I breed & show dogs : AMA

[LandSharksAnonymous]

Two very different worlds - but I do both. 20 years experience in breeding, 10 in showing. My mum did both for 30+ years. Anything anyone would like to know?

How many litters do you breed a year?

Why?
Is it an 'at risk' breed?
Do you breed to improve the breed or is it purely a money making exercise?

What was your experience of selling your first litter vs now? Was it emotionally harder?

I got both of my dogs spayed ASAP, despite a lot of people asking me to breed from one of them. For the brief moment I did consider it I just couldn't come to terms with the responsibility of finding brilliant life long homes for these lives I had helped bring into the world.

@Birdscratch I have one litter every two years or so. My next litter will be summer 2025, my last litter was November 2022.

@cryinglaughing I breed because I love the breed. I grew up with them and I think they are the perfect breed in absolutely every way and I want them to stay that way - which is why I breed so little, because I do everything I can to ensure the 'sire' I pick is as good an example of his breed (in terms of health scores, temperament etc) as possible. Absolutely not an 'at-risk' breeder - one of the most popular in the UK, actually!

@TankFlyBossWalkJamNittyGrittyIAmFromAMidSizeCity Emotionally, I love the puppies but I never think of them as 'mine.' Ever since my mum 'handed over the reins' I have had a wait-list, so every litter has already been 'sold' in a way before it is born which really helps - and I do my 'vetting' of buyers in-between breeding, so when the puppies arrive I can concentrate on them 100%.

What breed is it @LandSharksAnonymous?

Do you have a breeding license?

@cryinglaughing - Golden Retriever!

@user1471527955 - I do. I'm also KC Assured (which these days doesn't mean as much as it used to, unfortunately) and part of my local Breed Club.

Land sharks- GSD’s?

if it is (or similar) are you trying to “improve” the breed with regard to health rather than appearance? Breed out/reduce the sloping back for example, or does that mean you suffer in the show ring?

is their a balance between the health of the dogs and what judges want to see? Or do you find you are being encouraged to move away from the more extreme confirmations?

Do you think the breeding license is a good thing (in general)?

I adore dogs and Golden Retriever is a favourite breed although not what I have. But I don't know much about the 'official' breeding/showing side of things and, as somebody who doesn't know much, my impression is that the Kennel Club leadership and Crufts leadership (I don't know if these are basically the same people) are still not nearly committed enough to putting dogs' welfare as the highest priority. I was upset by some of the Crufts winners in recent years (I remember a German Shepherd with a sloping back and a French Bulldog with a completely flat face).

Is my impression right? And, if so, why, oh why, won't they focus on doing the best we can for the dogs themselves? These wonderful animals that give us so much, we owe them the very best. Being able to breathe and walk is a very, very low baseline in my view.

Not having a go at you, by the way, I'm glad there are responsible breeders like you out there, but the leadership of these big organisations should be doing more, in my view.

It was mostly Victorian England that started to mess things up for dogs (the focus on breeding specific visual characteristics rather than for health/function) and I feel it could be something that 21st century England/Britain could help to put right.

Has any potential buyer said or done something, after you had taken a deposit from them, that made you back out of the sale and refuse them? If so, what?

And what do you look for in a potential buyer? What sort of buyer do you refuse to place on your wait list?

Have your whelpings/litters all gone to plan?

We used to show our dogs, and had some nice placings. We decided we would like a litter to keep a puppy for ourselves. We went about things the ‘right way’- support from our breeder (experienced in the breed/heavily involved in breed clubs/shows/judges etc), health testing all completed and good results, support choosing a sire, blood testing to get timing right, support from the sire’s owner, had a wait list that we had to ‘close’ because it was already full, joined the KC scheme- it was still called ‘accredited breeders’ then I think, someone from the KC came out to see us/our house and records, found a vet that specialised in reproduction about an hour away and made contact so we knew we had back up if necessary, scanned and in pup….

We felt we had done everything possible to do things ‘properly’…. But at 7 weeks our lovely girl developed a pyometra.

We decided to do an emergency spay rather than a d and c and try again. Our girl was the priority and we wanted the least risky option for her. She is still snoring at my feet now, an old lady aged 13.5.

It was a scary (and expensive!) time. From speaking to the vet and our mentors they all said it was terrible luck and quite rare.

I was just wondering if you had had any awful experiences, or whether things had always gone to plan?

@Ohnonotmeagain So it's Golden Retrievers! In general, I think the breed is okay as it is and it is amoungst one of the healthier and less 'deformed' of the breeds (at least compared to GSDs or Frenchies). Frankly I think there are things that are a bit silly - but by and large 'breed standard' for Goldens are relatively normal and result in healthy dogs.

@user1471527955 - No. Breeding licences do not stop puppy farming, exploitative breeding and dogs being mis-used. Personally, I think the criteria to hit 5* *are what I would deem to be 'acceptable' - a good breeder should go above and beyond that and I tend to find that breeders who boast about having a licence, or being 5 are usually the ones that potential buyers should be avoiding.

What is your favourite experiences around showing your dog. And least?
Would you recommend people getting into showing their dogs or is it for a particular type of person?
How high have your dogs placed in shows.

Do you sell the bitch puppies with an endorsement ( not sure I’ve phrased that correctly ) ? Do you usually keep at least one from a litter ? How do you tell which ones will be the best for showing when they are so small ?

@Lovemyassistancedog - honestly, I agree. I think what they let happen to GSDs, in particular (as a working breed) was disgusting and unforgivable and lots of other breeders feel similarly disgusted.

@TheCrenchinglyMcQuaffenBrothers - oh the stories I could tell! I've never had to hand a deposit back as I do my vetting before litters are born which gives me ample time to get to know the owners. BUT I am incredibly picky about potential owners and I'd say about 90% of the people who approach me are turned down. I'm fairly flexible about most things...but what I do not do is sell to first time dog owners - even if they have had dogs growing up - and I do not sell to people who won't share their bank statements, won't give me a live video tour of their home, those who work full time (unless it is predominantly WFH) and those who have young children.

@Stillplodding - I've never lost a puppy so I've been very lucky. But it does play on my mind as you can do everything right and have all the experience in the world, but nature is nature and you can't predict everything. I'm glad you're girl made a recovery though❤

@Enko - my youngest dog has a JW and I plan on showing him at Crufts this year, and the second bitch I owned was best in breed (but that was a very long time ago) at Crufts. Favourite experience has to be the meeting of other breed enthusiasts and the least has to be the waiting around - I'm not a particularly patient person and honestly, you can wait for ages for your dog or breeds turn, particularly at big shows and the wait, even when you know your breed is in 40 minutes time, dries me crackers! I think anyone can show, but it's not necessarily for everyone and having a dog that is 'good' to show is 9/10s of the problem, even the most beautiful example of a dog breed might not have the right temperament to show.

Yep - you've phrased it right! I've only sold one bitch without an endorsement - and that was to my sister, but she does not plan on breeding her unless something catastrophic happens to my current girl. I keep a bitch from, roughly, every other litter. I don't sell my dogs once their breeding days are over - I keep them, so I have to be careful about when I breed.

Once pups reach about 6 weeks you can see their personalities more clearly - so it becomes easier to tell which ones might do well as show dogs. That also helps with 'matching' dogs to the right home. Often dogs from the same 'lines' do well in showing, so I pick the 'sire' for litters carefully and tend to go with dogs that have done well in the show ring. I also start young - literally the day the other pups are gone, the one I've kept will start training.

My boy dog, who I show, was going to go to a family who were planning on showing him but they had a change in family circumstances and were unable to take him, so I kept him as I thought he would do well in the ring - and he has!

What are your thoughts on golden retrievers with atypical temperament? How strict are you on the temperament side of breeding and showing?

I ask this because (from experience) my now deceased golden had a really dodgy temperament (huge resource guarding but also aggression traits), wonderful just me and him, but totally not to be trusted. And it’s interesting that when I mention this, I’m not the only one, maybe I was just unlucky, raised him wrong, or there was something in the breeding lines. How could I have known?

Thanks, we were lucky, she made a full recovery.

We were also lucky in that our breeder decided to have a litter from our dog’s sister and use the same stud dog. She very kindly let us have second pick. She has been a complete delight, everything that I had hoped our litter would have been.

She did quite well at open level showing in the puppy classes but as she got older I don’t think the angles in her hind end were as good as they could have been so we didn’t continue as I didn’t think she’d do as well at championship level (like goldies our classes are BIG), however she has the nicest most easy going temperament and is the most perfect family dog, I could not have asked for a more lovely girl.

They are both older girls now, and completely adored.

I’m glad you’ve never lost a puppy. It was devastating.

I (unreasonably!) find it very frustrating when you hear of people chucking a pair of dogs together with no thought or planning or knowledge and support… and then everything goes smoothly and you think how is that fair.

@DancingMirren - Honestly, you can do everything 'right' and still end up with a dog that has problems and there is no way to be 100% sure - even the smallest external influence can make a dog nervous or give it 'issues.' It's part of the reason why breeders who breed their dog 'just the once because she's lovely' wind me up so much and I find them so thoroughly awful.

There are things to look for when you meet a litter - i.e. does the bitch look nervous, do the puppies play well, how does mum discipline them, how does the breeder interact with the pups etc.

I do all I can to ensure even-tempered pups but, as with the fact I've not yet lost a puppy, part of my success is down to luck. You can plan and plan and plan, but nature will do what nature wants.

When I pick a sire, it's almost always one I have met in person - some breeders do it all online, but I like to meet the dog first (usually at shows) and make a judgment call. I also match owners to the puppies and whilst I'll take the 'sex' preference into account, if there isn't a puppy of their chosen sex with the right temperament I will tell them that and either put them back on my wait list or offer them one of the dogs of the opposite sex that does have the right temperament. I make that 100% clear when I speak to prospective buyers.

Unfortunately, I've found resource guarding and other 'issues' (including aggression) to be on the rise - but not just Goldies. I've also seen it on things like Cockers, over the last 10+ years, Labs, Boxers etc. All the breeds that typically are 'family friendly' and I can't help but wonder how much of that is bad breeding...

Thanks for your detailed reply. I suspect you’re right about poor breeding spoiling aspects of otherwise good lines of family friendly breeds. That and possibly looks being more important than temperament and temptation to ignore temperament ‘minor niggles’ when choosing breeding pairs. I think, having gone through the dog breeding explosion during Covid, I would want much tighter breeding controls especially for the “one off” matings. You sound like a fab (and honest) breeder from your posts and if I ever consider a golden again I will remember this AMA!

One more question from me @LandSharksAnonymous , have you ever been tempted to branch out into a different breed alongside the goldies or instead of ?

Do they wear tutus

@Floralnomad - honestly? No. My mum has a cocker spaniel now and whilst I absolutely adore her, breeding Goldies is a passion and I don't think I would have that same passion for another breed!

@Ursulla thankfully not!