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Original poster

I thought brownies was a group for all/any faith?

33 replies

lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:26

I was under the impression that brownie groups were for girls of any faith ? Am I wrong ?
I know most take place in church halls but I’d always assumed anyone could join regardless of religion ?

OP posts:
Greenandcabbagelooking · 10/12/2018 17:28

You are correct. Brownies is for all girls. Some units do go to church, but its no more compulsory than a trip to the panto/zoo/Pets at Home.

SemperIdem · 10/12/2018 17:28

I didn’t think they were “Faith” related particularly, but I don’t know much about it. I think Girl Guides might be a Christian organisation though?

Hope someone who actually knows can enlighten us both!

Original poster
lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:29

I just assumed it was for everyone. Looked at a local groups page and it specifically says it’s for one religious group of girls which I found surprising

OP posts:
Nissemand · 10/12/2018 17:30

I think you're right.

At the same time, I know there are scout groups out here geared towards Jewish and Muslim kids.

I doubt that they'd actually turn anyone away who was a member of another faith, or none, if they actually applied though.

caddywally · 10/12/2018 17:32

I think you're right, but it's been a long time since I went and don't know anyone currently involved with Brownies, so I could be wrong. I don't remember there being any prayers or religious element to it. My Brownies group was made up of girls from a few schools, some religious and some not.

Original poster
lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:32

I just wasnt sure didn’t want to do the wrong thing by trying to join something we aren’t meant to I was just looking for the closest group
Maybe it’s the venue (it’s in a synagogue) I don’t know what the situation is with people of other faiths going into a synagogue is that permitted ? Sorry to be ignorant

OP posts:
Bestseller · 10/12/2018 17:33

Yes, it is certainly.intemed to be for all faiths but the practice of it will depend to some extent on the local leader and some groups do have strong.links to the church where they hold their meeting etc

The promise has change dsince I was a Brownie. We used to promise to "Do my duty to God". It's now:

"I promise that I will do my best, to be true to myself and develop my beliefs, to serve the Queen and my community, to help other people and to keep the (Brownie) Guide Law."

cheesemongery · 10/12/2018 17:34

Brownies and Cubs/Scouts were certainly a Christian organisation when I went and indeed when my son went - your promise included doing your duty to god and it was expected to attend the church parade on a Sunday (to a Christian church).

I'm sure times have changed but it was only 12 years ago my son did his promise. I think it's because you are also supposed to serve the Queen too, who is the head of the church - I think?!

Don't do queens or gods now Grin

LooksBetterWithAFilter · 10/12/2018 17:35

And a whole they are non denominational as are guides. Brownies and guides are the same association. If it is run in a synagogue they may be running it as a group for Jewish girls because lots of groups are in a church hall and have loose connections to the church because of this and Jewish girls may be excluded from some things because of this. You can only ask.

MsAwesomeDragon · 10/12/2018 17:36

Most brownie groups are inclusive of any religion. Some, catering for children from a minority faith, only cater for girls from that faith.

So a brownie group meeting in a Christian church is unlikely to just be for Christians, but a group meeting in a synagogue may well just be for Jewish girls.

There's bound to be other groups in the area. Join one of those.

Imaghosthowareyoooooo · 10/12/2018 17:36

Girl guiding is open to all religions/no religion. However, some units are sponsored and this may mean you get a group that is aimed at eg. Muslim girls. When I ran a rainbows group we were sponsored by the local Catholic church. All girls were welcome to join but we were expected to turn up at certain church services as part of our sponsorship. My DDs both attend rainbows/brownies at units with no affiliation to any church.

LooksBetterWithAFilter · 10/12/2018 17:37

Cubs and scouts are also non denominational now as well. There are various versions of the promise and the Cubs/scouts can choose which one they want to say whether it says god is the name of their god or no religious mention at all.
I’m a cub leader currently all mine do the no mention of god at all version

Original poster
lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:39

The others have very long waiting lists and this one is on the best day / time for us. I just don’t want to do the wrong thing by even asking
Would they mind having a non Jewish girl there ? If they don’t do anything about god/religion/queen etc would it even come up as an issue ?

OP posts:
Iaintdonenothing · 10/12/2018 17:39

Brownie leader here and a member for the last 15 years.

Girlguiding has never been a member of the Christian church.

rainbows/brownies/Guides are usually held in the cheapest most suitable venues therefore some are held in Chruch halls for this reason.

The brownie promise is to 'develop beliefs' which doesn't just mean religion but good to animals, to be kind or to believe that Little Mix is the best band in the world - literally any beliefs.

We sometimes make Christmas crafts, candle holders for divali, Halloween pumpkins or Easter cards but it's nothing to do with pushing or making a girl be religious. Some songs still have Christian themes but thats more traditional camp songs 'you'll never get to heaven.. in a baked bean can' but we wouldn't sing any if it would offend any parents/girls.

NaughtToThreeSadOnions · 10/12/2018 17:39

I was under the impression that they were a christian organisation "i promise to do my best, serve the queen and do my duty to god" although i might be misrembering but i thought the promise had been changed in the 90's early naughts to my duty to my god.

And this is from the girl guiding website
How do I promote inclusion in my unit?

There are a number of simple but effective actions that can be taken to promote inclusion. Make guiding inclusive by following these steps

Be open to all girls- it is always good to remind parents and girls of this when promoting your unit. Some people think we are a Christian organisation, so it is worth saying that we are open to all girls and we have members from all the main UK faith groups and girls with non-religious beliefs

www.girlguiding.org.uk/making-guiding-happen/running-your-unit/including-all/equality-diversity-and-inclusion/

Heratnumber7 · 10/12/2018 17:40

The promise has changed more recently than 12 years ago cheese.

OP if you think a unit is being run for one faith exclusively you should report it (Division Commissioner speaking). However if a unit is based in an area where one particular faith is the majority, and therefore the number of girls wanting to join us from that majority, this isn't deliberate.
My own unit is predominantly white Christian, for example, but so is the rural area where we are based. This isn't a policy.

Guiding us for all faiths, and none. And has been for years.
Some units meet in church halls etc, but it's usually because they are cheap to hire rather than because of any affiliation to the church.

Original poster
lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:40

I just don’t want to put my foot in it and do the wrong thing I had just assumed brownies was for any girl regardless

OP posts:
Iaintdonenothing · 10/12/2018 17:45

The ethos of Girlguiding is to build confidence, to make friends and to give new opportunities. There are probably a higher percentage of religious girls who join than the normal intake of other organisations but that's because parents of Jewish/islam/Christian feel more comfortable sending their girls away with no boys/men.

Veterinari · 10/12/2018 17:47

Op why do you think that this particular group is not for any girl regardless?

Are you simply assuming because the group is held at a synagogue?

Groovee · 10/12/2018 17:48

Some brownie units are closed sponsored groups. It usually means for example the leaders belong to that faith and girls who are members of that particular meeting place. It's usually that the place pays their expenses etc.

99% of the others welcome any faith. My brownie unit is run in a local church that it's been in for 70 years. We welcome anyone. We've had a lot of girls who are Muslim or Hindu. We have girls with additional needs too.

Original poster
lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:49

No on the information page it said the group is for Jewish girls

OP posts:
Original poster
lavenderchai · 10/12/2018 17:50

I was just surprised as assumed all brownie groups were for any girl regardless of religion

OP posts:
Iaintdonenothing · 10/12/2018 17:51

I second previous poster on reporting the Jewish group as the whole ethos of GG is to be inclusive to all. Surely the Jewish group could just become a local Jewish youth group not a girl guiding a group unless they literally just run for the badges

Heratnumber7 · 10/12/2018 17:52

What is the unit? Challenge them. That's against Guiding policy and should be reported.
PM me if you like.

Heratnumber7 · 10/12/2018 18:23

I have queried this with GG. I know which unit it is, but haven't mentioned the OP.

Will report back when GG reply to me.

Very odd.