The kind of “girl” that a boy who identifies as a girl thinks he is

Thank you.

Yes your comment is fair: the reason I'm not responding to OPs questions is because I spent an entire other thread trying to do so/ explain what gender incongruence is, and it was entirely futile. I shouldn't be here at all tbf but someone tagged me, and then the phrase about obscuring words and all bets being off if you call a surgically created vagina a vagina set me off. But it's fair to say it was an unhelpful derail,

How do people who celebrate the transitioning of five year old children know that the kind of girl a boy who identities as a “girl” identifies as is the same kind of girl that a girl who identifies as a “girl” is?

Other than than from what he sees girls doing, how can a boy “know” what being a girl is, to be sure he is one?

is it posited that there is an innate sense of boy:girl that exists outside of the experience of seeing and being the presence of others?

If a child was “raised by wolves”, could they be trans? If that child had a male body and reached the age of 20 never having seen or met or known of the existence of women is it possible for them to grow up with dysphoria? When eventually discovering the other sex would they suddenly recognize “they had been born in the wrong body”?

My son was 4 when he knew he was a boy. He confided in a friend.

We didn't even have broadband at the time (mostly because I didn't realise how to use it, but still😁) and was only watching CBeebies and a few other TV shows. I really don't think he learned about being trans from watching Harry Hill sing about Amanda Lamb.

He was raised by a feminist who was a bit dismayed to have to learn about trad 'girly' things in her 30s. When he went to Covent Garden for a ballet audition, I paid a hairdresser to put his hair in a bun. Eventually, his long-haired dad learned to plait, braid, so buns etc but I never did. He was a child who loved pink, dresses, sparkles, unicorns and JoJo Bows, alongside other friends who had no such interest.

I had him wearing his brothers' cast-offs til he was about ten, when my (utterly delighted, because she raised me) mum told me I had to come to terms with him being a 'girly girl'. I loved him but was so, so bad at that aspect - left it to his aunt, gran etc.

He tells me that knowing he was a boy didn't affect or influence what he liked to dress in - and it still doesn't.

By 13-14 he was the sole trans boy in his school. He left as the sole trans boy.

Trans people are born, not made. Clothes do not make them trans, nor does the internet or 'social contagion'. He is simply trans, no one else caught it (!) from him, no one told him what he knew at the age of four.

Not raised by wolves, but by a feminist who had no idea about being trans til he came out to me. He'd known all his life - because it was who he was.

It's not about a feeling, or clothes, or cosplay. It's a deep-rooted knowledge of who you are.

Trans girls are the same. And dear god is that a difficult life at school - trans boys have it marginally easier, in my experience - especially at secondary, when the horrific bullying all trans kids experience becomes sexual harassment and assault.

No child would be trans unless it meant everything to them.

They're a tiny minority. If you want to understand, read their own words.

This is really upsetting and really not ok.

My son was 4 when he knew he was a boy. He confided in a friend.

We didn't even have broadband at the time (mostly because I didn't realise how to use it, but still😁) and was only watching CBeebies and a few other TV shows. I really don't think he learned about being trans from watching Harry Hill sing about Amanda Lamb.

He was raised by a feminist who was a bit dismayed to have to learn about trad 'girly' things in her 30s. When he went to Covent Garden for a ballet audition, I paid a hairdresser to put his hair in a bun. Eventually, his long-haired dad learned to plait, braid, so buns etc but I never did. He was a child who loved pink, dresses, sparkles, unicorns and JoJo Bows, alongside other friends who had no such interest.

I had him wearing his brothers' cast-offs til he was about ten, when my (utterly delighted, because she raised me) mum told me I had to come to terms with him being a 'girly girl'. I loved him but was so, so bad at that aspect - left it to his aunt, gran etc.

He tells me that knowing he was a boy didn't affect or influence what he liked to dress in - and it still doesn't.

By 13-14 he was the sole trans boy in his school. He left as the sole trans boy.

Trans people are born, not made. Clothes do not make them trans, nor does the internet or 'social contagion'. He is simply trans, no one else caught it (!) from him, no one told him what he knew at the age of four.

Not raised by wolves, but by a feminist who had no idea about being trans til he came out to me. He'd known all his life - because it was who he was.

It's not about a feeling, or clothes, or cosplay. It's a deep-rooted knowledge of who you are.

Trans girls are the same. And dear god is that a difficult life at school - trans boys have it marginally easier, in my experience - especially at secondary, when the horrific bullying all trans kids experience becomes sexual harassment and assault.

No child would be trans unless it meant everything to them.

They're a tiny minority. If you want to understand, read their own words.

Thank you. What I have learned from these conversations is that people don't want to listen and resolutely refuse to understand. But thank you for sharing your experience,

My son was 4 when he knew he was a boy. He confided in a friend.

We didn't even have broadband at the time (mostly because I didn't realise how to use it, but still😁) and was only watching CBeebies and a few other TV shows. I really don't think he learned about being trans from watching Harry Hill sing about Amanda Lamb.

He was raised by a feminist who was a bit dismayed to have to learn about trad 'girly' things in her 30s. When he went to Covent Garden for a ballet audition, I paid a hairdresser to put his hair in a bun. Eventually, his long-haired dad learned to plait, braid, so buns etc but I never did. He was a child who loved pink, dresses, sparkles, unicorns and JoJo Bows, alongside other friends who had no such interest.

I had him wearing his brothers' cast-offs til he was about ten, when my (utterly delighted, because she raised me) mum told me I had to come to terms with him being a 'girly girl'. I loved him but was so, so bad at that aspect - left it to his aunt, gran etc.

He tells me that knowing he was a boy didn't affect or influence what he liked to dress in - and it still doesn't.

By 13-14 he was the sole trans boy in his school. He left as the sole trans boy.

Trans people are born, not made. Clothes do not make them trans, nor does the internet or 'social contagion'. He is simply trans, no one else caught it (!) from him, no one told him what he knew at the age of four.

Not raised by wolves, but by a feminist who had no idea about being trans til he came out to me. He'd known all his life - because it was who he was.

It's not about a feeling, or clothes, or cosplay. It's a deep-rooted knowledge of who you are.

Trans girls are the same. And dear god is that a difficult life at school - trans boys have it marginally easier, in my experience - especially at secondary, when the horrific bullying all trans kids experience becomes sexual harassment and assault.

No child would be trans unless it meant everything to them.

They're a tiny minority. If you want to understand, read their own words.

Though it is fair to say that the experience varies with the telling.

Consistency in being exposed to strong gender stereotypes

None of this answers OP's questions.

My son was 4 when he knew he was a boy. He confided in a friend.

From where did your child get their conception of what “boy” was, to be able say they are one?

From himself.

My son was 4 when he knew he was a boy. He confided in a friend.

We didn't even have broadband at the time (mostly because I didn't realise how to use it, but still😁) and was only watching CBeebies and a few other TV shows. I really don't think he learned about being trans from watching Harry Hill sing about Amanda Lamb.

He was raised by a feminist who was a bit dismayed to have to learn about trad 'girly' things in her 30s. When he went to Covent Garden for a ballet audition, I paid a hairdresser to put his hair in a bun. Eventually, his long-haired dad learned to plait, braid, so buns etc but I never did. He was a child who loved pink, dresses, sparkles, unicorns and JoJo Bows, alongside other friends who had no such interest.

I had him wearing his brothers' cast-offs til he was about ten, when my (utterly delighted, because she raised me) mum told me I had to come to terms with him being a 'girly girl'. I loved him but was so, so bad at that aspect - left it to his aunt, gran etc.

He tells me that knowing he was a boy didn't affect or influence what he liked to dress in - and it still doesn't.

By 13-14 he was the sole trans boy in his school. He left as the sole trans boy.

Trans people are born, not made. Clothes do not make them trans, nor does the internet or 'social contagion'. He is simply trans, no one else caught it (!) from him, no one told him what he knew at the age of four.

Not raised by wolves, but by a feminist who had no idea about being trans til he came out to me. He'd known all his life - because it was who he was.

It's not about a feeling, or clothes, or cosplay. It's a deep-rooted knowledge of who you are.

Trans girls are the same. And dear god is that a difficult life at school - trans boys have it marginally easier, in my experience - especially at secondary, when the horrific bullying all trans kids experience becomes sexual harassment and assault.

No child would be trans unless it meant everything to them.

They're a tiny minority. If you want to understand, read their own words.

OP was asking how trans children felt. I answered.