd so that she understands it but doesn't feel responsible for it having happened to her?

It's the first time I've heard the term "mate crime" but I think it is great it's being recognised as a form of abuse formally and hopefully treated as a crime too! I will definitely be remembering that for future reference.

I think that the advice to subtly intervene in such a way as these...people...can't easily criticise and which gives your dd space from them to get her head together is spot on! Meet her from work, a possible trip away (holiday or staying with friends/family), occupy her at home, direct to her groups where she's more likely to make ACTUAL friends.

But where & when they do overt bullying? Damn straight I'd be having words with them!

What did dp say to them when they said all that shite about your being crap parents?! I don't know any parent that would tolerate that in real life without putting an absolute rocket under them about it!

I do wish the authorities were better at identifying and dealing with people like this but I appreciate with cuts, such things can be difficult to prove etc it can be tricky.

Sending you and your family unmumsnetty hugs and strength

Trust your instincts here. These people are not friends. They're using her.

Totally agree with MoltonSilver. Hope your DD is ok.

It would be worth looking up new anti-coercive control legislation - people think about it mostly in terms of partner relationships but apparently it can also be used for other relationships too - eg parent-child, siblings or here - abusive friends. Even if you and your dd don’t report it to the police if your dd could read what the criteria are and how they apply to her it might help her to realise what they are doing to her.

If money is an issue and they can see what she has maybe you both agree that you could increase her rent - but actually put it into a savings account for her that they don’t know about and that you are both signatories on. So that she won’t have money in her account for them to be able to see and access.

I would also get her to write down all the money that she spends going forwards when with them - and how much they spend so she can see the imbalance. It’s one thing if she is out with mates who have much less than she does to buy an extra round sometimes if she wants to. Very different for them to be dictating that she should be paying for all of them to do things that they choose.

Do you think they might have anything over her - do you think they might have taken any sex pictures or videos for example or got her to do something that she is worried about that means she is worried to escape from them? Can you reassure her about this sort of stuff being not important and more reason to leave their clutches.

Agree with others that if boyfriend isn’t willing to spend timel with your dd on their own but always needs to be with the other couple too then that should be a massive red flag and a good reason to escape from their clutches too.

Hope that she manages to extricate herself from these people with out too much horror and stress.

I hope everything's going well this weekend. If these people are taking up almost all of your daughter's free time then maybe she feels like she doesn't have anyone else. Some family days out and hobbies etc may help.

Fucking hell they sound revolting. I think you need to step up here OP. The BF at least needs some sharp words having.

They're not from some kind of cult are they? Sounds like they're trying to get their claws into her, isolate and control her. I would be very concerned.
She's only just legally an adult. That doesn't mean she can yet handle all adult things. I think she needs your help. If she wants out I think you need to block their numbers and put some safeguarding in place such as escorting her home from work until they move on.

I don’t think it’s friendships gone bad, it looks to me that they have deliberately targeted her, perhaps after a chance meeting and then latched on to her to use her for the purposes of criminal intent.

Have they already got some kind of hold on her? Perhaps she needs to hear that whatever she might have done, it doesn't matter - they can't use it control her.

I see someone else mentioned it but after reading opening post I was thinking 14 days away pronto. Surprise holiday

Definitely trust your gut, this sounds quite sinister. They're taking advantage because they can and they have you pegged as someone who will just let them get on with it. Very glad that you're about to prove them wrong!

Would seriously consider chatting it through with the police and see if they'd be prepared to speak to the three of them - might give them the fright they need to rethink their behaviour (if the police feel it's appropriate). It would also require your daughter to be on board as it would be no good if she was then in contact with them apologising afterwards!

Just to update that I’ve read heaps on coercive control, mate crime and also looked up where our nearest Freedom Programme is running. DD somehow managed to organise to spend yesterday with just the BF and stayed over (he lives with parents who we have met and they seem decent enough) I have asked her to come back early this evening so we can have a chat about things. I am armed with links and a better set of information to support my concerns thanks to comments here so I’m hoping that we can have an open conversation tonight when she is home. Before she left, we did state several of our concerns in fairly plain terms and said that we would be supporting her to put a stop to all this but would talk properly on her return. DD knows I am not someone who just lets things slide so hopefully she will approach this discussion with a strong mind and willingness to be open with us. I don’t doubt though that it will be a difficult talk to have. Thank you again for the excellent advice.

Very best of luck OP.