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Original poster

3 year old night waking - losing will to live

36 replies

edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 08:18

DD is 3.5 years old. She was a terrible sleeper as a baby, improved from 12 months old but started to deteriorate after DC2 was born.

At the moment she wakes up every night at least once with some complaint or issue. When we try to take her back to her bed, she cries screams and throws a tantrum. She is very big for her age so I can't just pick her up when she is thrashing about.

I have tried everything. Sticker charts, Gro clock, bribery, taking her to the shop to choose her favourite new bedding, taking her to buy a huge stuffed animal, etc. She just doesn't f-ing care. She wakes me up every single bloody night and then wakes up the entire family with her antics. I hate having her in our bed because she thrashes around and I get no sleep at all.

Is there any hope of things improving because it's been like 9 months and I am sick of it. She's stubborn and prone to tantrums in general so this is a continuation of her overall demeanor but my patience to deal with it at 3 AM is limited.

OP posts:
Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 08:19

Oh dear meant to put this in Chat! I will report myself.

OP posts:
AmIRightOrAMeringue · 07/05/2019 08:39

Hi OP

I got a sleep consultant for my baby (woke every 90 min to sleep) and mentioned my eldest to her - she was 3 at the time and waking a lot in the night, seemed to be triggered after the baby came along
She said with kids that age the rewards need to be immediate and visual. A star chart or something where they earn points towards a bigger prize doesn't work. She suggested a box if small treats and when they di go to bed nicely or stay in bed they get ti choose one and if they've been naughty you take one out of the box instead.
We did it with some limited success but things improved naturally over time and when she could communicate a bit better. It turned out certain cartoons with baddies in them were bothering her at night so we banned these for a while even though she loved watching them. A night light helped and keeping the door open when she had previously liked the dark. A new bed helped as well and we kept her cot bed up for a while in the other room and said we'd swap them back over if she got up

Ultimately the sleep lady told me though that you just need to do what they do in super nanny with an older kid. Make it as boring as possible for them, dont reward them with any interaction or even a cuddle just lead them back to bed and say sleep time and tuck them in and walk out. Repeatedly. She said you will be up hundreds of times the first night less the second and in a few days they will stop bothering. There will be a lot of screaming though

We never needed to do that however. Also only to be used if no other issues like sleep apnoea or other issues (if sibling is very new and they need more reassurance etc)

Iggly · 07/05/2019 08:42

What sort of complaints or issues?

Interested in this thread?

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Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 08:42

Ultimately the sleep lady told me though that you just need to do what they do in super nanny with an older kid. Make it as boring as possible for them, dont reward them with any interaction or even a cuddle just lead them back to bed and say sleep time and tuck them in and walk out.

But I can't do this. She comes to our bed, says she doesn't want to go back to her room. When I try to lead her back she throws herself to the floor or into our bed becoming limp, kicks and flails if I try to carry her. There is lots of interaction because of her behaviour which is designed to create maximum chaos.

I will try the box of treats.

OP posts:
Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 08:44

What sort of complaints or issues?

"I don't like my bed"
"I don't want to sleep any more"
"I need a kiss"
"I can't find my [name of soft toy]"
"I need to poo" (never does)

OP posts:
glueandstick · 07/05/2019 08:45

I have no answers but I’m chronically sleep deprived by mine. Absolutely nothing works. Solidarity.

Blondebakingmumma · 07/05/2019 08:49

I’m no expert, but if her end goal is to be with you rather than in your bed. Maybe try sitting quietly next to her bed with your head down and not interacting with her. If she runs to your room, stay next to your bed. Or better yet close your bedroom door or lock/block it

I’ve just got my little man to sleep through so I truly understand how exhausting no sleep is 💐💐

RogueV · 07/05/2019 08:52

Hi OP.
No advice but keep at it.
DS is 4 in 2 weeks and he has only just started sleeping through! Almost 4 years of waking and just like that. We haven’t really done anything different, just put him back in his room nightly and daily reiterated to him how important it was for him to stay in his bed all night. He used to wake 2-3 times a night and before that we used to co-sleep but I have a 3 month old so we moved him into his own room.

Flamingosnbears · 07/05/2019 08:56

Do you know OP could have been myself who wrote this post were going through the exact same thing!...
we have our little one coming in to us doing the same thing we take her back to her bed kicking and screaming she will settle down if we're both with her we give her some milk this will sometimes settle her, her favourite bear, let her fall asleep in our arm then try to gently pull it away... She is getting better you just have to be persistent don't let your child have a day time nap as this can break us no sweets /pudding after a certain time story and a relaxing bath may Work. Good luck don't give up she'll get there.

SheldonSaysSo · 07/05/2019 08:58

I would leave her where she is tantruming on your bedroom floor. It will wake the whole house but she must be doing that a lot anyway. See to DC2 if they wake, all the time ignoring the screaming of DC1. When she eventually gives in (it may be a long wait) and calms down, give her a cuddle and take her back to bed. It may well start again but as soon as she learns she can tantrum all night and the result is being put back to bed, she may well stop.

This is assuming you have used a night light, left her a small drink, removed scary tv shows (to rule out actual problems when waking rather than just antics).

Lazypuppy · 07/05/2019 09:04

Stairgate on her bedroom door, tell her if she wakes up she has to play in her room Quietly until she wants to go back to sleep.

Or if she gets in your bed,like super nanny method, take her back to her bed.

If you keep giving in she won't change

Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 09:10

Or better yet close your bedroom door or lock/block it
I did this once and she banged on the door screaming, we live in a block of flats and a neighbour rang our bell to check in the middle of the night clearly thinking we were abusing her Blush

This is assuming you have used a night light, left her a small drink, removed scary tv shows (to rule out actual problems when waking rather than just antics)
Yes to all of this. Water cup next to the bed, night light plus Gro clock, and no telly during the week at all.

Stairgate on her bedroom door, tell her if she wakes up she has to play in her room Quietly until she wants to go back to sleep.
HAHAHAH sorry but that's just not DD. She will scream and shout and cry. She may do this until exhaustion and pass out but no way in hell will she accept me telling her to play quietly in her room. And she'd just chuck herself over the gate, she does over the one we have on the kitchen (mostly to keep the baby out). She is a defiant child, I've read all the books on this personality type, it's a nightmare. DC2 will actually stop when I say stop which is a complete revelation.

Good luck don't give up she'll get there.
God I hope so

OP posts:
Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 09:11

I would leave her where she is tantruming on your bedroom floor. It will wake the whole house but she must be doing that a lot anyway. See to DC2 if they wake, all the time ignoring the screaming of DC1. When she eventually gives in (it may be a long wait) and calms down, give her a cuddle and take her back to bed. It may well start again but as soon as she learns she can tantrum all night and the result is being put back to bed, she may well stop.

I think you're right this is our only option now.

OP posts:
gamerchick · 07/05/2019 09:13

When she eventually gives in (it may be a long wait) and calms down, give her a cuddle and take her back to bed

No, no cuddle. Do not reward a tantrum.

Where is her dad? Surely he can take her back to bed if she wakes up? Or maybe a mattress on the floor of your room might help

kaytee87 · 07/05/2019 09:14

She's craving attention from you which is normal but obviously tiring for you.
Does she get relaxed one on one time with you before bed? Plenty of cuddles and stories?

kaytee87 · 07/05/2019 09:15

Would you not consider just letting her sleep the second half of the night with you until she's feeling more secure?

PenelopeFlintstone · 07/05/2019 09:23

Would you not consider just letting her sleep the second half of the night with you until she's feeling more secure?
Yep, and if she sleeps like a starfish I'd go and sleep in her bed. They're not little for long and you won't be stuck with her in the bed forever. I'd just want some sleep and wouldn't care where I got it!!

Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 09:23

Where is her dad? Surely he can take her back to bed if she wakes up? Or maybe a mattress on the floor of your room might help
We do mattress on the floor sometimes but I feel like if I offer it every night she'll be in our room until she's 12.

She's craving attention from you which is normal but obviously tiring for you. Does she get relaxed one on one time with you before bed? Plenty of cuddles and stories?
I do bedtime with stories/cuddles/songs every night but I do work so I'm not with her all day.

Would you not consider just letting her sleep the second half of the night with you until she's feeling more secure?
As above I'm afraid of being that parent whose far too old child still crawls into their bed each night. Also I don't want to encourage DC2 to do the same and then I'm stuck with two kids in my bed every night. But maybe that's irrational and they outgrow it.

OP posts:
Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 09:25

Oh - DH is around but sleeps like the dead and his default is "just let her sleep here." When I wake up an hour later being kicked in the head by DD I find DH has quietly snuck off to the spare room to get his rest!

OP posts:
gamerchick · 07/05/2019 09:28

We do mattress on the floor sometimes but I feel like if I offer it every night she'll be in our room until she's 12

It always amazes me that on here people can't sleep without their partners but expect little kids to sleep on their own. It doesnt matter how you all get sleep. Sometimes it's about survival. Eventually they mostly all want to sleep in their rooms.

Personally I'd tell her she's not allowed to sleep in her room anymore. I've done that with my youngest when he refused to go to bed. Switched off all noise and tell him he's stopping up with me and we're going to sit and look at each other all night. Works like a charm.

Damntheman · 07/05/2019 09:28

I second Sheldon's advice. I'm so sorry OP! Sleep deprivation is absolute hell. Keep your head up, stay at it and don't give in. You can do it and when she does sleep through again it'll be such bliss. Best of luck!

One thing though - I would not under any circumstances let her sleep in your bed. Not even once. You do it once and she'll learn that tantrumming gets her into mum's bed and she'll never stop.

gamerchick · 07/05/2019 09:29

Oh - DH is around but sleeps like the dead and his default is "just let her sleep here." When I wake up an hour later being kicked in the head by DD I find DH has quietly snuck off to the spare room to get his rest!

Sorted then, you get their first and he can get kicked in the head.

gamerchick · 07/05/2019 09:29

*there

kaytee87 · 07/05/2019 09:30

Of course they outgrow it, your 12yo will not be climbing into bed with you Grin
I think I outgrew going into my parents bed around 5?
3.5 is only small, she's not deliberately doing this. She's had a big change in her life. If letting her come into the bed for now means more sleep for everyone then I'd just go with it.
You & DH could take turns in the spare room?

Original poster
edgeofheaven · 07/05/2019 09:31

It always amazes me that on here people can't sleep without their partners but expect little kids to sleep on their own. It doesnt matter how you all get sleep. Sometimes it's about survival. Eventually they mostly all want to sleep in their rooms.

My DCs share a room at DD's request so she's not alone at night.

OP posts: