Imane Khelif medical report reported in Reduxx

It wasn't even a mistake. From the minute he was scouted for boxing, to the Olympic committee saying they couldn't definine eligibility into the female category, to him in the ring with women, it was planned.

There are so many people who, for a variety of reasons, want sex to disappear as a category, and the all colluded to make this possible.

The bizarre posters on this thread who are defending it are frying my brain, just why? Despite leading with 'awww the poor hurty feelings', you don't care about women's feelings and rights obviously. Happy to suck up to the men for some crumbs. Take a look at yourself!

Sorry for my potty mouth but it does.

That poor woman going in the ring with this fucking guy. Makes me feel sick.

Yes, particularly this. Did you know that male boxers don't wear helmets because their punching power is so great that the risk of a broken neck (torsion injury from catching on the helmet) greatly outweighs that of a fractured skull?

Now, women have much thinner skulls, so they do wear helmets. Lucky they don't risk a broken neck from being punched by men, isn't it?

I think that the video footage and photos that have been published featuring Khelif have shown that claims that this person believed they were female are to be questioned. Because Khelif does not sit like a woman at all. What woman sits for a photo shoot man spreading? Even when wearing shorts or trousers. These are not female mannerisms that I would expect from a young woman from a conservative country.

I am not convinced at all that Khelif has believed that Khelif is female since going through puberty.

Especially not in boxing.

This is not just running an 800 m race. This is punching women in the face.

Let’s not forget this.

A male regardless of gender identity or dsd should not be competing int he female sporting category

Absolutely - but particularly not in boxing IMO.

There are thousands and thousands of men who have no prospect of international sporting success. It doesn’t mean they can choose to compete in women’s competitions.

“In Suffering, Champions Are Born”: An Eye-Opening Conversation With Algerian Olympic Gold Medalist Imane Khelif

https://en.vogue.me/culture/algerian-olympic-gold-medalist-imane-khelif-vogue-arabia-interview/

Oh yes I would love to see retractions but I doubt they will happen. I fully expect the complicit silence Semenya has benefitted from, or the ambiguous "she has naturally high levels of testosterone" (ie normal for a bloody male).

Disorders like 5ARD are complex and don't lend themselves to soundbites. For people who aren't interested or find it all a bit confusing it's much easier to shut the conversation down with "can't we just be kiiiind??"

So yeah it turns out it wasn't...
The nasty terfs
Racist white women and their oppressive femininity standards
Evil JKR
The healthy mountain air in Algeria
The fact that she just trains harder and is better than y'all whiney women
A Russian conspiracy

It was just another cheating male

Why should a man who has been through male puberty be able to choose 'woman' as his social identity?

It's my understanding that most individuals with DSDs would be aware of their medical condition. It's certainly the case with the DSD Khalif has. He would have been aware before 2023 that he was male. Ditto Semenya et al.

Well this cannot be a shock to anyone who watched the olympics, except it is and people will still defend him!
I can't feel sorry for him, he knew what he was doing when he robbed those women of their hard earned medals/places in the olympics.

As a general rule of ethics, I also would normally say that publishing someone's private medical information was a step too far.

However, in this case the individual has taken advantage of privacy to lie, threaten and potentially put others at risk by using their male advantage to compete in female sport.

So, yes Michelle, I agree that when they go low we go high, but there's low and there's so low that it can't be borne.

Ironically, the lying was completely unnecessary since the IOC would have been happy for IK to compete in the female category with full disclosure of their medical condition.

This came up at time at the dinner table with my teenage DSD and I had to just move the conversation on rather than getting into it.

She is TWAW and believes all sorts of shite, frankly, with no evidence, having “seen something on TikTok.”

I agree with you. I've always had more sympathy for IK than Caster Semenya.

The medical report states that IK identifies 'pleinement', totally, as female, he has never thought of himself as male.
To the poster who wondered how he could think that if he had testicles - the medical report says that the are undescended testicles, only identified by an MRI. So IK didn't have what he, or his family, would have perceived as male genitalia. So I believe that IK and his family genuinely thought he was a girl, and even though his body changed during puberty - hence the unfair advantage in the boxing ring - he still didn't have male genitalia.

Outside of the ring, he presents as a quietly spoken person and he has mannerisms that are consistent with having been brought up as a girl - he doesn't do the 'do it like a dude' public bravado of Caster Semenya.

I agree that he was ' ill-used' because his prowess in the ring was highly politicised and he got state support and subsidies to go to Paris to get Algeria a gold medal, no ifs, buts, or biological facts could get in the way. He was/is a big sporting icon in his country

Of course he should have called a halt to it all when he got the medical reports about his 'chromosomal abnormalities', but everybody around him was egging him on to ignore it and get that gold medal, of course you're a woman, a proud Algerian women, don't listen to those nasty enemies of Algeria- Morocco was blamed at the time! - we'll sue them for saying you're not a woman.

He wasn't brave enough to say no, no to the Algerian Olympic Council, no to his family, no the the President of Algeria, no, this all has to stop, it's cheating, let me go back to obscurity and poverty and somehow I'll work out who and what I am...
I'm not sure I'd be that brave either, to be honest.

He didn't get the testing he needed as a baby to identify that he is in fact male; he didn't get the treatment he needed as a child to clarify his sex; he didn't get the support he needed when he found out that he is not female; he was manipulated by political and sporting bodies; now his medical records have been made public.

The real victims, in sporting terms, are the women who were forced to fight against a man in the Olympics, and who were cheated out of medals.
But I also feel sorry for IK.

I despair

There are plenty of people who still don't accept that Semenya is male. This will go exactly the same way unfortunately.

You’re too kind. I thought that at first but having looked at some of the imbecilic comments on SM, I’ve concluded that many people who believe in gender ideology are just thick.

What I’d like is for all the hand-wringing celebs who kept saying that IK was a biological woman to be made to admit they were wrong. I’d also like corrections to all the media articles that said IK was a biological female.

It was patently bloody obvious what IK’s sex was and the fact some people wouldn’t see it is enraging.

TheKeatingFive · Today 13:17

The kind of source that would be 'accepted' is not going to pick this up.

I expect that the Mail, Telegraph and Times are likely to run the story and the Guardian, Independent and BBC will give it a stout leaving alone.

Reduxx is unpopular amongst supposedly progressive types because it's single-mindedly dedicated towards covering the most harmful impacts of sex denialism and is entirely unapologetic about "misgendering" and "deadnaming", the two most horrifying sins in the transgenderist belief system. But their journalism is generally very high quality and they research their articles thoroughly.

Well they have us all over a barrel then, don't they?

The kind of source that would be 'accepted' is not going to pick this up.

So what can we do?

This reminds me of how kind we all were about Caster Semenya years ago, and how we thought how terrible it must have been to be brought up as a girl and then suddenly find you are a man.

Then it became clear that men with 46 XY 5 ARD go through male puberty and their voices break and they develop typically male bodies (but with undescended testicles).

Then it emerged that Semenya was tested aged 18 and has known for a fact since then that he was male. Then he published a photo of himself in his autobiography wearing nothing but swimming trunks aged 15. Teenage girls generally don't share topless photos of themselves, or go topless swimming with their friends.

It's almost as if he always knew he was male but was happy to sort of pretend to be female when necessary to cheat women out of gold medals. I think Khelif has a similar have your cake and eat it attitude.