Am I not bright? 3rd in my degree.

[OnTrain]

A thread kind of about a thread. More about a post in a thread! Someone slagging off Carol Vordeman because she only got a third in her degree. Saying she wasn’t bright.

I got a third, tbh I’m just glad I passed but I also thought I was bright! Do I need a reality check? Am I a thicko?!

wot, that doesn't mean anything for the OP.

Universities are not required to standardise.

At some places, a first is 70 and up.

At others it is 85 and up.

The bell curves at different universities look very different.

No one should kid themselves that getting 85 in a place where that is a normal fist class mark is achieving more than getting 70 in a place where that is the normal first class mark. There is just so much more that has to be taken into account.

IMO the thing that matters here is that the OP is good at what she does, and she shows she is.

SarahAndQuack, I agree with you. I was responding to another poster's incorrect assertion about the OU's marking guidance.

Unless they have changed it you do need 85% for a first in OU science degrees, no idea about humanities but presumably it's the same.

@wotsittoyou suppose if it took you 15 years you more than deserve it

Carol is clearly intelligent, she is a member of Mensa. Who knows why she got a third, educational achievement is not a direct correlation to iq. Many very intelligent people have little to no educational achievements,

Bang on. The person who invented the MRI scanner had no educational accomplishments.

Sorry, wot. I am just running short of patience here.

Re Vorderman- she said in an interview 'she could have worked harder'
www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/passedfailed-carol-vorderman-1249858.html

It's a course which requires being bright and hard work, I think.

Butchyrestingface: Criminal justice. But I've dependably achieved similar results on OU modules across a range of disciplines.

So it was the OU you attended? 85% + is good at the OU but not exceptional in the way it would be at a bricks and mortar university due to the difference in marking schemes.

Well done on your - I assume - First class honours degree though.

I have a law degree. I got a 2.2 because I fucked up my dissertation.

I was devastated at the time. But now I work for a large firm. I’m just as good as any other fee earner in there.

Things will work out.

A lot of it is family/school background too.

No one in my family had been to university so I had no support and no idea how to ask for support. Lecturers were scary, learned people who (in my mind) had no time for us at all.

I didn’t know how to study and no one to ask for help.

My school were hopeless, no university preparation at all.

To whoever (I ain't scrolling back!) expressed surprise at a candidate getting into teacher training with a 3rd class, I'm in Scotland where a number of my friends were accepted onto the PGCE/DE with an ordinary degree.

This was some years ago now, so I don't know what the current situation is. Is an honours degree a requirement in England?

So you went from a third to a 2.2 overnight, well done

Better than me I was homeless so never got the chance to go to university. I feel I'm probably too old in my mid 30's to contemplate it now.

Got abominable grades in my GCSEs and A levels yet went on to study medicine at uni (got a first in initial degree). Degrees don't show intelligence really, they are a marker of ability to retain knowledge and express it correctly. Your degree is fine @OnTrain.

I feel I'm probably too old in my mid 30's to contemplate it now.

Pshaw! Havers, lassie!

I'm 54 and doing a master degrees so if I'm not too old then neither are you.

@Butchyrestingface

It may have been me, but there were a few users that were supposed at a teacher holding only a Third class degree.

In NZ and Australia (NSW at least) you need an overall GPA of 75% or better to enter a postgraduate teaching programme. In Ireland, you can apply with a H2:2, but as most programmes accept around 80 students yet receive 500+ applications, so it’s very competitive. You wouldn’t get a place as you receive points based on your qualifications, and a H2:2 received hardly any points. I think you now get a few extra points now if it’s a shortage subject (STEM, languages), but you’d struggle on a H2:2 regardless.

When I worked in teacher recruitment for teachers seeking to move to Australia and New Zealand (2006/2008), the schools weren’t interested in teachers who hadn’t gotten at least a high H2:1 in their undergraduate degrees. Many of the principals expressed surprise at anyone with 65% or less being admitted to teaching.

I appreciate that standards may be lower in the U.K. but I still think a Third isn’t suitable for the classroom. Teaching students and preparing them for their exams which will have a massive impact on their careers requires more than a Third. If a Third is acceptable, then educational achievement will continue to fall.

Degrees are about jumping through hoops. I used to mark degree assignments. It was 5 marks for explicitly naming the method you were using, 10 marks for saying why you chose it, 10 marks for providing a diagram, etc.

I marked some assignments which were excellent in terms of originality, depth of research, writing style, etc. But they got low marks because they didn’t jump through the hoops. They didn’t explicitly write “The Method I Will Be Using Is...” or provide the right kind of diagram etc. And there were others which were as basic as they could possibly be and they’d chosen the easiest method and done the minimum of research, but they jumped through the hoops according to the marking scheme so they got a good grade.

It also has a lot to do with whether you have an aptitude for your chosen subject and what it includes at a particular university. I’m smart but my degree course included more maths than I expected, and maths isn’t my strong point. There are other universities where the same subject involves less maths so I think I’d have done better. The quality of teaching and support is also a factor in your success (or lack of).

I thought I had a third so was about to comment and then thought I'd check my actual degree certificate and it's a 2:2! So I guess it's easily done, albeit slightly depressing that I thought so little of my academic achievement that I'd put it down as the lowest, the same could be said for you OP don't put yourself down be proud of even graduating!

I fell pregnant toward the end of my second year so I did my first semester of third year then took a year out and went back for the second semester and it was awful, my dissertation changed entirely in my year off too so I had to redo all my initial research and I think that's what pulled my grades down. But at least I did it when all my family told me I wouldn't go back and that I'd wasted my time at uni. Graduating with my son was something I was insanely proud of even if I did think I had a third too.

The OU marking scheme is more strict than most red brick universities. The reason why so many students seem to get a 1st is because it’s probably the biggest uni in the UK. Not because the material is necessarily easier. However, not all undergrad subjects are equal as many don’t encourage external research.

'Essex Uni' is an actual university that performs exceptionally well in a range of subjects. Sorry to butt in on this but as someone who went to school in Essex this 'Essexism' bugs me. The school I went to remains towards the top of league tables and the university is particularly strong in several areas. It also has a lovely library with a slightly scary pater nostra lift.

God I didn’t even get a third. I got an ordinary degree without the honours. Partly because I struggled with anxiety and depression and migraines throughout, partly because I was sexually assaulted at the start of my second year, and partly because I just wasn’t much good at the subject I’d chosen.

I got a job in a different field and did extremely well. Blagged my way onto a Masters by impressing the course leader with my practical knowledge. Graduated with Distinction and achieved such high grades that I was asked to stay on for a PhD. How is that possible if a Third (or less) means you’re thick?

You have a degree. You're not thick.

Although you don't need one to prove that you're not thick either. There are different forms of intelligence.

I've yet to find mine.

“I still think a Third isn’t suitable for the classroom”

As I said above, I know someone with a first who thought the queen was in charge of (as in properly making all decisions etc) of the UK.

So tbh I think degree classifications don’t tell us a massive amount about intelligence.

I got a 2:2 in 1995. I did the absolute bare minimum to scrape by. I felt I was on the wrong course though and actually wanted to take a year out. I do feel that I wasted the opportunity and wonder what I could have achieved if the circumstances and timing had been right.

@BanjoStarz

Your ignorance and arrogance shine through beautifully. Well done