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Guest blog: why aren't we protecting children from porn?

140 replies

KateMumsnet · 24/05/2013 17:40

A report published today by the govt's Children Commissioner found that children are increasingly exposed to extreme pornography online - and that it's influencing their attitudes towards sex. In this guest blog, Sunday Times columnist (and MN Blogger) Eleanor Mills says it's time to put the protection of children first.

What do you think? Let us have your thoughts on the thread - and if you blog on this issue, don't forget to post your URL.

"Basically, Porn Is Everywhere is the title of a new report published today, from the Office of the Children's Commissioner. It reviews 41,000 pieces of research on the impact of porn and finds that widespread access to porn amongst youngsters is encouraging teenage boys to see girls as sex objects , engage in risky sexual behaviour and have sex earlier. Most worrying of all, it also shows a link between boys who view porn and more aggressive sexual behaviour and violence.

I'm tempted to say I told you so. For the past three years now I have been writing regularly about what I call Generation XXX (£) and the problems the tsunami of online porn is creating for today's teenagers and their relationships. These days everything from television to music videos, Instagram to the mania for sexting demonstrates the pervasive pornification of youth culture. Yet on we trundle, seemingly indifferent to its pernicious effects. Maybe now the naysayers will agree that there is a problem and take the appropriate action.

The writing has been on the wall about the harm done to youngsters who view adult sexual content on the web for a while. A few months ago, I attended a conference at the University of London's psychology department entitled Virtual Adolescence. As the day unfolded a succession of speakers, including Professor Alessandra Lemma (a world expert on body image and mental disorders) and John Woods, a consultant psychotherapist at the Portman Clinic in London, outlined the mental toll that screen life is taking on our children.

The stand-out talk of the day, given by Woods, was called Child Abuse on a Massive Scale: The Effects of Unregulated Pornography. It made for worrying listening.

Woods cited a study by HealthyMind.com which found the average age of first exposure to such images is six (other recent research has suggested the average age is eight) and that the largest consumers of internet porn are the 12-17 age group. These alarming figures are backed up by a new EU Kids Online survey which found that pornographic and violent content top a list of children's own internet concerns (57% say concerns about internet content "most bothered" people of their age).

In his lecture Woods outlined some disturbing examples from his clinical practice including 'James', whose long-term porn fascination led him to assault a five-year-old boy 'because he wanted to know what it felt like'. James, 16, had watched so much porn, Woods said, that he had "no idea the other person needed to give consent to be penetrated".

Another boy, Jeremy, 14, was "driven mad" by his compulsion to view illegal images; before the police confiscated his computer he had been spending at least two hours a night on increasingly violent porn websites while his parents thought he was doing his homework. During his therapy with Woods, Jeremy explained that the only way he could control the images that kept returning to his mind of animals, kids, stabbing and strangling was to 'switch the computer back on, as then the images were back there' rather than in his head.

I fail to understand how a society that insists on a 9pm watershed for swearing on television and rates cinematic content with 18 certificates so adult material is not seen by children, is so callously slack about the tsunami of brutal, violent porn available with two clicks of a mouse. This bafflement was widely shared at the conference. Woods, who treats young teen sex offenders, likened the inability of society to get a grip on the harm being done to a kind of 'mass psychosis'.

Why do we let it slide? The first reason is ignorance: many parents equate porn with the top-shelf centrefolds of their own youth, unaware of the smorgasbord of violent perversion so easily available on the internet. Attempts by the government, led by the MP Claire Perry, to establish an 'opt-in' system for the internet (the default setting for an internet feed would be porn-free unless users specifically asked for adult material, in which case they would have to prove they were over 18) has failed. The government, under pressure from internet service providers, has instead gone for a weaker system that prompts new users of broadband to set up parental controls on individual computers.

"That is inadequate, completely inadequate," countered Diane Abbott, the shadow public health minister, when I popped in to see her in Westminster. "The opt-in is so important. The problem with relying on parental controls is that every self-respecting child can get round them." That's why a new system, whereby internet service providers can give households who want it a clean feed - ie one without porn, so adults can opt-in for porn if they want to rather than children coming across it when they don't want to - is, in my view, so important.

Abbott sees internet porn as a public health matter. Since she spoke out about this at the Fawcett Society last month she has been taken aback by her postbag: "I've had hundreds of letters - they are really touching because they are not part of some orchestrated campaign but are from genuine women describing their distress at the pornification of culture and the sexualisation of women and girls that goes hand in hand with it.

"People think when you raise this that you're complaining about pictures of girls with bare breasts. Well, I'm not particularly concerned about bare breasts. What these children are seeing online is of an entirely different order; it is really horrible stuff which brutalises and degrades women. There'z a link between exposure to that sort of pornography and violence within relationships."

Abbott is right about that. Woods cited research that shows adolescents who watch internet pornography not only "relax their boundaries towards sexual violence" but are also more likely to "see women as sex objects and engage in risk- taking behaviours such as unprotected sex".

The Icelandic government is so concerned about the way violent internet porn seems to stoke sexual aggression that it is considering becoming the first democracy in the western world to ban online pornography. "We are a progressive, liberal society when it comes to nudity, to sexual relations, so our approach is not anti-sex but anti- violence," says Halla Gunnarsdottir, an adviser to the interior minister. Porn in this definition is not sexually explicit material but images that show hateful, violent sex.

That is exactly what the internet is awash with. So when children click on porn out of a natural curiosity to find out about sex (sex is the most common word typed into search engines), what they find isn't loving, consensual acts - albeit of a raunchy nature - but the most outré acts you can imagine (and many you can't).

The fact that society does not attempt to control or ban the extreme material that is so easily available sends our young people the message that it's standard to have group sex - and that violence is acceptable. Understandably, young people are confused, frightened and disturbed by what they see. Add arousal to that mix (patterns of early sexual arousal tend to stick for life) and it's not surprising that psychologists are worried.

Of course, it is oversimplistic to say that if you watch a rape-style fantasy online you immediately go out and commit one - but what a range of experts are beginning to agree upon is that widespread consumption of internet pornography, particularly at a tender age, shifts the way people think about intimacy, relationships and women. (Gail Dines, author of Pornland, describes just how porn hooks young men in in this article I published last week in the Sunday Times News Review. [£])

A good barometer of porn's influence is the fact that young people, raised on hairless porn stars, spend vast amounts of time and money having their pubic hair removed for fear of being seen as unattractive. Similarly, psychologists commonly report adolescents seeing sex as all about performance - ie, does it look like the porn they have seen? - rather than it being about a connection with the other person or pleasure.

Teens are caught in a web of pornified norms: sexting, indulging in unsafe sexual behaviour and generally feeling freaked out by 'expectations' implicit in the material they are viewing. I met one 14-year-old who was being sent porn clips by her boyfriend as prompts to what he wanted them to do that Saturday night. Woods, too, spoke of how porn spills over into reality, telling of a 17-year-old boy who reported himself for treatment because he had started following women down the street and was frightened he might "go further" in acting out his porn-fuelled fantasies.

Woods spoke passionately of the need to educate people about the risks of teen porn consumption, to support research that examines the effects of internet pornography and to "legally implement technological solutions that separate internet content, allowing consumers to choose the type of legal content they wish to have access to" - in other words, an 'opt-in' system.
It's up to all of us to make it happen.

I feel so strongly about all of this that on 2pm on June 11th at the offices of the think tank Policy Exchange in central London, I'm organising a conference on the subject, entitled Generation XXX. Attendees include MPs Claire Perry and Diane Abbott and Gail Dines, author of PornLand, an American academic who has led the charge on the damaging effects of porn. Dr John Woods from the Portman clinic, whose talk I mention above, will also be speaking - alongside some of the youth workers dealing with the fall-out from all of this on the front line. If you would like tickets (which are free) contact [email protected]."

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OP posts:
Sheila · 27/05/2013 09:23

FairPhyllis - totally agree with you but please remember that it's boys who need protecting too.

pinkballetflats · 27/05/2013 09:57

So we have a blunt instrument that bans anything that could look remotely like it could be unsuitable for children....it really does sound good but for the fact that one couldn't even (with the way current filters work) google their favourite football team. I smu understanding correct there?

And then we have the problem that we can put legislature in place within our jurisdiction, but someone else in another jurisdiction with different laws could upload something, and call it something that seems innocuous enough, and hey presto - it's there for children to come across.

Then we have incidents such as this one...

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2011/10/17/sesame-street-youtube-cha_n_1015076.html

how would the filtering systems stop that?

The man who installed my new broadband the other day talked to me about their opt in system and told me that it won't stop everything - his daughter was looking for Peppa Pig on youtube and someone had uploaded a video of Peppa Pig and dubbed it...how do we stop that? Guess youtube (with all it's very useful videos - eg maths games, solar system videos, science experiments for kids etc that we regularly use) needs to be banned.

Is there anything that could be put in place to filter the offensive stuff without getting rid of good, useful information?

It seems to me that there isn't, and there possibly can't be? Unless some one somewhere can come up with an implant for each individual parent that can be connected directly to the internet and a filter system and can automatically read our thoughts on what we dont' want our children to see and instantly block any image and/or text that fits with our values.

I don't want my child seeing disturbing stuff - but relying on filters, governments etc to put measures in place will only do so much, and it seems a lot of it is pretty ineffective.

Do we ban the internet all together? And if we did, when that didn't work because people are till allowed to buy magazines/DVDs/Books etc do we ban those forms of information dissemination too...

And when that doesn't work because people are people and there are criminals and sickos out there who won't let something as trivial at the banning of various communication mediums get in their way, do we then just lock our kids in their rooms and not let them out till they are 18?

The only thing I can see that would be truly helpful is education - of parents and of children.

FairPhyllis · 27/05/2013 10:02

Oh I do agree that boys are affected negatively by porn too. Porn culture seeks to control the way boys' sexuality develops and pushes them into harmful gender roles. But I am coming at this from the pov that the negative effects of porn are on the whole stronger for women and girls. Because porn on the whole tells men 'you can have whatever turns you on sexually' while women are told 'your role in sex is facilitating men's wants'.

MoreCrackThanHarlem · 27/05/2013 11:35

Raven, could you explain in simple terms the problems arising from automatic filtering? I don't know enough about it to be clear on the issues.

I agree with you, I am angry about the accessibility, acceptability and nature of porn.
It's not comparable to sickness bugs or headlice. My daughter's first experience of sex/viewing explicit material was nasty, aggressive and frightening. Who knows how this will shape her feelings about sexuality? I certainly can't change that with a nit comb.

libertarianj, I absolutely believe you are wrong.
The article you linked to contains research suggesting porn is shaping children's sexuality.
Aside from this, I see the effects regularly in my work (CP and safeguarding related). I am managing at least one or two situations each week where children are discussing or disclosing to adults their experiences of pornography.
I am also seeing increased amounts of sexualised behaviour.

BoneyBackJefferson · 27/05/2013 18:55

No one has yet mentioned the difficulties that smart phones bring to this.

pinkballetflats · 27/05/2013 19:53

Boney - DP and I were discussing this the other day...DC is not yet 10 and I know some children have smart phones at that age (I feel it's too young personally)

I am with one mobile phone provider who has automatic filtering of anything dubious and I've used them enough online to feel that for the most part it seems to work - for example I can still search for things such as Arsenal, breast etc...although homebirth videos are out...this provider I am with requires you to provide bank account details to prove you are over 18 for access to adult content...but that doesn't get rid of problmes such as youtube feeds getting hijacked and kids using their phones to video/photograph inappropriate behaviour and post it online...the CEOP youtube channel has a very good series of videos surrounding kids posting online videos and how easily things can get out of hand...

again I come back to educating parents and children and giving ids the tools they can use to protect themselves because it is impossible to protect anyone 100% from anything.

BoneyBackJefferson · 27/05/2013 20:10

Some providers now share signals, you could be bounced from a provider that has blocks to one that doesn't. Or even children unlocking their phone and putting a different sim card in.

There is still the issue that children are walking around with mobile computers in their pockets. You can still facebook, email, send and recieve videos from 'friends'.

Many sites have sites set up for mobiles (piratebay got around the ban for a while by becoming .se) and you can still use proxy servers and set up a vpn tunnel from your phone.

Remember as well that if your child takes their phone cable into school and the school hasn't blocked the usb ports for storage devices they can run browsers that the school ICT systems cannot recognise and therefore cannot stop.

pinkballetflats · 27/05/2013 20:23

I really really think it's a bad idea for schools to allow phones with picture, video and internet capabilities....but again, apart form just banning them what do they do about the kids who flaunt the rule?

Julierose · 27/05/2013 20:28

This topic has been worrying me for a while. I monitor my son and daughter's internet use, have placed parental locks on their phones and try very hard to strike a balance between good parenting and authoritive policing.

However, when my children are with their friends - at school or their homes - I cannot control their access to online filth. I do not feel 100% confident that they are are safely protected from it. And as such what options do I have? Ban them from going to friends' houses? Many parents may work hard to protect their children, but it takes only one parent's unintentional complacency to unravel everything.

As a parent I really do feel as though both my hands are tied when it comes to protecting my children from accessing online porn.

ravenAK · 27/05/2013 21:31

MoreCrack - this article sums it up quite well.

Basically:

  1. any even vaguely effective filter would block so much innocuous & useful content that it would make just about everyone 'opt in' within days. We have a strict filter at work (I'm a teacher). Obvious reasons why it's there, but it's a complete PITA - it won't let me on youtube to show poetry analysis videos to my GCSE group, for example.

  2. Luckily, albeit hardly in the spirit of the thing, I can always just ask the nearest kid the address of the current proxy route to any site I wanted to access. The IT techies play perpetual whackamole blocking proxies - the kids are perpetually about five steps ahead. If they put half as much ingenuity & knowhow into revising for their exams...

  3. A false sense of security is never a good thing where kids are concerned. Technologically naive parents will rely on the 'great firewall' - & will have no idea that every 7 yo in the country is bypassing it with ease.

www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2010/dec/20/web-filtering-will-not-work

rioannie · 28/05/2013 00:18

I think it is shocking with lads mags and abuse of women in this day and age. Men have lost their control and identity which is why they are either gay or abuses. Not all of them but women have to accept that decent law abiding men who respect women are few and far and this stems from women having a distorted view of control of sex and porn. Women will and can never be in control of porn by its very nature and we are causing our own damage of future generations by our own distorted views. Accept that u are not in control by showing your tits. Men are!!!!

inraolyn · 28/05/2013 10:39

I didn't see any porn of any sort until I was in my late teens/early twenties (I am now 26). I put this down to not having had internet access at home, and being the sort of sheltered child who had no idea about lads' magazines.

I found some romance fiction in my late teens (you know, Mills & Boon type stuff) and I had a sort of shame-faced addiction to it. I read the books but I was terrified of my mum finding out because I figured it was something bad.

My sex education consisted of the school biology stuff and the pretty much useless "how it all works". My mum handed me a book to explain the rest and I was too mortified to have been given a book with the word "sex" on the cover to even open it. She never asked me about it again.

Now, I would say I was about as protected from porn and sex as you can get. My own initial forays into my own sexuality were as a result full of shame and the conviction that there must be something wrong with me, and no one must ever find out. (This is something of a tangent, but bear with me. I promise I have a point.) I consider myself the equivalent of the girl whose parents opted out of porn on the internet (should such a filter ever actually work. I doubt it will). I didn't have a mobile until I was 16 (they'd been common when I was 12 or so) and I only visited friends very sparingly and had limited access to credit.

So did my mum protect me from the big bad world? Nope. My dad was more laid back; we used to watch things like the Terminator films at dinnertime, though we never watched stuff of a sexual nature and he never really mentioned it (I guess he figured my sister and I were girls and my mum was dealing with that so it wasn't his place). He did express concerns that we (particularly me, as my sister had a wider circle of friends and I was a bookworm) were too naive and wouldn't know how to cope with the Real World (TM). And you know what? He was right.

When I was 18 I almost had unprotected sex with a guy I'd met that day because he had bought me drinks and gotten me tipsy, and I had no idea that was a thing. All I knew about drink safety was about drinks being spiked, not about just being gotten drunk enough to be more suggestible. I was lucky I sobered up a bit on the walk to the hotel, but it was a close, close thing.

I then entered into a relationship with my XH, who was far more sexually experienced than I was (he knew I was a virgin when we met) and who acted as though my not doing this or that was me being unusual. I was pressured into anal sex, and into simulated rape, and to considering a lot more, not because I wanted to, but because he wanted to. And I thought that probably I was the one with the problem, because of course he knew a lot more than me. What I thought or what I felt, those things didn't matter. I said yes to making him happy without asking myself why I did things which made me unhappy.

It's only now that I've left him and met someone who values me as a person that I realise what happened to me (and he has the patience of a saint to want to wait and work through my issues before we do anything). That for all my mother's attempts to protect me, I was left completely vulnerable, because no one ever sat down and told me what healthy sex was, what a healthy relationship was, or explained just how important my right to say no and to only do things which I actively wanted to do was. All the filters in my childhood did nothing except leave me vulnerable to someone who was more "worldy wise".

And you know what? Yes, it was porn which made XH the way he is. He boasted about losing his virginity at 13, and other exploits. But that's not going to go away. The "porn away" button doesn't exist, and even if it did, people will still see porn, and they will still see the sort of graphic, dehumanising stuff which portrays women as objects to be used and abused. My XH doesn't consider anything he did wrong. After all, I "could have said no". The damage is not just the porn then. It's that no one ever sat down with me and explained what "consent" really means, and no one ever sat down with him and explained that hey, just because someone younger and more inexperienced than you agrees to something, it doesn't mean that's actually something they want to do. It could just be that they're scared to say "no".

That education doesn't come from banning porn. That comes from a positive action, not a negative one. It comes from a real, thorough education.

And don't get me wrong. Porn that is abusive, porn that features horrific images, unwilling women or even children, that stuff needs to be tackled too. But it's a separate problem that needs to be tackled at the source, not at the ISP. And it's going to take a lot longer than even an internet filter, because the only real solution is to educate the next generations now and stop them making the stuff. Which, hey, is even more unicorn like than a "porn out" filter, but at least educating our own kids, male and female alike (I have a DS and a DD and I no more want my DS growing up to have his father's attitude to sex than I want my DD to be a victim of it).

inraolyn · 28/05/2013 10:45

oops, posted without finishing that sentence:

But at least educating our own kids, male and female alike, will add that many more people to the pool of those who respect each other and who have the confidence in themselves to say "no".

Lucylloyd13 · 28/05/2013 10:46

One of the first responses I read to this was ?it?s disgusting?, frankly that is not good enough.

Teenagers are curious about sex, most parents are lousy at talking about it, the ready accessibility of porn has just fuelled the natural filling of a void.

We are probably fighting a losing battle against porn . Firstly ?what is it?? Not as easy a question to answer as you might imagine. With easy access on smart phones, and video cameras on all smart phones, this has gone way beyond opting in or out on the family computer.
Most parents would be aghast at what is freely and readily available on payment free porn sites. A huge gulf is opening up between parents and children who have an access to porn which was simply not there a generation ago. Parents who struggle to talk about ?where babies come from? to their children now really should be having to cover anal sex, urination, group sex, same sex, domination, submission and sado masochism ? because that is what our children are seeing.

Context is all. What is acceptable and what isn?t? The questions raised are quite profound. I think that on mums net there would be agreement on the wrongs of child sex and bestiality, the basis for the wrong is consent and mutuality. But what about oral sex? Some see it as perfectly natural- others regard it as disgusting.

The debate is far more profound than the cry ?its disgusting/ something should be done/ ban it?

pinkballetflats · 28/05/2013 11:02

Sorry to de-rail the thread but I couldn't let this go...

Men who are abusers and men who are gay (and I dont' think kyou can really put wither "category" next to each other in general) are who they are because of porn? Really?

worldgonecrazy · 28/05/2013 11:23

The point I found interesting in the blog was the distinction between porn and sexual violence against women, which is what we often mean by "porn" these days.

There is a huge lack of awareness of what is available on the internet. When the internet started, you needed credit cards, etc. to access hardcore porn. Now you don't.

We can install some filters, but they won't work all the time. What we can do is educate our children and tell them that there is a difference between porn, sexual violence and "bog standard" sex which you have in a loving relationship. That "bog standard" sex may include things which are seen in porn films, if that's what floats your boat, but it doesn't have to.

If we see this as a losing battle, then we have lost. We need to quit being embarassed about sex and have frank discussions with our children about the power of images and the internet.

gloucestergirl · 28/05/2013 13:00

I do want the government to do something for a very simple reason: I can prevent (or try the best I can) my own daughter from looking at porn, but I can do bugger all to stop someone else's kid.

I don't my daughter coming into contact with someone who has had hours of watching porn during their formative years for learning and experimenting with sexual behaviour. End of story.

Even if filters don't work all of the time. Something that works some of the time for some of the stuff is better than nothing. I imagine it to be as trying to catch drug dealers and the like. Better to get some, rather than say "sod this for a game of soldiers let's give up because we can get all of them". Since when has not being able to do something perfectly been a good reason for doing nothing?

inraolyn · 28/05/2013 13:19

@ gloucestergirl

The problem is, the government could do all they liked to try and ban porn, but it's pie in the sky. If there was actually a workable way of screening out porn and only porn, and if it wasn't something that any kid worth their salt could worm their way around in just a couple of hours after a quick internet lesson on Redditt or 4chan, perhaps you'd have something. That's assuming the people who "opted in" for their own reasons were tech savvy enough to realise that the ISP is per household and not per computer, so adults wanting to watch porn would only be able to do so when the kids are asleep/out of the house and then remember to opt out again when they're done.

But that's not the situation. No such tech exists, and pretending it does is just deluding yourself. The solution is to educate kids, not stick your head in the sand and hope that someone else will fix it.

Alicadabra · 28/05/2013 15:11

I'm really really surprised by the Arsenal story cited here as an example of how heavy-handed these filtering systems are - I can't believe it's representative of the majority of them today. I used to work on a football messageboard almost ten years ago and even back then our automated systems were clever enough to recognise that the likes of 'arsenal' and 'scunthorpe' weren't expletives.

Alicadabra · 28/05/2013 15:19

BTW, I'm not saying that technology is the solution - just that it isn't completely useless. I'll use safe search etc because it reduces the chances of my DDs discovering stuff by accident. I won't rely on it to do my parenting for me.

handsfullnow · 28/05/2013 16:20

In a civilised society that gives claims to gender equality there is no place for violent and degrading gender hatred that is the diet of most online pornography.

The government regulates against racism, it regulates against homophobia, so why are women fair game?

Yes pornography has been around for millions of years but so has racism and child abuse but we now regulate against that. It's what marks us out as a civilised society.

If you are arguing for free speech, presumably you think the TV watershed is a waste of time? Why is TV regulated but print and internet not?

There is only one reason for the lack of regulation, the free market economy: it's making some people lots of money. This is at the expense of children's wellbeing and it is beyond disgraceful that the government does not protect children purely because of profit.

What I find even more unbelievable is that Mumsnet and some parents on here (the very few people in our society who you would like to think care about the welfare of children) are not speaking out on this issue.

We should all be demanding that the government implement the opt-in solution immediately and stop wittering on about free-speech which is completely irrelevant when talking about the protection of minors.

BoneyBackJefferson · 28/05/2013 16:55

handsfullnow

"We should all be demanding that the government implement the opt-in solution immediately and stop wittering on about free-speech which is completely irrelevant when talking about the protection of minors."

What part of it won't work don't you understand?

handsfullnow · 28/05/2013 17:46

@BoneyBackJFefferson

What part of how do you know it won't work until you try it and we should really try are you having problems with?

BoneyBackJefferson · 28/05/2013 17:54

handsfull

I can see that you are being obtuse, but there is no technology available that will block porn as an opt in.

You can try as much as you like but it won't work.

BoneyBackJefferson · 28/05/2013 17:55

*that will just block porn

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