Trans remembrance flags and SNP renews support for LGBTYS

Just to add to this

Is there any actual evidence of trans people being a marginalised group?

When you see footage of Trans people marching there is rarely any group of people vocally abusing them, yet when you look at let women speak you can see actual violence and abuse being hurled at the speakers.

The same goes for toilets, is there any evidence that they are unsafe in men's toilets or is it just feels?
There is a lot of evidence that women are not as safe from trans women as some would have us believe with some trans women attacking women in toilets and plenty of YouTube videos by the trans lobby threatening people with violence if they are prevented from using women's toilets.

But we are just supposed to ignore this?

Just to repeat but in a different way what I said at the start of this thread.

Why is Scotland, or any where else deciding that trans issues are important when (as many have suggested) there are any number of communities who dont get the recognition.

And in the instance of women, has anyone seen any council, government or whatever fly a flag of rememberance for women on the International Day for the Elimination of Violence Against Women. Women are killed in their homes, when walking down roads to get home, and are the first victims in areas of war and famine.

That is what this is about.

What sort of statement does that say to the community as a whole. That only some violent deaths are important.

And, as said earlier, what message is Scotland thinking it is sending by promoting one group above all others.

It is ridiculous and insulting.

If I remember correctly at least two were murdered by transgender partners, others were murdered for drug debts. None due to ‘transphobia’.

It was the "promotion" which was forbidden, not any mention.

Not at all true. Maybe you'll read what Peter Tatchell had to say in 1998: www.petertatchell.net/lgbt_rights/section28/hype/

Yes, section 28 was absolutely homophobic but the topic was never forbidden in schools.

Every single 1 of those deaths can be named and their place of death is recorded none were in Scotland. Oh and we do keep records of trans murders in Scotland as was admitted in the Scottish Parliament by the then justice secretary humza yousef. So please stop trying to twist facts to paint a false narrative of trans murders in Scotland when none have ever occurred. Trans people are the only group never to have been murdered in Scotland and as such are the safest and have no right to a flag being flown or a day of remembrance but women and children do

This doesn't reflect what teaching was actually like in the 90s. I was never prevented from teaching about homophobia, for example.

Yes we can there has be zero recorded murders of transgender persons in Scotland since records began

The SNP can pay lip service to the alphabet soup all they want, but we all know how most same-sex attracted people and women who question the Gender Identity Cult are treated.

Christinapple · Today 11:14

What do you want, a return to section 28 when even mentioning the topic was forbidden at schools?

Mention of homosexuality wasn't forbidden. It was covered on more than one occasion, when I was at high school, during the 80s.

Where are you quoting from?

This, with bells on!

OK, so you are lumping celebrations (pride, black history , etc) in with memorials?

Can you see that even in this conversation we have an issue, which is defining what, exactly, we are talking about and why.

The issue was that some people believe, myself included, that there is no need for a public memorial to something that didn't happen.

I can't believe you're now suggesting that because holocaust Memorial day is remembered by some organisations, we should remember the trans non genocide?

Can you not see that by conflating the two, you yourself are giving credence to the false 'trans genocide' narrative?

Dear God it's like pulling teeth. Don't they teach critical thinking in schools these days?

Nobody condones murder, and all violent deaths are tragedies to the loved ones of the deceased. So SparklyTurtle's
'Wow, an open admission that people here don't care about violence against transgender people because people speak up against transphobia.'
is unsubstantiated.

The issue is the flying of a flag on public buildings to commemorate a group or event. The range of permitted flags is restricted by planning regulations, as a PP pointed out.

I'm not a UK subject, so it's not my call, but I'd be quite happy for The Town and Country Planning (Control of Advertisements) (England) Regulations 2007 to be enforced strictly. So no pride, progress or trans flags on public buildings full stop.

But according to SparklyTurtle
Civilised nations have been flying flags, remembering people of oppressed groups and standing against discrimination for years. Why should the transgender people murdered for being transgender be any different?
and seems to be answering that question with 'because, wow, transphobia'.

Here are three more realistic answers :

1. transgender people are not an oppressed group in Scotland.
2. transgender people are not officially discriminated against in Scotland.
3. there have been no recorded cases of people being murdered for being transgender in Scotland.

"Party supports LGBT+ people and rights"

What do you want, a return to section 28 when even mentioning the topic was forbidden at schools?

You can create a 'community' out of any shared characteristic. Why not have a community of those whose homes have been destroyed by flooding; or perhaps one for men over the age of 60 with autism; or one for business owners whose businesses were destroyed by the lockdown?

Each group can have a flag and a motto - to really solidify their group identity.....and then they can each demand additional funding from the government to deal with their particular disadvantage; plus maybe better representation in films and TV and more favourable treatment by the mainstream media - resulting in their unique special needs being recognised and validated. New laws could be created to punish anyone who makes light of their particular suffering......

And i suspect that one murder involved an intimate partner...and was not a random street attack.

But it does happen during pride month with rainbow/progress flags? and there is also usually an official response during other special "days" (black history, holocaust memorial, int day of the child, etc) for groups who dont have flags that are so recognisably associated with them so flying a flag would be inappropriate?

This isnt a pile on, im not trying to put words in anyones mouth! i just dont see the issue with this particular decision

That was a reply to sadmillenial.

We could have a suicide day of remembrance, like we do for baby loss.

But if you're going to start subdividing that into each subcategory like trans, where does it end? We'd be having them all the time and that weakens the impact.

The government are supposed to equally represent everyone, not just certain privileged groups. That's how democracy is supposed to work.

And asking why - when it's not done for any other community, save for war veterans (which is obviously right and appropriate as they have their lives for others).

Asking why does not mean the asker thinks the group are awful people/ deserve to die/ whatever other words you want to put in our mouths.

It's a genuine question. Because comemoratiing this thing that doesn't happen lends weight to the false narrative that trans people are more at risk from violence and suicide than other groups and therefore need special treatment (women's rights) because they have such a hard time.

I don't understand why you can't see this false narrative at work. Perhaps the cognitive dissonance is too painful.

But why? You don't think it's insane to be "remembering" things that just aren't happening in this country?

There are vanishingly few deaths to violence around the world. There is very little evidence of excess suicidality.

How you have the audacity to lie about someones post being ‘not caring’ and then post No I'm not scouring the internet to look for information that places one of recorded deaths in the article linked in Scotland, because I have better things to spend my time on Ive no idea 😳

I don't tend to pass comment on pronoun usage these days but I'm curious...

Why are you using "he" pronouns for Tiffany Scott?

"So if criminals don't deserve the same respect as the rest of society why are we supposed to care about the women he's in prison with?
Unless it's got nothing to do with the fact he's a criminal and it's just because he's trans that you have a problem with his death actually mattering of course?"
Is child-stalker-gender a bit like rapist-gender, then?

Excellent posts TalkingintheDark.