Being a man was too much hard work, so I became a woman

I think it possibly is easier from an incel pov - they have zero chance with women. What I don't quite understand is that surely as incels they are straight men?

I'd be willing to bet they're not getting the actual thing they want, which is sex with women. But I bet they're getting more attention. Certainly online, if not in real life.

Gay men will be paying attention. And we all know there are a lot of women who will be all you're stunning and brave, albeit, that's where the attention ends.

For men who get neither relationships, sex or attention, and spend their life online, it's probably a step up.

Why on earth does the Daily Mail refer to these men as “she”?

It knows they’re just pretending to be women but it goes along with the pretence.

Could not agree with you more. Sadly being better versions of themselves would involve them putting in some effort (switching off their computers for more than 30 seconds, finding a job, not just wearing different clothes and growing their hair long).

I don't know if I'm more offended by their perceived victimhood, or their utterly ridiculous appropriation of womanhood.

As has been said these men confuse the insta, glossy version of what being a woman is.
Young, beautiful, the world at your feet and plenty of older men queuing up to buy you dinner if they think there is a shag in it for them.

Yeah, if they are online in their mums house all day I can see how they think this is the life that women have.

It's pure and simple misogyny.

They don't even notice the 99.99% of women who don't have that life (including their mums cleaning up after them and washing their clothes, making their meals, paying their board and lodging) so they would have no idea what 'being a woman' actually entails.

Sorry not RTFT but the DM article just popped up on my Facebook feed and I think it's great that ridiculousness like this is being showcased and harming their cause even further. - the comments are very heartening

This is the Jordan Peterson thing, isn't it? I could never quite understand why he was so controversial, because I read his book and it just seemed like generic dad advice. But then his core audience is lost young men who never got generic dad advice.

His message to the incels has always been: have a shower, clean your room, get a job, contribute to society and all those things will make you a more attractive proposition to the women you meet.

Maybe we might wish for lost young men to have a guru who isn't JP, but to reach them, it would have to be someone like JP. That's where I part company with Helen Lewis, who seems to feel that lost young men really need to listen to Helen Lewis lecturing them about their privilege.

Yeah - being rude as usual, but just imagine when they walk into a "Ladies" and unzip - and then think "oh!!, um, hmmm... ah a cubicle is free, so I sit and wait? Oh no look at the seat... how about squat?... oh but how do I aim?... oh... Ah relief... Oh but did it go where it should? ... Oh drips - guess I need tp ... Oh no there isn't any ... OMG I WANT MY DICK BACK!!"

I think that's Iran, and very different situation because when gay men are faced with "death penalty or transition," it is objectively easier and better to choose transition over death - that's not the type of man we are talking about here, anyone with humanity feels sorry for these men, it's a totally different interpretation of "easier," when you are wanting a free meal rather than to survive.

I think this is a useful article as it is useful to spell out to people how closely aligned incels are with the new wave of trans women, how sexist and horrible it all is. The underlying assumption all these men have that they should be seen as superior in some way to women and are shocked that a beautiful, young, intelligent, popular woman appears to be doing better than they are hunched over their computers doing nothing but being male. These ones just think they are playing the system, working it to their advantage, but it's all in their heads.

I think there are parallels here with Jihadi men - they have totally failed in life (by their standards): unintelligent, unattractive, not nice or kind, unpopular, poor, single... they latch onto something that makes them super special with very little effort and absolutely no need to reflect on their own decisions or opinions.

There is a problem in society with disenfranchised young men, that are being told they are great either by families or on-line while all the evidence points to the contrary. I don't mean to imply this is a feminist issue to solve, but I do think it should be recognised (even if it's just to protect ourselves from it).

I'm sure the same psyche plays into the astronomical rise in youth transitioning. So many children and young people seem to think the opposite sex have it "easier" for selective reasons. We needed positive role models for these vulnerable people not cheerleading the false narratives that so many charities did until they went embarrassingly quiet.

Does that really happen in Afghanistan? I know it's policy in Iran, but there's a huge difference being a woman in Iran and being one in Afghanistan.

Oh yes, I completely agree, hence beard in inverted commas.
I was thinking somewhere like Afghanistan where gay men become trans women and bizarrely that's seen as fine, whereas being gay is illegal.

These “women have it easier” men are fixating on the 000000.1% of women who are conventionally beautiful and between the ages of 18-25. Undoubtedly they will get some perks from men if they seek them out. For a few years only. But for the VAST majority of women this is obviously not the case and on balance we have it far harder than men due to the double shift and biological crap we have to deal with.

Wait until you hit 50 Dh sails on unaffected by no more than the odd gray hair I’m hit by new symptoms every few months! First time i genuinely wish I was a man.

It's not easier living as a woman lol but it is easier living as someone who can demand what they want when they want otherwise they will just accuse people as transphobic and everyone is walking around on eggshells. It's just toddler behaviour that these men are displaying

Are we meant to be going through life getting free meals? I think I’ve missed that.

I mean this is hilarious to me. A privileged white male thinks life would be easier being a woman, bloody hell. Would LOVE to be a fly on the wall the first 50 times they realise what a big old mistake they've made 😄

Yep, real fun, especially when the only HRT that suited you after 3 years of trial and error is discontinued!? No explanation as to why, probably down to money.

My Gran always used to say she’s coming back as a man, I understand her reasoning now, never did as a youngster.

There's a lot of them labelling themselves as 'transbians' now. Trans lesbians.

I’m afraid most TW are clocked as male rather quickly. So the bearding thing wouldn’t really work…

This help is for the children, not the parent.

‘A huge amount of the reason I was incel was because I was a closeted trans girl.'

mmhmmm…not that just transitioning is escapism because you hated yourself and therefore feel better not ‘being’ that person.

anyway… other than these ridiculous statements and the general sexist ridiculousness. And putting aside the whole destruction of women’s rights etc. is it only me who was reading it and thinking at least if they’re busy trying to be a woman to find a sugar daddy they’re not spinning into incel induced public shootings etc?

how fucked up is that?! Could these men just be better versions of themselves - do the fucking work like the rest of us? Internalise their failures like the rest of us do instead of blaming the world (women) do their shortcomings. Ugh

Insurance should be based on risk, but this decision was created by the ECJ who decided that sex should not affect insurance premiums.

You could argue that age differences apply universally, i.e. everyone will go through stages of paying more or less based on their age; whereas a sex difference is not changing characteristic (I very much doubt insurers would want to get into the debate about whether transitioning gender should affect premiums).

I'm not saying I agree with this approach but there is logic to it.

Sasha Bailey did an interesting podcast on Transmaxxing and other things on Gender a Wider Lens. It is a really interesting male transactional view

That always bothered me, too. Is it discrimination when you charge a younger driver more than an older one? Or is it just accepting that one group is a higher risk than the other and charging accordingly? If it's discrimination to charge the sexes differently then you could argue all rate differences are discrimination and everyone should be paying the same, which is obviously ridiculous.

In America all men between 18 and 25 must register for the draft, and there is no exemption for those who identify as trans. This policy predates Trump, but presumably per Trump's new rules restricting trans people from joining the services, they would be exempt?