Removed from flight.

[Madhatter24]

This is quite a long thread but I want you to get all the information as I am really confused and want to give my friend the best advice.

A friend of mine who was returning from holiday, she was travelling with her brother, his wife, their two young children and my elderly mother in law who is age 70+. They were seated separately on the plane, my friend was seated upstairs and everyone else was seated downstairs together. The niece was crying for my friend and she was becoming agitated as she is very attached to her and she is always with her, however as she was seated upstairs she couldn't sit with her. My friend asked the stewardess it was it possible for her to sit near her family and they said once everyone is boarded, if there's a way they can swap her with another passenger they will. She accepted this and was waiting patiently for the flight to board and take off. Another passenger on the plane complained to the steward and said that my friends niece is ill and should be checked over by a doctor before being allowed to fly (she was crying quite loudly and my friends sis in law was trying desperately to calm her).

The stewardess then goes over to the sister in law and asks if the child is ill. The sister-in-law explained that she's not ill and she is crying for her auntie and who is seated upstairs.

Another stewardess then goes upstairs and said that My friend need to go downstairs (she didn't say why and my friend thought it was because they found a seat for her near her family).
In the meantime My friend was not aware of this but the stewardess that was in charge was asking her family to get off the flight and get the child checked by a doctor within the airport. The sister-in-law and brother were saying that the child is not ill and that she is crying because she wants to be seated with her auntie. However they were refusing to listen and said that they must all get off the flight and get the child checked by the doctor within the airport. They were absolutely refusing to listen. They were trying to explain to them that they are travelling with an elderly person and to young children.

As they kept on trying to explain the situation to the stewardess and explain that the child is not ill and she is only upset because she wants to be seated with her auntie, they started getting increasingly rude and saying get out of this plane now. Eventually they had no option but to leave the flight. They went to the medical room and the doctor checked the child and said that there is absolutely no reason why the child cannot fly. They then went back to the check-in desk And they said that as they have missed their flight and that they need to pay a penalty of £200 each. Again they tried to explain the situation to the check in staff and said that they were removed from the flight due to no fault of their own and it was only because a another passenger complained that the small child was ill when she wasn't she was only crying because she wanted to be sat next to her auntie. However once again they were not being reasonable and would not listen to our side. They eventually had to pay £100 per person as a penalty for missing the flight.

When they arrived back at Heathrow, a few pieces of luggage arrived however the reminder of the luggage arrived in dribs and drabs over the next few days delivered to the home address.

My friend has been completely and utterly broken by this whole experience. It has caused her to become ill and she is unable to work because the of the stress this whole situation caused. What would you do in this situation? I was thinking of tagging the airline (emirates) on a Facebook page, however thinking a bit deeper was thinking maybe write to them and see what their response is.

She saying it's not just about the financial loss that they incurred, it's about the stress and ordeal they had to go through with two young children and elderly mother-in-law. All because another person just said that the child was ill. This has completely ruined her holiday and she has just become a recluse and feels like a complete failure for not having managed the situation better at the time. I'm sorry this is such a long post but I just want to get all the details in.

WWYD.

I'd be fuming but not 'unable to work'. There have been times I have been 'unable to work' and this just takes the pIss.

Thanks for the explanations!

Speaking from a professional viewpoint here (flight crew) to offload a family group of 6 and their bags from an A380 would be extremely time consuming. The easiest default is always to try and get the aircraft and all of it's passengers in a fit state to fly. To deviate from this plan incurs time and expense, so considerable effort would have been made to accommodate problematic passengers before the final option of offloading them was acted on. Once the passengers go, the bags also have to be removed. Bags are not 'misloaded all the time' - Heathrow and I am assuming Dubai have extremely sophisticated luggage handling systems and it is an essential part of airline security that unaccompanied bags do not continue their journey once a passenger is not travelling. This is of particular importance in the Middle East.

I am assuming the child was uncontrollable to the point where they were incapable of listening to and understanding any safety instructions. It is an essential part of the contract you enter into with an airline when you book a flight that you comply with any safety instructions. Failure to do so will mean you are refused right to travel. It is the passenger's responsibility to prove that they are able to follow any instructions.

From a personal pov something doesn't add up about this situation. Airlines are obliged by law to accommodate disabled passengers requests (within reason - however it would not have been unreasonable at all to request seating together where a family group with young disabled children need extra attention.) I don't know why it was not possible to seat everyone together - prior request to the airline citing the children's disabilities would have ensured seats together, as would checking in online as soon as online check in opened. It is extremely unusual to offload a whole family just for a crying child.

The airline were not going to take the risk of a divert in case your niece was sick. It costs thousands and can cause chaos for numerous other flights. For all she/he knew she had an ear infection but her parents wanted to stay on board. They are a business at the end of the day. Parents need to learn for this and move on. They need to alert the airline about their additional needs and book seats. Also they need to learn that you do not argue with air attendants, however much you disagree. Lesson learned and they move on.

Your friend needs professional help. If this instance has had such an impact on her she needs professional badly. If I was her I would be focusing on getting this help and forget about the airline.

@backinthebox perfect explanation!

I am assuming that someone of the party started arguing with airline staff. They then find it easier to remove group as another member of the party could cause problems during the flight.

Normally airlines would not remove the whole party because of one child being ?ill. Nor would they charge to move them onto the next flight.

I’ve visited Dubai’s baggage handling system (when the new concourses were at soft opening). It is really amazing!

@backinthebox totally OT but I am fascinated by flying. How would it work for a passenger who was perhaps blind who couldn't watch the safety demonstration? I know there are usually subtitles/ sign language where videos are shown but the same for deaf folk on flights where the crew demonstrate the safety bit?

Each passenger must be given a safety demo. If a passenger's disability means that they need to be given a one to one demo that is what is done. The cabin crew are trained to tailor a demo to a passenger's needs.

Of course! Seems obvious now that would happen

The logistics of flying is absolutely fascinating.

Each passenger must be given a safety demo. If a passenger's disability means that they need to be given a one to one demo that is what is done.

Up to a point.

The issue of safety briefings is regulatory rather more than practical. There's endless discussion about things that almost never happen (landings on water are so incredibly unusual as to be sui generis when they happen) while really common problems (LEAVE YOUR FUCKING BAG BEHIND) aren't stressed enough. Airlines usually brief in the flag language and English where applicable, but many airlines have massively international customers. Emirates, in particular, make massive play of how many languages their crew speak ("today our crew are for 27 countries and speak 42 languages", that sort of thing) but they brief in English and in formal Arabic, only. But....they're a very international airline. It's like the announcements before exams: "DON'T FUCKING CHEAT, YOU KNOW WHAT WE MEAN" gets lost under a load of detail about pencil cases and watches, which are mostly about stopping people from saying "I didn't know" when they're caught rather than actually stopping you from cheating.

Last time I flew long-haul with emirates, you didn't need to pay to pre-book seats together. It's not Ryanair, after all.

Autism does run in families yes, but is the aunt related to the family? As this is the aunt and not the child’s mother

We flew Emirates recently and they gave us our seats at luggage check-in for the return flights - we had pre-booked for the outbound leg. There’s definitely something off with this story, families are seated together as far as I’m aware - unless they were the absolute last people to board and hadn’t pre-booked and there were no seats available together. Having said that, the children & parents WERE together, only extended members were separated. I think this family needs to take responsibility for itself and take this as a learning moment for future travel.

Failing that, Mumsnet will tell you what you should have done, and Doctor Who will lend you a time machine to change the past.

😂😂😂😂

Seriously though, I know you said there's nothing wrong with your friends mental health, but I don't think being "completely broken" and "unable to work" is a normal reaction to the situation. I think she may need to seek some support for her mental health. Like pp have said you know your own child and recently diagnosed or not they should have properly planned for the trip & ensured they had seats together. I think if they complain and your version of events is correct they may be able to get their money back, but all they can take from it is lesson learned and plan properly the next time.

Thread is becoming quite long and no sign of OP

I must say I have loved reading through all your posts. Some have literally made me laugh out loud - the brutal honesty of some of your comments is kind of refreshing to read as one doesn't get that type of honesty in real life.

My friend is putting in an official complaint tomorrow. She needs my help with the technical side of things (scanning and uploading evidence etc), and will come to my house for help with this.

Just to clarify, the Auntie was seated upstairs as her ticket was a standby ticket. She is especially close to the niece and is not her nanny. However she has kind of taken on a second mother kind of role and regularly takes her to nursery, picks her up, the niece has regular sleepovers at the aunts house and this also gives the mum a break as her first child has special needs therefore the mum can pay more attention to the first child.

I'll keep you updated with the reply to the complaint.

Good luck OP

Do standby tickets stil exist?

Unable to work due to this?
A midair security threat, technical fault to the plane, crash landing or some other traumatic high altitude event then understandable. But this? I pity her employer who is paying the sick pay!

I fly frequently with Emirates, they're usually very reasonable, excellent customer care and very child friendly. Surprising

Surely the dad or MIL could've kept the disruption to a minimum and swapped places.....

Daily Mail sad face

A standby ticket? Airlines don’t sell commercial standby tickets. And by the sound of it whatever kind of ticket the auntie was on it was a separate booking to the rest of the family, so technically Emirates have fulfilled their obligation to the family by seating them together but there’s no obligation to seat 2 separate parties on separate bookings together. In fact, on a separate booking there was no need for her to even get off. Unless she was also giving the cabin crew cause for concern?

Maybe Auntie is an off-duty self-employed Emirates pilot on staff standby. Or an Air Marshall.