Page 2 | Raped and now my case has been NFA'ed

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 2024-11-30T20:37:15+00:00

At the beginning of the year I was raped by my ex-boyfriend. I reported him to the police and they investigated it. I had the news last week that it wouldn't be going to the CPS because although they think the case was strong there were messages I sent saying that I wanted to have sex with him which apparently undermines my case. They said that any jury would assume that he would have the reasonable belief I consented. To put the matter into context he forced me to have oral sex with him and whilst doing it pushed my head so far down into his groin that I couldn't breathe. I felt like I was fighting for my life and was terrified. I've spent months in therapy and have had a diagnosis of Acute Traumatic Stress Disorder (apparently they can't give a diagnosis of PTSD for symptoms that exist for less than a year). I'm applying for a review of the evidence but it feels like I'm fighting against a system which is rigged against me. If I have to, I'll make a complaint the Police about the way this has been handled and I'll take it as high as I can. I know I'm preaching to the converted. How can I make other people listen?

Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 03/12/2024 17:09

Haroldwilson · 03/12/2024 13:53

I know people who work in the CPS. Believe me, they get the issues and they want it to be better.

But they'll also have taken cases to trial where they see the attacker walk and the victim has been retraumatised.

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I would assume that being higher up they would be able to have a say in some of this. Why are they never asked or consulted? It's weird.

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Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 03/12/2024 17:07

Fraaahnces · 03/12/2024 14:01

I’m so sorry @NotAScoobyDoo2. It’s not going to help you, and it’s way too late to help me (39 years ago) but in Australia they are changing the consent laws so that women will no longer have to prove that they said “No” in a rape or SA trial - Men are going to have to prove instead that they said “Yes” and didn’t change their mind afterwards.

That sounds too advanced for this country. The thing is, that now I have started the VRR process I realise that there are laws but they're just not consistently applied or at all.

Under the Domestic Abuse Act section 71(1) (2021) the defence of consent doesn't apply in cases where serious harm has been caused for sexual gratification.

The threshold for this is Actual Bodily Harm the definition of this is that the harm must be more than transient. It includes cuts, bruises and psychological injury.

Within my support group I don't know any woman who was told she could rely on this legislation and why it's not being used. I'm also planning to rely on case law where the facts are almost identical to mine. If I fail I'll probably ask for a meeting to discuss this with some higher up. It's just bizarre that we have a law which was set up off the back of someone's murder and no-one relies on it.

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Fraaahnces · 03/12/2024 14:01

I’m so sorry @NotAScoobyDoo2. It’s not going to help you, and it’s way too late to help me (39 years ago) but in Australia they are changing the consent laws so that women will no longer have to prove that they said “No” in a rape or SA trial - Men are going to have to prove instead that they said “Yes” and didn’t change their mind afterwards.

Haroldwilson · 03/12/2024 13:53

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 30/11/2024 22:44

Even if you're right, I still need to complain. The conviction rate is shit for a reason and even if I don't succeed it's still within my right to complain and to ensure that police amd victims are aware of the laws and that victims know that they're available.

Edited

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I know people who work in the CPS. Believe me, they get the issues and they want it to be better.

But they'll also have taken cases to trial where they see the attacker walk and the victim has been retraumatised.

IwantToRetire · 03/12/2024 01:02

Hi OP

This want be of an help to your individual case, but maybe you want to contribute to this survey of victims experience of crime.

It isn't specifically about women's experience of reporting sexual violence or rape, but if you (and others on this thread) feed in your experience it might help a bit to get information made more public about the terrible treatment by thee "justice" system.

Intro https://victimscommissioner.org.uk/news/victims-commissioner-launches-2024-victim-survey/

Survey https://eu.research.net/r/OVC24

Victims' Commissioner launches 2024 Victim Survey - Victims Commissioner

Have you been a victim of or reported a crime in the past three years? The Victims’ Commissioner would like

https://victimscommissioner.org.uk/news/victims-commissioner-launches-2024-victim-survey

BearOnABlanket · 02/12/2024 17:53

It's insulting, and I'm glad you feel able to pursue it.

Extreme acts should require extreme proof of consent - the assumption should be that no woman would consent to being suffocated by having her head held down on a penis that is choking her, and it's not reasonable to assume that consent surely.

Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 02/12/2024 17:00

Honeycrisp · 02/12/2024 14:34

Very disappointing news OP.

I hope at least the process thus far has been unpleasant enough for him that it might serve as some kind of deterrent. If you think he's the sort of person who won't like it, perhaps a review could cause him further stress and suffering, so would be worth prolonging the amount of time it's hanging over him. Not worth it if he won't care though.

The crumbs we're reduced to, eh?

I feel even if I don't succeed, if the process is easier for at least one other person as a result of my action, it will be worth it.

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Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 02/12/2024 16:44

OldWiseDuck · 02/12/2024 15:25

That's outrageous. So sexting means that any time within next few days (or how long?) person can demand violent sex to the point of rape because at one day you send some messages? And you don't have case? That is ridiculous.

Apparently that's the case. I've started drafting my review and I'm relying on the law which states that you can't consent to serious harm for sexual gratification. The facts of the case on which the law arose were quite similar to mine so it's worth it.

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Maddy70 · 02/12/2024 15:37

It's just awful that this has happened to you but being a 'fair' system means that it has to be proven and your texts are reasonable doubt for his case.
I doubt there is anyone here that doubts your story. Im so sorry

OldWiseDuck · 02/12/2024 15:25

That's outrageous. So sexting means that any time within next few days (or how long?) person can demand violent sex to the point of rape because at one day you send some messages? And you don't have case? That is ridiculous.

Honeycrisp · 02/12/2024 14:34

Very disappointing news OP.

I hope at least the process thus far has been unpleasant enough for him that it might serve as some kind of deterrent. If you think he's the sort of person who won't like it, perhaps a review could cause him further stress and suffering, so would be worth prolonging the amount of time it's hanging over him. Not worth it if he won't care though.

The crumbs we're reduced to, eh?

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 02/12/2024 13:35

IANAL but a close friend was on the jury for a case where there were texts like these.

The guy was still found guilty and went down, thankfully.

Sorry to hear what you went through/ are still going through OP. If you have the energy to ask for a review, why not do it? Just steel yourself that it might still be considered insufficient evidence.

Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 02/12/2024 13:19

WarriorN · 02/12/2024 07:40

I'm so sorry this happened to you.

For me, even if you sent texts expressing a desire to have sex, consent can be withdrawn at any point.

The second that is ignored it becomes non consensual and so rape.

The injuries and resulting trauma would also be indicative of this.

I'm in no way a lawyer but that's the key point that underpins the situation.

The text wasn't a binding contract. If that's the case then rape in relationships is essentially statutory.

Thank you for this. And for everyone else who has supported me.

If you think I'm in the wrong, I hope you've learnt something. If you haven't learnt anything I will only prey that it never happens to you because this is when you'll realise how wrong you are.

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WarriorN · 02/12/2024 07:40

I'm so sorry this happened to you.

For me, even if you sent texts expressing a desire to have sex, consent can be withdrawn at any point.

The second that is ignored it becomes non consensual and so rape.

The injuries and resulting trauma would also be indicative of this.

I'm in no way a lawyer but that's the key point that underpins the situation.

The text wasn't a binding contract. If that's the case then rape in relationships is essentially statutory.

29b11 · 02/12/2024 01:14

OP I admire your pursuit of justice.

However, I am sorry to tell you that the CPS are correct re what a jury would do. It's absolutely abhorrent - I have found this out through being on a jury in a case like this. I am sure that the rapist who was the defendant in the case I did was 100% guilty and he is on the street still. Jury couldn't reach a verdict. You only need a little bit of doubt in the mind of a juror and/or a juror who simply just doesn't believe that the women got raped as he's a complete misogynist and/or a juror who is too stupid to understand the oath they took and refuses to have it explained to them or one taking the non-judgmental (probably wrong word) stance of not finding anyone guilty of anything so that their own conscience is "clean". And the fucking nonsense the defence come out with is shameful. Perhaps the woman made a mistake (wtf), perhaps the woman is crying rape because she doesn't want her husband to think she was deliberately "cheating" with the rapist (wtf), perhaps the victim is mentally unstable due to taking ADs (wtf), perhaps the victim wanted it (wtf), perhaps the victim is lying (wtf)...I actually don't know how the defence barrister could sleep at night. Apparently the weasel was facilitating a "fair trial". Don't really understand who it was fair to.

I don't know what the answer is. But the justice system is not it.

kittybiscuits · 02/12/2024 00:13

OP I have total respect for your determination to exhaust all options to find justice. Just echoing that I hope you have ISVA support. Wishing you all the best with your VRR. I'm so sorry the bastard did this to you.

IwantToRetire · 02/12/2024 00:07

A Sexual Assault Referral Centre (SARC) can offer confidential medical and practical support to people who have recently been raped or sexually assaulted. SARCs are usually provided by the NHS. SARCs are not Rape Crisis member services but often work alongside us.
https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-help/sexual-assault-referral-centres-sarcs/

SARCs

If you’ve recently experienced sexual violence, a Sexual Assault Referral Centre can offer you different kinds of confidential support. Find out more here.

https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-help/sexual-assault-referral-centres-sarcs

IwantToRetire · 02/12/2024 00:06

The police need to be able to say okay we now have x number of allegations from x number of independent complainants that these allegations can now stand independently as evidence regardless of extenuating factors such as sexting / circumstances etc.

This is one of the purposes of SARCs. Not only to give women the opportunity to get specialised medical help, but also for forensic evidence to be collected. Without the police being involved.

So even if the woman choses not to report, evidence from her rape can be collated with information from other women attacked. ie giving the opportunity to identify a serial rapist.

However, I think most women are unaware of SARCs and for all I know since they were handed over to the NHS may well have face cuts.

IwantToRetire · 02/12/2024 00:02

However there are text messages indicating you wanted sex, which of course, you must see undermines your case.

This is exactly the biased thinking of juries which is why the CPS more often than not does not take cases to trial. Because the know members of the public, say daft things like this.

Agreeing to have sex doesn't mean agreeing to be assualted or forced to perform an act you haven't consented to.

It is because of this type of bigoted thinking that there have been suggestions that juries at rape trails should undergo training on what legally rape means. One of which would be to say this really reactionary statement should not be part of legally assessing someone's guilt.

The other suggestion was juryless trials so that the facts could be assessed as opposed to trial by brainwashed sexist anti woman sentiments.

Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 01/12/2024 21:22

IwantToRetire · 01/12/2024 20:14

They are, but they are also influenced by how reluctant Juries are to confict men.

Does anyone remember a documentary a few years ago know about 3 different rape cases, how they were dealt with, and those that went to trial.

One case was so obviously rape, and both police and CPS confident they would get a conviction.

But the Jury said not guilty.

And there is quite a lot of evidence that it is women on the jury who swing it this was. Something about thinking if that was my son, my brother, my husband wouldn't want them to be shamed!

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The last paragraph really got me. If someone accused either of my sons of rape I would be mortified. However, even before it happened to me, I like to think I would be fair.

I've been on jury service myself and it's difficult not to let emotions get in the way but the obligation is to look at the facts and not make fantastical notions of how it might not have happened or look at what I want to describe as the "unreasonable doubt".

If a woman comes complete with GP records, a witness and therapy notes that date back to the incident it's highly unlikely she's making it up - for me that meets the threshold of beyond reasonable doubt. No woman goes through months of therapy, attends her GP and has witnesses for something that didn't happen.

A man standing at the front with his dick pics saying "she consented because I sent her this and she didn't complain" or "we did some sexting the week before" is what I describe as an unreasonable doubt. Even if there's a couple of weeks of sexting, as part of the relationship, it shouldn't make a difference. The barrister is ONLY meant to ask questions about the rape / assault.

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IwantToRetire · 01/12/2024 20:24

" ... the jury conviction rate on rape charges was in the region of 52–55% annually, and that since 2018 it rose considerably. Over the 15-year period the jury conviction rate in rape cases was 58% on average ... "

3% increase doesn't seem to warrant the word considerably.

and

In England and Wales, more than 99% of rapes reported to police do not end in a conviction. This is the result of a criminal justice system that makes prosecuting rape extremely rare, lengthy and difficult.

At present, charge rates for rape vary wildly between regions, from 1.3% in Surrey to 8.2% in Durham. Cases take, on average, 817 days to reach court, and 63% of cases are closed because the victim has given up on the process and withdrawn from it.

IwantToRetire · 01/12/2024 20:14

okydokethen · 01/12/2024 09:21

The police and court system are anti woman, women are put on trial and there is nothing just or fair about it.
I'm so sorry.

They are, but they are also influenced by how reluctant Juries are to confict men.

Does anyone remember a documentary a few years ago know about 3 different rape cases, how they were dealt with, and those that went to trial.

One case was so obviously rape, and both police and CPS confident they would get a conviction.

But the Jury said not guilty.

And there is quite a lot of evidence that it is women on the jury who swing it this was. Something about thinking if that was my son, my brother, my husband wouldn't want them to be shamed!

Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 01/12/2024 17:04

SensibleSigma · 01/12/2024 14:48

I find it remarkable you feel able to say that, on this thread.

The system demonstrably isn’t fair. Men get away with rape and sexual assault many times more often than they are convicted for it.

How can you suggest it is fair? It’s a system, yes. But it’s inadequate for prosecuting sexual abuse. Rape is effectively decriminalised.

On this thread people are saying OP would be safer if she gave up. That is repeated everywhere. And you think it’s fair?

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Thank you. Summed up in a perfect nutshell. If I don't challenge the system I'll feel like I'm endorsing it.

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SensibleSigma · 01/12/2024 14:48

YourAzureEagle · 01/12/2024 10:00

The law requires, that for someone to be found guilty this must be proven beyond reasonable doubt.

This is a fair system, but does mean occasionally a guilty person will go free, but should prevent the conviction of the innocent, and by in large it works.

Unfortunately in your case I assume that the CPS have decided that the messages insert a reasonable doubt sufficient to either prevent conviction or result in a successful appeal.

That is not to say your ordeal didn't happen, but how can you, or the crown for you, prove to a jury that it did when there is evidence that points to consent - its a bad situation for you, and I feel for you, but its not a toxic system, its the law working as it should.

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I find it remarkable you feel able to say that, on this thread.

The system demonstrably isn’t fair. Men get away with rape and sexual assault many times more often than they are convicted for it.

How can you suggest it is fair? It’s a system, yes. But it’s inadequate for prosecuting sexual abuse. Rape is effectively decriminalised.

On this thread people are saying OP would be safer if she gave up. That is repeated everywhere. And you think it’s fair?

Original poster

NotAScoobyDoo2 · 01/12/2024 12:06

TheyDidntBurnWitchesTheyBurntWomen · 01/12/2024 11:44

Firstly I'd like to thank you for taking this as far as you have. As a fellow rape victim I know how hard that must have been and agree that more of us need to speak up about what happens to women.

For myself I found the police saying they won't be taking it further as traumatic as the rape. Ex (father of my child) used that as proof I was a Bast bitter ex and he was innocent to bad mouth me to anyone and everyone. It's too soon perhaps for you but I found what helped me heal most was acknowledging how crap the system is and how misogynistic the world is and knowing that I did nothing wrong. I realised by holding onto the injustice and pian I perpetuated my suffering while he's living his life no shits given.

I believe you. Many women here are saying they believe you. What happened is wrong. You have done more than many of us have the strength to do in the fight for justice, you have done that for other women and it's appreciated. It's not your job to put yourself through more stress for others, dropping it and focusing on your own healing is the right thing to do. Don't let him ruin your whole life or years if it. You can't change that there is no justice you can only put yourself a woman first and heal.

Be assured this will show up on a Claire's law submission if any future partner does that. My ex had never been convicted of his past crimes and I was ignorant but in fighting him in court for the child his police check came back with multiple arrests he'd never been convicted of for violence and harassment of women court didn't seem to think this was justification for limiting his contact with the kid but if I'd have had the wherewithal to Claire's law the fucker I'd have seen the history. Now I know to Claire's law and if he tells future partners he's got a court order to see his kids because I'm a nut case I hope more people know of Claire's law and would check his story that way.

I'm sorry you have had his happen and I'm sorry our legal system has let him get away with it.

I'm glad acknowledging the system is crap has helped you. Everyone is different. For me, I need to know that I've stood up for myself as much as I can. There's not a one size fits all and this is what I feel I need to do.

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