Has anyone chosen not to allow their daughter to have the hpv vaccine?

[namechanger70]

I am not madly keen on vaccinations per se but if they are necessary then my children will have them. My daughter is due to have the hpv vaccine soon. When I last looked into this several years ago there was a lot of bad news about this vaccine, its use was suspended, albeit temporarily, in some countries and you do not need to look very far to find accounts of tragic consequences for some. How much of this is true and what proportion of people it affects is a moot point.
Is there anyone on here that is knowledgeable on this subject and decided not to vaccinate their children with this vaccine? It is extremely difficult to make an informed decision; many articles may be scaremongering and I don’t think reading official sources is necessarily any better as they are only going to be pro vaccination. Happy to receive any constructive thoughts. Thanks very much.

All these posters saying you wouldn’t allow your child to have it, you do know that if they say they want it they will give them the vaccine anyway under Gillick. At 12-13 they are allowed to make their own medical decisions and they don’t have to disclose any treatment to you.

Yes, they can be judged Gillick (or Fraser) competent. But that has to be an individual assessment if the level of maturity and understanding of the child, and the HCP who make it would need to defend that assessment in court, if the parents challenged it.

And it is on the young side to rely on the person's word about relevant medical history. The person's GP or practice nurse (with access to medical record, which one hopes are up to scratch) probably would. But it's quite unlikely that there wouid time for an adequate competency in the margins of a school programme.

"if DD doesn't have the vaccine it will encourage her to use condoms when she does become sexually active. "

Condoms don't prevent the transmission of HPV.

@Haaris123 why so reticent? What information did your doctor give you about the vac being as risky as HPV that you won't share here? Surely if it's legit information you'd be sharing it with everyone you could.

I've had cervical cancer. Obviously my dd had the vaccine...

It is not a case of being reticent.. I have spoken to actual doctors who have more knowledge on this topic than you or I do to be frank.. There are a lot of studies out there that prove that this vaccine is now damaging than benefitting. I have a busy day today but will hopefully upload the info that I have researched and based my decision later on this evening. Hope everyone has a good day

if DD doesn't have the vaccine it will encourage her to use condoms when she does become sexually active.

If the threat of pregnancy, AIDS, chlamydia etc doesn't encourage her to use condoms why would one more distant and irrelevant factor (to a carefree 16 yr old) make any difference? That line of reasoning is madness.

I'm interested in seeing the easily findable evidence of tragic consequences too. As for the 'moot point' of the proprtion of people affected - of course it's not moot. You make hundreds of risky decisions every day based on what proportion of people are adversely affected. Eg I'll get on a plane because I'm unlikely to die- I'm less likely to ride a motorbike. Doesn't mean I'll automatically die if I ride a motorbike or I won't if I go on a plane, it's just assessing risk isn't it.

www.hse.ie/eng/health/immunisation/hcpinfo/othervaccines/hpv/hpvsafety/

A useful link summarising the research to date. The hpv vaccine is one of the best researched vaccines because of all the antivax scare stories around it and had been found to be safe. Would have no hesitation vaccinating my child

Anti-vaxxers

When your kid gets cervical cancer in their 20s you can print out the HPV side effects to explain why you’re such a bad parent.

Having had abnormal cells come up because of HPV it wouldn’t even cross my mind not to vaccinate my DD

I am under the Family History clinic because there is so much cancer on both sides of my family. My daughter is having her vaccination this week. It was a no-brainer for me.

Yes, there's about 60 different strains of HPV. But only a few of them are associated with cancer (primarily 16 and 18,IIRC), so the first vaccines covered those two and then one or two more strains were added.

Doctors don't necessarily know much about vaccines and some of them believe some of the same myths as other people - I used to have a GP who believed in homeopathy for god's sake. An immunologist or pathologist - like the ones in Public Health England who advise the NHS - would have much more informed opinions.

My daughter will be having the jab. As well as being advised to take up smear tests just in case. For reference, smears no longer rely on staff staring at slides looking for funny-shaped cells (and believe me, the couple hours I had to do that for at uni was more than enough), but now fluorescent dye shows up the dodgy ones - which is why they can use those more gentle brushes rather than the old smearers.

There are a lot of studies out there that prove that this vaccine is now damaging than benefitting

So I searched Pubmed, the world's largest database of medical research abstracts and found no studies that say this. None, zed, zero.

What I did find was this study that consolidates the results of 26 separate trials with 73,438 participants that was published in May of this year. Here it is.

Prophylactic vaccination against human papillomaviruses to prevent cervical cancer and its precursors.

AUTHORS' CONCLUSIONS:

There is high-certainty evidence that HPV vaccines protect against cervical precancer in adolescent girls and young women aged 15 to 26. The effect is higher for lesions associated with HPV16/18 than for lesions irrespective of HPV type. The effect is greater in those who are negative for hrHPV or HPV16/18 DNA at enrolment than those unselected for HPV DNA status. There is moderate-certainty evidence that HPV vaccines reduce CIN2+ in older women who are HPV16/18 negative, but not when they are unselected by HPV DNA status. We did not find an increased risk of serious adverse effects. Although the number of deaths is low overall, there were more deaths among women older than 25 years who received the vaccine. The deaths reported in the studies have been judged not to be related to the vaccine. Increased risk of adverse pregnancy outcomes after HPV vaccination cannot be excluded, although the risk of miscarriage and termination are similar between trial arms. Long-term of follow-up is needed to monitor the impact on cervical cancer, occurrence of rare harms and pregnancy outcomes.

So I am quite interested to see the research alluded to by Haaris123 that purports to show that the risks of these vaccines outweigh the benefits in reduced morbidity and mortality from disease prevention. What a shame she was too busy to share it.

Having seen a loved one experience HPV caused throat cancer I would urge everyone to get their children (boys and girls) vaccinated.

I think its madness not to vaccinate, but I am linked to work on the vaccines. Apart from anything else, if you are in the UK your daughter does not need your permission. She can verify that she has made the decision herself.

I can only say that we are being asked to consent to the vaccine and she is year 8.

If parents refuse to consent, and the subject (under age 16) wishes to be vaccinated, they can give their own consent citing Gillick competence.

So someone searched PUBMED - I searched for 2 mins and came across this official statement from the government backed CDC in the USA:
www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/vaccines/hpv/hpv-safety-faqs.html

"Have serious adverse events been reported after people receive HPV vaccines?
Over 100 million doses of HPV vaccines were distributed in the United States from June 2006 through December 2017. To date, most of CDC’s HPV vaccine safety monitoring and research has focused on Gardasil because it has accounted for the majority of HPV vaccine doses distributed in the United States. These safety efforts continue, now focusing on Gardasil 9.

Among all reports to the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) following HPV vaccines, the most frequently reported symptoms overall were dizziness; fainting; headache; nausea; fever; and pain, redness, and swelling in the arm where the shot was given. Of the reports to VAERS, 6% were classified as “serious.” About 22% of the VAERS reports were not related to health problems, but were reported for reasons such as improper vaccine storage or the vaccine being given to someone for whom it was not recommended.

Which adverse events are considered “serious”?
By regulation, an adverse event is defined as serious if it involves any of the following outcomes: death, a life-threatening adverse event, a persistent or significant disability or incapacity, a congenital anomaly or birth defect, hospitalization, or prolongation of existing hospitalization"

I think it is too simple to say there is no damage - what would the 6% serious adverse effects be to fit the above criteria?

Like reddwarves I was just young enough to get it when they started offering it in Australia. I’m grateful every single time Pap smears come up in conversation or my thoughts that my risks are so low. Any daughter of mine (or son if possible) will have it.

Very interested in this gynae ckinic where every single staff member is adamant tgey won't vaccinate.

But then i work in a head and neck cancer unit and all the staff i know vaccinate their girls and many including me paid for their boys to be vaccinated. Delighted that boys will now be vaccinated due to ballooning numbers of hpv related head and neck cancer. Hope to vaccinate ourselves out of a job.

Hope to vaccinate ourselves out of a job

I think the issue is that having the vaccination will probably lead to a false sense of security - some cervical cancers are caused by other things other than HPV and I suppose smears will still be necessary, maybe not so often. I certainly think a quick injection is much better than the discomfort of smears for years though.

Hpv os far from the only cause of head and neck cancer (not cervical cancer) but with smoking rates falling and hpv total vaccination coverage, numbers should fall hugely.

Our GP is an immunologist and I had a very lengthy discussion with him about the vaccine and he 100% endorsed it so DD, now 1st year secondary 13yrs has just had hers in the past month through the school. She has had no ill effects other than a localised sore arm for a day or so. in fact they also gave a tetanus booster and that arm was more painful.

I am very happy that she has had the vaccine. I am a huge believer in them and am ever thankful that our children do not have to suffer from many of the fatal illnesses from bygone days.

My SIL is an ardent campaigner against the vaccine so we do not discuss it!

I honestly don’t understand anyone who wouldn’t take reasonable steps, freely available, to help them prevent their children suffering from a horrible disease.

There is a very special place in hell for Wakefield and the anti-vaccine culture he started.

@namechanger70

I've worked in pharmaceuticals my entire working life.

I'd like to make you aware of the way an adverse reaction is reported.

Say I take a medicine. I then go to my doctor and say that I've come out in a rash. The doctor has to report that I took that medication and I now have a rash. All the data will be collated by the pharmaceutical company and the law states they must update the patient information leaflet and advise..

For example .....
undesirable effects
Rash-
Common, more than 1 in 10,000 will experience a rash.

For safely these things have to be reported. It's not always possible to prove or disprove whether this was directly relating to the drug taken.

So if someone is given a drug and they die. This could/should be reported, incase this is related. Obviously trials are very small compared to general population so it's important these things are monitored closely. Also, people in trials are healthy people on no other medication, with no medial conditions. So these things are monitored closely to get an idea of how different drugs can affect different conditions.

Also, a lot of vaccines will say they cause syncope (fainting) this is not necessarily related to the drug but the needle. But because it's a common occurrence, it's listed.