I have a 2 year old who goes to bed late and stays asleep until 10:30am or later

[LateRiser]

I have a 2 year old who usually wakes up between 10:30-11:30 and goes to bed anytime between 11-12:30. He will occasionally go to sleep between 7pm-9pm if he’s really tired/been woken up early and not napped. There are also days where he will be awake until 1/2am if he’s napped late.

My ds wakes anywhere between 4/6 am in the morning no matter what time he goes to sleep. Some children just have a very strong body clock. We've been trying to change it though with a grow clock and he is learning that we don't wake up until the clock is orange its a slow process but we are seeing some progress.

This is in you.

Get him up earlier. Don't let him nap after 230pm and he will go to bed earlier.

You will have a few rough days but you can change this.

@LateRiser, do you have a history of ADHD (inattentive) in your or DH’s family? Suddenly thought that can be a reason for difficulties going to bed and late waking.

Also, if you want to change it, they recommend allowing them to go to bed later and gradually adjusting it back.

Equally, though, could easily also be he’s ready to drop the nap. Just thought it could be a reason that I forgot when I commented before.

You will have to start waking him up at 7am and gradually bring their bedtime forward. This isn't really an acceptable routine for a toddler and you must be exhausted. If they need a nap in the daytime initially having been woken up at 7am then give them a short nap but wake them up after 40 minutes or so. And start a proper bedtime routine with a bath, book, teeth brush, bed.

I spent a month in Malaysia when mine were little and managed to adjust the toddler to an eight hour time difference (and back again to UK time when we came back).

Its entirely possible to adjust a 2 year old to a different time zone!
There’s no magic solution other than gritting your teeth and getting through a few difficult days and nights!

Do you need advice to change his habits or just reassurance?

I do appreciate you’re probably in bed right now and won’t reply for hours @LateRiser 😂

If he’s going some days without a nap, then do a week of up at 8am, no nap and then wind down bedtime routine (as mentioned by pp above) starting at 7pm for an 8pm bedtime.
You’ll have to make a real effort in the first week to keep him busy, out and about and stimulated so that he’s not napping for any length of time and really tired by early evening.

Gradually he’ll start waking naturally at around 7-8am.

I think there comes a time when you return to work, or have other commitments, other dc when you have to make a stand and think “Hang on mate, you don’t get to call all the shots here! The whole family can’t revolve around your routine”

If you asked your HV for advice and all they said was “He’ll grow out of it” then I think that’s a bit lame! There are ways to change his unsociable routine.

Ugh that’s such a tricky age for sleep. With my child I found that what he really wanted to do was wake up around 9am, nap 4-6pm, then play until 11pm.

This did not work well for me 😐 so after some weeks of struggling, I took away the nap and kept him awake until 7pm, at which point he would go to sleep. (He then woke briefly throughout the night but that’s another story)

Yaking away the nap made him grumpy after 4pm but it was worth it to get my evenings back and I do think it worked better for him too

Agree with @Ellysetta you can encourage a different routine rather than resigning yourself to being up until 1am!

Forgot to add- you will need to adjust his meal times too so that he’s waking up hungry for his breakfast at around 7am, then his last meal at around 5pm.
Then you can avoid him wanting snacks at 10/11pm that will spike his blood sugar.

What does he do in the late evening from say 8 to bedtime? Has he still got his toys out doing imaginary play with you? How do you get to eat and chill in the evening?

Both my dc were the same. If I put them to bed at the time most kids go then after a long battle to get them to sleep it would be treated like a nap and they'd be up at about 1am. Far rather no peace in the evening than that although they generally always chilled anyway. Your way you get peace in the morning which I think is actually prefer. Mine still work up at a fairly early time! They did both grow out of it although have never had especially early bedtimes and also cope very well with late nights where some of their friends really struggle after one (or did when younger. Eldest is 14 now.). I did do anything to prevent a nap by the time they turned 2 though but obviously that's not always possible.

All children need a different amount of sleep- trust me I had one that napped until nearly 4 and one that dropped the nap at 22months. But no child should be waking up so late, they go to bed far too late. People can say other nations blah blah but don’t most countries have jobs that start in the morning, a 10.30am start is awful imo. A child needs structure.

Delayed Sleep Phase Disorder possibly - highly correlated with ADHD. I think I have it, not that you can do much about it as an adult

(Not sure what the point of this AMA is, nor why people rush to insist that it is a problem)

not sure why people rush to say it’s a problem

A “disorder” in the clinical sense literally means a problem or set of problems impacting a person’s daily life or ability to function.

I assumed op wanted other mums/parents to share the benefit of their experience which is usually the point of posting on a parenting forum?

Disordered sleep can be a real issue if it’s impacting the sufferer or other family members.

For example, op is falling asleep on the sofa because she’s tired late in the evening while her little fella is still bouncing around until midnight 😬

I don’t always think labels are helpful. A delay in sleeping/waking is usually caused by not going to sleep early enough- and creating a cycle of waking later.

There are ways to alter a sleep /wake phase, which I think might be worth trying.

Op can take or leave any advice obviously.