5 months into '2 under 2' and it's still shit

[Makon]

I have two children separated by about 17 months and it's still not getting any better. For the first few weeks I kept telling myself it would be fine soon: my eldest wouldn't be stuck in front of videos every day, we would eat proper meals three times a day, we would leave the house for at least an hour every day etc. But time has dragged on and on now and I'm still a shit, shit, shit "housebound" mother.

I'm breastfeeding my youngest but she's shit at it (everything medical checked, suspected milk intolerance so I'm dairy free) and she also hates buggies and the car. She tolerates a carrier for around an hour before I have to take her out and carry her. Which is of course not practical with a toddler. She screams as soon as I open the car door and doesn't stop until I take her out. We've changed car seats twice. She doesn't ever tire herself out like other babies. Her record is 35 minutes of screaming before I had to stop for fear of smashing my car into a wall. I leave the house very rarely because of this, and normally only on the rare occasions when I can find someone else to come with.

My eldest goes to nursery one full day a week which is all we can afford, and because when I return to work next year it will be the only day we need it for her. I also attend a PND group for two hours a week on the insistence of my concerned HV, but I'm not depressed, just annoyed that my baby is difficult when everyone else's just sit quietly in their prams, or at least sleep in the car!

My husband works various shifts so I can sometimes not really see him for days on end, or for only a few good waking hours a week. My family are very supportive but I feel like a failure for putting myself on them. I try groups but leaving the house is just SO difficult because of the way my youngest is, and the thought of trying to control the eldest while the youngest screams in front of a room full of people makes me cry.

To sum up, I currently spend 3-5 days inside for the entire day. My almost two year old usually has a dummy in and sits in front of Mr Tumble or Bing for 70% of the day while I feed the baby and hold her (because it's the only way she will sleep and not scream). Please dear God someone tell me they've been in at least a slightly similar situation and that it will improve. If not I feel I may as well give my eldest up for adoption.

(This post was intended more of a rant than anything so it's been marginally therapeutic just getting it out!)

I too, only have one child. He was absolutely foul for well over a year. Nothing I did was ever good enough, he cried, whinged and screamed at pretty much everything despite my best efforts.

We were also housebound for a lot of that time because it was so bloody hard trying to go anywhere.

He had to be kept in a strict routine to have any chance of making it through the day. I would have loved to be that mum whose baby could just fall asleep anywhere, happily, then wake up happy and smiley. Sadly, it was not to be!

I'm sorry I don't have any advice, just sympathy because I appreciate how hard it is.

Yup it's really shit!

If breastfeeding isn't work then swap to formula.

Are there any toddler groups you can get to? A fussy baby is much easier in company, and someone might actually hold them for 5 mins!

Hang on in there. Once you get to a year it gets easier, slowly.

Take any help you can, and don't be afraid to ask. Can the grandparents take the toddler out to give you some head space? You'll feel less guilty about the tv then! X

I really do appreciate the solidarity. I don't know anyone else with such a small age gap between theirs so I think I just feel like I'm doing an awful job all the time.

My first one was also a rubbish baby unfortunately but because it was just the one I didn't feel so guilty about sitting down and watching boxsets and not leaving the house!

I really feel for you, my two had 15 months between them and that first year was hell.

I was determined to BF my first and specialists said it was all good, latch on great etc, was gaining weight. But was so unsettled and just didn't sleep. I switched to bottle feeding and she was a different baby! Slept, giggled, was generally content. I truly believe she was hungry when I was BF.

Hope it gets better soon.

Nappies. Honestly, it gets so much easier once you're not feeling like you're constantly changing nappies. You'll wonder what to do with all the spare time once they're both toilet trained

11 month gap here (yes I do have a telly ).

They’re 4 and 5 now and it’s waaaaay easier. I look back at the first year and think “how the fuck did I get through that?”

Sorry if that’s not very comforting OP, but honestly it does get better.

Oh god yes to nappies! DS2 got out of nappies in May and I realised I’d spent 5 straight years changing nappies. 3 of them with 2 in nappies!

This will either appeal to you...or it won't...but here goes. When my first 2 were small, I had to do everything in order, regulated, every day. The youngest (the most fretful and difficult) eventually 'learnt' our schedule and managed to relax a bit, but it was for the toddlers sake really, that we had to do stuff (baby would have been happier sat on me all day, everyday)

So, every week day, I would get up and sort myself out first. I gave myself 2 mins to shower, 5 mins to dress, then bring baby next to me in cot / buggy whatever, whilst I did my hair / make up / tidied my room. Toddler was happy with a bottle and screen during this time. I had to prioritise getting myself ready over her protests because if I didn't, I felt awful for the rest of the day- on the back foot if you like. ( I figured if she was a twin, she'd have to wait whilst I was seeing to the other one..so the 'me' time was justified!)

Then, we would do breakfast, tidy, and go out- regardless for how long, or where. A walk, a shop, playgroup, friends, whatever. And be back for midday- regardless of meltdowns / explosive nappies (Pack a good well stocked bag the night before!)- whatever- toddler then could have lunch and a nap, and it was only 6 hours to get through at home for me until I could start the bedtime wind down.

And repeat. It sounds like Groundhog Day, but it saved my sanity in the end. Feeling forced to stay in because of the needy baby was driving me to distraction and wasn't fair on the toddler. The baby eventually learnt the cues (signing even at this age helps, btw) and even though she continued to protest, I continued.

If you are despairing at home, id really urge you to think about planning your days and just going for it- yes some days will be a disaster- but with the darker days coming, it's so important you get out. And it does get easier.

Remember you are doing a great job- you can do this! Be kind to yourself.

We have a two year gap. A sling is a good shout! Maybe see if you can find a nice playgroup? I found one that is run by retired ladies who would always cuddle my small one or help my big one with crafts. Other mums were sympathetic and helpful too! Good luck with the switch to formula - I take my hat off to anyone who can BF a small one with a toddler underfoot, I found the sleep deprivation made me a miserable Mum to both. We were all far happier with the switch to formula when DP could help and feeds were less frequent!

Oh and for trips out find small enclosed parks and very small soft plays that your big one can navigate alone. I found I felt better when I forced myself to leave the house once every morning.

My girls were both like this, harder with the second obviously. Wore her in a sling to cook etc. Baby will start to enjoy trips out more now and even if screams on way, I think it's best to do it. Mine was really bad in the car until age 2.

Sounds like your youngest is still reacting to something. I would switch to formula and try and get a dairy and soya free or even better hydroysed protein one. The car seat screaming is a give away, if their tummy is sore, sitting like that crunches it and makes it more uncomfortable.

If your Mum will come over, ask her if she will come for 3 mornings a week for the next 3 weeks. Ask her if she will take one or other of the dc out of the house to do something so that you can have one on one time with the other for the 2 ish hours. Toddler can go to the park with her, baby can go for a walk in the buggy.

If you are going to switch the baby to formula, go cold turkey. Use a breast pump to take the edge off if you get engorged, but dont drain your breasts.
MAKE sure you are taking a multi vitamin with iron and have a glass of wine in the evening, you are earning it!

There are 17 months between mine and having 2 under 2 and then 2 toddlers was the hardest thing I've ever done. I felt like I was trapped: a slave to the routine. I couldn't go out because the baby would scream in the car. I couldn't go out in the morning because the baby needed to nap. I couldn't go out at dinnertime because the eldest would nap. The afternoon was a write off because the baby would fed/spew/scream/repeat for hours.

I couldn't take them out together by myself because the oldest would run amok and the baby would do the world's biggest, sloppiest and stinkiest poos and I'd have to try to change the nappy whilst simultaneously stop the toddler opening the door and running off - those chairs on the wall in some baby change rooms where you could tie up your toddler were a godsend!

The only saving grace was that they both slept 7-7 overnight.

It didn't really get easier until I went back to work and the nursery got the baby weaned onto solids within 3 weeks of turning 6 months. At one, the baby learned to walk and could play and interact with me and their sibling. At two they entertained each other and going to the park was a rather pleasant affair. Now, at 6&7, they're really close. They argue like cat and dog and do my head in but it's nothing like those awful, boring, frustrating and lonely days on my own with 2 preschoolers.

Has silent reflux been ruled out? My dd was just like your dd. Screamed whatever you did with her and also had/has a milk allergy. Silent reflux is common with cmpa babies. Is she worst when flat or does she do little gulps? We Didn't get my dd's meds right until she was 9 months, but she suddenly started sleeping sometimes!

Ok, I have no experience of 2 under 2 but my one baby was a nightmare - would not be put in a sling, would not go in a moses basket/crib/cot, would not be put down, SCREAMED in his car seat until we either arrived at our destination (if it was close) or he threw up and hated his buggy. He also did not sleep through (still doesn't) so I was knackered and honestly didn't really go out much or too far unless it was the weekend and DH could help. I have to say, 6.5 months was a turning point - he finally would nap in the buggy and car seat only if very, very tired but better than nothing at all. And 12months was better again when he finally would do a 5/6 hour stint at night meaning I could actually sleep longer than 2 hours at a time. He is now 15mo - still doesn't sleep through but so much better. I would have been exactly in the same boat if I'd had 2 so I think you are doing amazingly! I'm sure it will get better! Also personally I found 5mo such a shit age - no longer newborn yet not mobile so dealing with their boredom and frustration as well as everything else is a real nightmare! It's a tricky phase but hopefully will be over soon.

It actually sounds like you're doing a great job! I have one under two and that's plenty enough work. Give yourself some credit. Watching CBeebies isn't the end of the world.

17 month age gap here too. Currently at 4 months and 21 months so very similar! I don’t have much to add to what PP have said. Massive solidarity from me! DD2 is also a car hater and nap refuser. Have you got friends who can just pop round for a cuppa - ideally with kids a similar age to your older one? I have a few NCT friends (from first time round) who will come over, kids will play together happily, fellow mum will hold the baby for a bit and I’ll relish a bit of adult chat!

I make sure I have an activity planned every day, whether it’s a friend popping over or going out to playgroup. If we stay home for a day I feel really stressed and stir crazy. DH is out 13 hours every day and I need to see another adult.

I experimented with a dance class and music class but both were disastrous! I prefer playgroup with DD1 as she’s very active and just wants to run around, not listen to any instructions. I don’t know where you live but I’m lucky that playgroups are ten a penny round here and I’ve asked a few mums for their phone numbers on a whim. I don’t think I’d get through without friends/ acquaintances.

Massive solidarity. I had a bigger gap but felt crap in comparison to mums with only one toddler while we did not much and watched a lot of tv with dummy in.
My youngest had awful colic and screaming and also hated the car and buggy. It was hell and I felt guilty about everything.
I know it won't help but in a couple of years you'll be so glad of the small gap when your friends are going back into the baby stage!
For now, try breaking up the day with some simple stuff. I used to buy some digestives and ready made icing and let toddler 'cook' or just get play doh out or silly things like let them go through the spice cupboard! And even a trip out in the garden when it's wet breaks the day up, or a bath for toddler. Don't be scared of the toddler being annoyed when the tv is off!
It's so hard, you're not a bad mum, give yourself a break it won't always be like this! Keep going to the doc about the little one of the screaming doesn't improve x

I had 3 under 3. 33 months from the birth of dc1 to dc3. 12 months exactly between dc2 and dc3.

Feed your eldest lasagne main meal for breakfast. Don't give them breakfast then when they are looking for food give them their main meal. It doesnt matter what time it is. Then you have ticked one big box.

When you get a minute first thing make a packed lunch for toddler. Then toast or weetabix for dinner.

Babygrows for the baby. And a baby swing. Get a cheap second hand one.

Yes to pp who said go everyday to asda for one thing. Even the post box to post a blank piece of paper.

I promise it gets easier. Do you have a cafe easily to get to? I'd take a soap bag of toys for your big one whilst you just sit.

And a thermal mug for you to always have a cup of tea!

It's too 'woo' for some, but have you considered cranial osteopathy?

I just just have the one, my 14 month old daughter, and she was a devil baby. I hated her. I regretted having her. She spent all her time screaming and could never be left kicking on a play mat or snoozing in her pram like my friends’ babies. I just couldn’t believe I’d got it so wrong and brought this curse into our charmed lives.

Honestly, she’s now amazing. My mum calls her the changeling, as she refuses to believe she’s the same baby as that devil we had for the first six months.

What changed? I think it was three things:

1. she learnt to sit up - revelation!! She had silent reflux, so being upright all the time was a tonic, but being able to do something so independent as sit up was amazing for her.

2. cut down/stopped EBF by 7 months. God, I wish I’d done it sooner. It was a nightmare for us from day one, but stubborn ol bint here refused to give up. Cue pain, suffering, PND, resentment. I know my experience is not universal, but things got so much better when someone else could feed her.

3. sleep training/own room/falling asleep alone - we tried all the gentle stuff to encourage her to nap other than in a sling. We spent two hours on Christmas Eve stroking and singing to a roaring baby. As soon as we let her fall asleep on her own in her own room after a bit of fussing and crying, she slept like a dream, naps and overnight. Still does 95% of the time. And getting our sleep back has made us feel normal.

So that’s my ridiculously long story.

TLDR: nightmare baby turned dream baby at seven months, nature and nurture both played a role 👍🏻 Hang in there xxx

Thank you all so much for your kind words. I have actually tried cranial osteopathy and it still did nothing, and she was on ranitidine for 3 months. She has just come off because it also did nothing despite her being on the maximum dosage. I do think it is silent reflux but the medicines don't seem to work and she's not a sicky baby (unless she's in the car when she makes herself sick from coughing so much) so I don't think thickening type things would work. I am really hoping she gets better when she sits up. She's rolling at the moment and not far off.

I do have a fair few playgroups around but no idea which ones would be any good for the two of them and I get really panicky thinking about going anywhere alone with them because they both cause different problems; I think I would burst into tears if they both played up at the same time!

My parents both work full time in pretty intense jobs, as does my husband, so whereas I'm lucky in a way as they have different random days off through the week, none of them can help a great deal. Also my children are 2 of 13 cousins so my parents can't help out too often, and their other grandparents live abroad. I do have sisters-in-law who are very helpful, but who are also back at work so struggling with their own children too!

I never did any of the NCT type things as most of my friends are through work, though none have young children unfortunately. I'm not a typically maternal person either and I think I would struggle to make conversations at groups as I always feel a bit awkward!

The comments around breastfeeding and weaning have been very helpful. She's showing a lot of interest in food and is sitting up supported at the moment so she's not far off thankfully. I think I need to seek some advice about the best way to swap to formula and, fingers crossed, that will help.

I would ask around to find out which toddler groups have lots of helpers. I go to one church one where there are loads of helpers who will play with your 2 year old or do activities with them while you walk a crying baby around or hold a baby while you do something with your toddler. I know it’s really tough getting out but I feel better about TV if we have been out.

I also know that I can tolerate 15 minutes of screaming in the car. So I did drove, but limited myself to short distances and them that felt like a wasn’t being too mean on baby or too mean on toddler for not getting out.

I wonder if you’re baby is hard at home they might as well be out somewhere also being hard work but you’re toddler will benefit, as long as you don’t get too exhausted?

It does sound incredibly difficult, and I really appreciate its hard to make changes or even think when life is so hard.

Ranitidine didn't do much for my dd, nor did gaviscon. omeperazole max dose did work though! My dd was very rarely sick. Sorry, but being able to sit up didn't really help my dd, just getting the mess right. She was like a whole different child. Everyone said so. Obviously silent reflux might not be what your dd has but I think it's worth another try at the gp. I was so angry at myself when we finally got the right meds as I'd been asking the gp for help, even the specific medication, but let them fob me off every time. Also you need to cut out tomatoes, chocolate onions etc as they're acidic, even in breast milk. Sorry! Worth a try.

Just from a CMPA point of view if moving onto cows milk formula this definitely could be contributing to baby's unhappiness and general difficulty. Also it's not uncommon to have issues with soya as well.

Just wanted to say that until we got my sons CMPA under control going out with him was impossible due to the screaming and hating everything - plus the puke and poo and constant nature of that.

Good luck!!