Can we talk about bisexuality?

You keep going back to 'lesbian only events', but I've been talking about the wider issue of whether LG + B are a good fit when it comes to organising as a 'community'. Even the OP only mentions social events in passing, most of her comments are about community organising.

Many posters have said that as bisexual people they feel they do not belong in the 'LGB community' and have repeatedly asserted that their experience as bisexuals is distinct from L&G experience, and indeed that they experience biphobia from both gay and straight people. That backs up the idea that lesbian+gay+bisexual is not a good fit, if both L&G people and, as evidenced on this thread, bisexual people, don't feel it's working for them.

It shouldn't be problematic for people to gather together around a shared experience - threads on MN are based on that, and the world is full of like-minded people getting together. By definition, an embroidery group is going to 'exclude' people who are not embroiderers, but that doesn't mean being phobic towards them, or telling non-embroiderers to fuck off, as a PP felt we were doing to bi women.

From the comments of bi women on here who experience biphobia, it would seem like a good idea to have spaces to discuss their specific experiences, and ditto lesbians and gays.

Almost certainly.
They are sort of coming out the other side already, having never been actually interested in women.

Lesbians are/were (still are) oppressed.
Oppression became sexy
Oppression started winning prizes.
Suddenly everyone is 'oppressed'.

I am going to be 100% honest. Various bisexual women have shared personal stories of him discrimination and harassment led to them choosing to be with a man. Some lesbians are slightly resentful of bisexual women who did not want to be part of the community on the past because it was hard, and now things have got easier are demanding they should be welcomed as part of the community.

“"should all people whose lives are impacted by their same sex attraction and same sex relationships be welcome?"

My life has always been impacted by my same sex attraction even when I am in a relationship with a man.

Yes, this happened to many lesbian and bisexual women. The threat was real.

And there were lots of lesbians in the military. Some of whom got dishonourable discharges and lost their pensions.

Ok, well any event with B in it, should welcome all Bs regardless of the sex of their current partner.

I think that perhaps these grouping reflect too much of an emphasis on sexual attraction as defining one's identity, and not enough emphasis on the experience of living life in the world, given your particular relationships and the particular social climate you live in.

I am sexually and romantically attracted to women, but my two serious relationships have been with men. I've been with my husband since I was a teenager. If we ever broke up, I'd have both men and women in my dating pool.

I guess that technically I count as being "bisexual" but honestly I don't identify as bisexual, because my romantic and sexual attraction to women is a completely inert part of my life. I'm not dating or in a same sex relationship, so the question of who I am attracted to just doesn't impact any aspect of how I'm treated socially, or even my own inner experience of the world. I don't face discrimination or have people treat me as a novelty, I don't have to explain how my family works, I get to just fit into the expected pattern of what a relationship looks like. In my own self, I experience no conflict. I don't have any internalised self hatred or regret, I'm perfectly happy finding both men and women attractive, but also I have no fears or anxieties about being accepted or raising my children a certain way. My relationships and family aren't constantly politicised and over sexualised. I don't hide same sex attraction, but I'm don't mention it unless it comes up - and as a married woman in my 30s, it almost never comes up.

The question is, what are these groups for? If they're little identify clubs that meet to discuss how attractive this or that person is, then sure, welcome people like me. But of course, what people really need is a group to help them navigate a life lived with same sex relationships: a space free from your relationships being politicised, sexualised or othered, a place of support and activism, somewhere to meet other people who have the same experiences, somewhere to meet romantic partners. And I genuinely don't think there's much point in opening these spaces up to people who don't live life in a way that involves same sex relationships.

To put this simply: "should bisexual people be welcome?" Isn't the right question. The question is something like "should all people whose lives are impacted by their same sex attraction and same sex relationships be welcome?" And I personally would want to say yes. This phrasing excludes people like me, for whom bisexuality makes no difference, but includes bisexual women for whom their same sex attraction plays a much larger role in their life.

Same. And I served in the armed forces when it would have landed me in prison. So yeah, there were many reasons why my “observable behaviour” as a bisexual was straight as an arrow for many years.

LGB events rarely exist. They are LGBT. Or lesbian and bi, or lesbian

Yes I agree. So have Lesbian only events.
If it’s an LGB event, then you should be tolerant of the G as they are and we Bs how we are. We all make different choices. Your choices as a lesbian shouldn’t be the measuring stick for which bisexual women get to attend an LGB event.

Perhaps it's ok for different groups to have different rules?

Perhaps people should join the groups whose rules and members they prefer?

Perhaps we won't come up with one rule to suit all groups?

Perhaps that's fine. People are all different.

Lesbians make up 2.5% of the population BEFORE it became social suicide to say you were straight (based on my daughters cohort, I think its more like 75% claim bisexuality now. They are ashamed of being straight. Yet they definately aren't sexually attracted to women).

I'm not in touch with what young people are facing nowadays, but when I was a teenager, attracted to women, it would have been 'social suicide' to admit it. You could get hounded as a 'lesbian' for having the 'wrong' hairstyle or shoes, let alone confessing attraction to a member of the same sex. I'm sorry things have gone so far in the other direction that being straight is something to be ashamed of. I hope this is a case of 'swinging pendulum' and it will eventually settle to a place of equilibrium.

Being lesbian is more than just sexual orientation, it's also about who your primary commitments in life are made to. I chose, and choose, women, and it's a social and emotional choice as well as a sexual one.

A woman who is as likely to have a male significant other as a female one has made different decisions and different choices about who to have primary relationships with. Totally valid choices for her as a bisexual woman, but different from the choices made by me as a lesbian.

Because it is gatekeeping out bisexuals who don’t happen to be LG passing at the moment. It is almost like pretending bisexual isn’t its own sexuality, that who our current partner is defines us as either lesbian or straight.

OP, At these LGB events, will you be asking the bisexual men in relationships with women (bi or straight) to not come either?

It seems like you think an LGB event should be an LG and LG passing Bs event….?

Why not?

The "orientation" model, which centres innermost feelings and felt attraction rather than observable behaviours or lifestyle, isn't the only possible model to organise around. It's just a model that has had a lot of good PR over the last couple decades.

I'm also autistic and I suspect that the way I think about sex is very different from neurotypical people, or at least neurotypical women, and may be part of why I'm bisexual.

I struggle to understand "romance" at all. Dates are generally a means of vetting a prospective sexual partner to filter out the ones likely to try to kill me. I suspect this may contribute to my struggle to find female partners.

Definitely, "relationships" in the sense of "see person repeatedly, do things together" have been based on shared interests and sex with people who, in hindsight, were probably also autistic, not on "dinner and a movie". The one time I lived with someone was a trainwreck and I am never doing it again.

Sorry that’s bullshit. A bisexual person in a relationship with a man is still “really interested” in women, for real.
So what if a few bisexual women are excluded? Really? If an event is LGB then that should mean all B are welcome and you just need to get over your biphobia because, yes bisexual women are also interested in men. Who are you, as a lesbian, to gatekeep which bisexuals can attend an LGB event?

you are female and bisexual you have access to 53.5% of the population.
I fail to see the relevance to this. We are a minority and we don’t have “access” to fellow bisexuals nearly as often as anyone else, lesbians included. LGB groups aren’t speed dating events.

She doesn't though does she. She wants to keep the people out who arent really interested in women.

But even is they are interested in women, so what if a few bisexual women are excluded. It is such a tiny pool.
Lesbians make up 2.5% of the population BEFORE it became social suicide to say you were straight (based on my daughters cohort, I think its more like 75% claim bisexuality now. They are ashamed of being straight. Yet they definately aren't sexually attracted to women).

If you are female and bisexual you have access to 53.5% of the population.

Crack on OP. Gatekeep. You don't need our permission.

I think it’s ok to say “lesbians only” and have splinter groups, what isn’t acceptable is to advertise “gay, lesbian and bisexuals plus their partners” and then insist bisexuals can only bring a same sex partner.

Surely it would make more sense to exclude bi women in current relationships with men and admit those who are coupled up with lesbians or single?

That's understandable, but does make them rather difficult to find.

But is is acceptable to say, lesbians only, bisexual women not welcome?

I repeat, why not welcome and what difference does it make?