Very Elderly Friend - family not helping. WWYD?

[CaravaggioLover]

I have NCd for this in case her family browse these pages. It's long, so apologies in advance.
I have a friend who I used to live a couple of doors down from. 4 years ago we moved a few streets away but remained friends. This lady will be 99 in March. I will call her Ada. We always helped out with clearing her path if it snowed, my dh would change her lightbulbs, shopping etc. Once we moved away we remained friends and still helped her out a fair bit. Her family all live quite a long way away. We are all in North London and her son is in Gloucester, grandkids in S London and elsewhere. They see her rarely.

Ada was generally quite fit until last July. One evening I had a call from her granddaughter in Surrey who said she couldn't get hold of her DGM and could I go and see if all was well? I have keys , so I drove over to Ada's house, rang, knocked etc....no response. I let myself in and she was lying ill on her couch. Long story short, I called the ambulance and she was admitted to hosp with pneumonia plus other complications. She ended up being in for two weeks and I visited her every two days and took her fruit etc, since her son and DGD only managed one visit each.

While she was in hosp I went to her house to get some clean clothes and realised Ada has no washing machine and has never had one . Once she came out of hosp it became apparent that she is a lot frailer and cannot really manage for herself. She has not been able to leave the house unaccompanied since that time.

My dilemma is this: when she came out of hosp, I offered to take over Ada's laundry which she was grateful for. I suppose I thought her family would put something in place to take care of it eventually, like having a washing machine installed - but nobody has made the slightest move to do so. Seven months on and I am still trundling over there twice weekly to collect her laundry/drop it off, and her family have made no effort to intervene. They barely visit. Ada has a visit once weekly for an hour by a carer from a local company but she absolutely will not hear of any further interventions. I have practically begged her to increase her visits from the carers but she refuses - but her family aren't helping either.

When I spoke to her yesterday about getting a small washing machine installed she said there was no room and she couldn't put one in the garage as it's full of her grandson's old cars and junk - this is man in his 40s, btw. I asked her why he can't take his stuff out so she could have a machine installed but she just made excuses. Her family do nothing but she will not hear a word against them.

I really don't want to keep doing her laundry but when I told her this yesterday she was really upset. I feel that 7 months is enough, tbh. She will not let me contact her family members as she 'doesn't want to cause trouble'. I feel guilty but I work pt, have 2 teenagers and a home to run and I am finding myself becoming resentful. My dh is completely outraged that Ada's family have been happy to let me do her laundry and other stuff ( I take her to appointments too) with absolutely no thanks or acknowledgement or recognition that the situation needs looking at.

WWYD? thanks for reading .

I forgot to mention, Ada has had two falls in the last 2 weeks. Her family are aware of this. They have made no effort to increase the intervention though
The other thing is over Christmas she went to stay with family members in Surrey and developed a very bad leg sore. At one stage it was so painful she couldn't actually stand up - which she told them - but nobody thought to take her to the Doctor/hosp. Once she got back to London her other friend who lives about 30 minutes away visited, took one look at it and got an ambulance. She was diagnosed with an infection and ulcer, put on antibiotics and it is still being dressed twice weekly by nurses now.

Are you able to contact her family yourself? If so I would make it clear that you are still happy to offer friendship and emergency support, but you can no longer be doing regular tasks like washing. If they still don't step up, I would call social services and notify them that Ada need more support. I know it sounds harsh, but she is vulnerable and needs to accept that the current arrangement isn't tenable.

All the while you are taking responsibility they can abdicate. If you want to, fine but it sounds like you are now angry and resentful- and that’s not good for anyone.
I think you need to get her consent to involve her GP or social services. There should be a care package in place- and should have been before discharge.

You might have to tell her you are no longer able to help so need to sort other arrangements.

How is she eating or bathing?

You don't know the background. Her family may be lazy sods, or she may have been unpleasant to them in the past and they have good reason not to help. I'd suggest you ring your local social services and say that you are unable to continue helping and they will come and do an assessment. Then take a massive step back.

Ah nurses are going in. Speak to them about a full assessment. She should have had a proper falls assessment through them. They should be considering her wider needs. Contact the trust and speak to community nurse manager.

I should mention that I have an elderly father who also has a kind neighbour who helps in emergencies. I would 100% want her to tell me if things were deteriorating, even if he didn't want her to. It's really difficult for distant family as well, but that doesn't mean that you should be papering over the cracks by making your own life unmanageable.

Laundry you can get a company to do for her, I think www.ihateironing.com do laundry too. Obviously you get her kids to pay, not you.

(I suspect when they're paying £15 a week for her laundry they might suddenly find they can do it themselves)

Thanks a lot for replies. She did have Age UK and the Red Cross in for about 2 months following her release from hospital in July, but she has no local based interventions now except for the district nurse twice weekly (for the leg ulcer) and a privately paid for care worker one hour a week to give her a shower. I have already asked the granddaughter to increase the help but she merely replied that they would "do whatever Ada wants and allow her to make her own choices" - which seems like total abdication of duty to me.

I told Ada very forcibly yesterday that I believed 'very strongly' that she needed more help and regular care from the careworkers but she refused, basically.

I know Chicken, I feel so bad about it and Ada is angry with me for feeling that her family don't do enough - but they don't .

I told Ada very forcibly yesterday that I believed 'very strongly' that she needed more help and regular care from the careworkers but she refused, basically.

Maybe she tells her family she refuses any more help and care as well.

First, it's a nice thing you are doing for your neighbour.
Second, you cannot force people to do what you want be that get a washing machine, have more carers etc. If she has capacity to make decisions, then she is entitled to do so regardless of what demands you are making or what you believe to be in her best interests, even if that is a choice that may cause harm or would be unwise.

If you are going to continue to do her washing, then why would her family step in? You have no idea of her family history - maybe she was awful to them and now they want as little to do with her as possible? Maybe they have stepped in and she has told them where to go?

The fact that her granddaughter has said she can't force her, suggests that they have already been down this route of trying to help and got no where.

It's very easy to judge and decide what you "knows about Ada when you are seeing her for a short time twice a week.

I think it's great that you are helping her out, but I would be careful about forming judgements about how awful her family are etc without having a full picture.

Upset that you won’t be doing her laundry in future, angry when you say her family aren’t doing enough...you need to flag her up to the professionals who will know what’s possible and won’t be influenced by guilt and pity.
You’ve done enough for her personally.

I would contact social services and then just tell her that unfortunately you have too much on to continue with the washing. As long as you continue the situation won’t resolve itself.

Yes you are right. I took the laundry on with the best of intentions but 7 months on and I think I can't really cope any more. I do need to take a step back and let her family intervene. The trouble is I don't think they will. .

Anyway thanks for the suggestions everyone.

You need to contact social services as this is a safeguarding matter. Her family are to some extent abdicating their responsibilities but I suspect it is Ada herself refusing help most of all. Old people can be very stubborn!

Ada sounds a bit like my Mum. Very independent and doesn't want to bother anyone. Family all live long distance away except for a couple of dgc who are nearer (but still an hour travelling across London)

We have had outright refusals if we suggest anything that might help. She says she absolutely will have no carers in her house. She refused even thinking about getting a suitable shower when work had to be done on plumbing anyway, even when we offered to pay. When we suggest getting the doctor involved she forbids us to do it. Obviously we have gone against her wishes in emergencies, but can't just force things on her.

Sounds like this family is like mine. They have tried suggesting everything but nothing is acceptable.

That doesn't mean you have to continue doing the washing though. You were very kind to support her, but this is now being taken for granted as being an established part of her support system.

She is reluctant to consider any changes in her environment. I'm sure her family has got tired of urging her and can't change anything. I would contact social services and let them know that she needs more help and is relying too much on you.

You have been very kind to Ada - and yes, her family are taking the piss.

I would let her GP and Social Services know that she needs help, but is refusing to arrange this, supported by her family. If they don't care, you really can't do any more. They're probably not wanted to spend any more money than necessary - cynical me!

I totally empathise with the fact that they may have had a bad upbringing, but no-one should let another person suffer, if they can do anything about it.

I love how lots of posters including the OP judge the family as not caring or don't want to spend the money.

You cannot force anyone to accept help when they are of sound mind and have refused it. As the OP has found she doesn't want help other than what the OP is doing because that probably suits her just fine.

It took my DM many months to accept she couldn't physically cope at home and after that we got the carers/cleaners and other helpers in. Forcing those things on before the acceptance would have been terrible and counter productive. You simply cannot force anyone to let people in the house to help if they say no.

OP take a step back and stop the washing. However, don't be quick to judge the family as you have no idea what has been discussed previously and rejected by Ada.

But it's role reversal. A child might want to eat sweets continually, but as the parent, you know that's not right.

If someone is ill and can't make sound judgements, you take the 'parental' role, and gently advise them. Or in the case of my DP, use emotional blackmail . 'Mum is so tired Dad, I really think it would help her to have xxxxx'. 'Good idea AJ, could you sort it out'.

My MIL goes wandering without a coat, and can't find her way home, so people end up taking her to the Police Station. But she has 'capacity' (at a given point in time), so SIL won't allow her to be persuaded to take sensible action. As she was not a good mother, DH doesn't loose too much sleep, but it does worry him from the point of view that you don't want to see any old person suffer.

If someone is ill and can't make sound judgements, you take the 'parental' role, and gently advise them.

Whilst you can try and persuade you cannot force. If persuasion does not work do you really think the children have a right to take over her house and force a washing machine to be fitted? Or do they have a right to remove clothes to wash them if she says no? It's a fine line between 'parenting' your parents and ignoring and trampling all over their rights. Also wandering the streets and forgetting where you live is a far cry from not doing your washing in a washing machine.

It's very easy to sit from the outside and say the family are not doing enough when you have no proof of what they have tried in the past.

The OP should stop doing the washing then Ada might be forced to admit she needs carers and helpers to continue to live independently at home.

You have been kind to do the washing & take to appointments. However, as you can see this has turned into a permanent solution. Do you have a local friend /s that you can share the tasks with, so that you do a week each ? Who does the food shopping ?

We are in a similar situation with my grandma and she outright refuses anyone to visit her at home and we can't offer as much support as we'd like from where we are. Social services are involved and she can afford help no problem but neither they nor us can force her. My mother could invoke power of attorney but can't force her to allow people in her home when she's not there and she doesn't need a home (yet).

I think the main issue here is lack of communication between the family and you, I'd do my best to speak to them and express your concerns. You sound like a wonderful friend to her.

This thread was started by op in 2019.

Zombie thread.

@eburydrycleaners notnonlybshockingly insensitive to advertise on a post like this but reviving a years old post to do it won’t win you any customers.