I think my 7 year old daughter is developing borderline personality disorder. Can ANYONE with experience please help?

[BastardGoDarkly]

That says it all really.

I've known for a while, there's something different about my 7 year old.

Looked into PDA autism adhd.. none of them fit her quite right.

After a disturbing parents evening, I stumbled on bpd developing in children, so much of it is her.

Anyone have any wise words?

I very much doubt that in the UK any camhs service would be looking at diagnosing a personality disorder in a young child. Fwiw many women later found to be autistic were given wrong diagnoses of bpd about 20 to 30 years ago.

I would step away from trying to diagnose your daughter and instead seek a camhs referral by listing some of the difficulties she has and let the experts decide what pathway she needs. For example instead of saying "I think she has bpd" you could say 'she has severe mood swings and finds it hard to see others' viewpoints' (or whatever issues you perceive) instead.

Right. Ok. Thank you floating

Can you list the difficulties she has? Someone here might be able to suggest something. It must be very difficult for you.

Has anything traumatic happened to her? Could anything traumatic have happened to her? BPD-type symptoms in children can be symptoms of trauma-and BPD in adults is also very closely linked to trauma. PP is right though; no decent doctor would diagnose a PD in anyone much younger than 20, as PD symptoms can be part of normal adolescence.

ey up bastard. now, my understanding is that personality disorders are not diagnosed until the patient is AT LEAST 18 years old as many experts believe that a personality is not fully developed until at least then. I have most certainly never heard of a child as young as 7 being diagnosed, no one i know ( and I have it myself) with the diagnosis was given it as a child. I can absolutely understand how worried you must be right now, and i'm not belittling your worries at all but the best thing for you to do is get the gp,school SENCO and CAMHS involved as soon as possible and discount nothing. PP is right in that many many women who were diagnosed as having BPD in the past actually have autism and it hasn't been identified correctly as autism presents so differently in most girls. Definitely make an appointment to see your gp and discuss your worries with them and ask for camhs referrals etc, try and see if you can see the SENCO at school as well and see if you can come up with an action plan to support DD in school.

Yes, thanks Hollow

I've just found out at parents eve, she's been telling a huge lie for weeks, that my husband is in intensive care, she's been staying at my mum's, because I'm at the hospital all the time!?

Looking up children's lying, led me to bpd in children, pages.

At home, she insists on help with EVERYTHING, from getting dressed to teeth, to getting things for herself, she seems to want to stay a baby!?

If she's met with any resistance, she shouts, screams, such things as.... just kill me then!!! You gate me!!! You want me dead don't you?!!

She hates me spending any time with our son, she'll hammer on the door, if I'm trying to read with him.

Similarly, me going to work in the evening, every single night, she's shouting at me about how I don't care, all the other kids get their mum's at bedtime.

There's loads more.

How does she behave?

My dd was a difficult child. When she got to 9 or 10 it became obvious that it was all anxiety driven

Now at 12 we know she likes rroutines to make her feel happy. Once we discovered this, she’s been really lovely.

Sorry One I cross posted with my essay

I'll definitely go and talk to gp.

I work in a relevant field and psychological assessments I have seen of women up to about age 21 still only consider them to have "emerging traits" of PDs - as PP said the personality is still developing.

Speak to your GP about a referral to CAMHS - I'd suggest getting school on board with this too in case supporting evidence is needed.

(As an aside - also very concerned that the school waited until parents evening to clarify whether a 7 year olds parent was gravely unwell in intensive care and they were staying with alternative family members - surely a phone call home to see if any support is needed!!)

I agree that an awful lot of misdiagnosing and cross-fertilisation goes on between autism and associated disorders, personality disorders, PTSD/trauma related conditions. I also think most experts will be reluctant to consider a PD at this young age.

I would ask your GP for an urgent CAMHS referral (school can refer if your GP is reluctant). Between now and the appointment, keep a loose diary of symptoms/behaviours, observe triggers, note how she responds to behaviour management strategies and how she behaves when she isn't distressed/displaying her most extreme behaviour. Make an appointment to see her teacher and explain what you are doing and ask for her observations.

The more information you are armed with, the more likely you are to get the investigative ball rolling quickly and the closer you will be to getting answers.

Thank you Greensleeves that's what I'll do.

Yes! She said that shed spoken to ds teacher, who'd asked said he was ok with all that's going on. (they're in same school. He's 11) he'd shrugged and said.. I don't know what she's talking about!
Teacher didn't want to call at 'such a difficult time' !?

I don't rate Cahms

I'd be looking for a referral to a clinical child psychologist or if it's a thing where you are a multi disciplinary assessment .

How's her language and processing skills?
How's her coordination
How's her language?

I went to the community paediatrician in the first instance- I wrote to her listing all my concerns and said there was something wrong that I couldn't put my finger on

Ds was diagnosed with ASD at 7.

Try reading to your children together rather than locking yourself away in a room away from her. I always read to mine together it relaxed them. It may be hard for mummy to go to work in the evening and leave her. Can your OH help at bedtime.

Hi copper

Her language, reading, maths, coordination, everything is ahead of her years.

She's exceptionally self conscious when it comes to performing, to the point she will leave pe, if the teachers watching her, or stop swimming lessons, because she moved up a stage, no longer 'played' and teacher watched them individually.

just ds literally wouldn't be able to read. Shed just say "I'm boooored " all the way through, or try and talk to me.

My husband does 5 out of 7 bedtime, they've a lovely relationship.

Is there any pint in asking her about all this lying at school stuff? She's been over at her friends since we got back. She's coming in in a bit, she'll just say "I don't know" I think.

I really feel for you because it is so difficult to have things like this taken seriously. I remember going to the GP because my daughter from a very young age would hit her head against the wall or dig her nails into her arm whenever she was angry or upset. I said I was worried about her self harming more when she was older (there were other issues, but this concerned me the most). We got no help at all and lo and behold she hit about 13 and started cutting herself.

Even then we didn't get much help. She got a mentor that used to cancel most weeks so that just made her worse, not better. She was finally diagnosed with BPD (or EUPD as they often now call it) at around the age of 24. Far too late, in my opinion, to make a real difference to her life. Now at 28 she's on ESA and PIP and I don't know if she will ever have a "normal" life. She's happy enough in her own way. She thankfully seems to have stopped self harming a long time ago. But it makes me so sad that she seems resigned to a life on benefits at her age. Equally I am so angry that she was let down for so many years.

I honestly don't know what I could have done differently. I begged for help so many times. I love her dearly but I have really been through the mill with her. I don't blame her, she can't help it. But the professionals just seem to think lets wait and see if they grow out of it, and maybe some do, but for the others waiting until adulthood is too late.

I would wonder if the lying was a cry for attention not a personality disorder...
Maybe the need for help at home is also a cry for attention.

Maybe she just wants more attention in general.

Ask open questions

What did your teacher say when you told her about dad

How did that make you feel

How worried was she about you

Etc . In a kind way.

CAMHS won’t diagnose BPD in anyone under 18, as rule. They may diagnose or bite ‘emerging signs of BPD’ (or similar wording) but they won’t give a solid diagnosis of it until adulthood (even if it ‘walks like a duck, quacks like a duck’ etc - which i’m not saying your DD is, btw). It is an especially controversial and rare diagnosis in children under 13 (in childhood, rather than adolescence).

*note, not bite

Definitely please refer. She is hurting about something. You just need to be as calm and patient as possible, always steady and certain in an uncertain and possibly scary world. Please get help though- an no name calling bpd just yet!!

Oh Asta that's so sad. Does medication not help her now? Or does she just about manage on medication?

Ok. I asked her about it. She started crying, and said.... I'm so so sad about fella (my brothers cat, that got run over in January, (Shed only met him once, but has consistently cried about it) and they would think I'm silly, so I said it was Dad!?

Is that true do you think? My heads spinning to be honest.

Iggly I've wondered that many times, and considered giving up my job. I love it though, and it means school holidaus/any sickness/school events, I'm here for. It's so hard.

Have you ever read anything g about attachment disorders?

Came to mind because you say she dominates everything for attention. Seems her behaviour is anxiety driven. Needs attention for security and when given attention she crumbles under it.

Camhs definitely worthwhile. Email senco at school and saybin might or conversation with class teacher and x h and z behaviours you'd like them to refer and can they confirm they've done this.

Thank you kiddingme I will do, think it may be easier than gp, who's probably never met her.

Font know what I'd do without mumsnet, honestly