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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How do you support other siblings when a teen decides they are trans

663 replies

Autumnleavesareslippery · 07/10/2024 09:13

I've name changed for this, have been a member for 19 years since pregnant with DS. I'm going to try and be factual as I'm in shock and dealing with a whole host of mine and my children's emotions. Yes I'm using 'he' here as none of us have got our heads around this. I'm trying to be very honest in how I feel and really need some support from people who have more of an idea about how to handle this than me.

DS (19) came home from uni on Friday. On Friday night at about 11 pm in the family chat he declared he was transgender. He informed us what he was called. It was an unusual name choice for a 19 year old - that of someone perhaps born 150 years ago. Think Enid. He told us he'd known for years.

All of us were in shock. I have DD (17) and DD and DS (both 14). I sent a message privately to him thanking for letting us know as I wasn't quite sure what else to say. He didn't read it and remained in his room. Didn't even bother with the usual teen response of a thumbs up.

Saturday and Sunday he acted completely normally, like nothing major had happened and he had told us he was vegetarian now or something. He seemed calm and relaxed. He looked exactly the same - a 6ft 2 broad shouldered man.

He then came downstairs to get a lift to the train station dressed as what I can only describe as a stereotype of what someone might think a woman looked like. Badly done make up. An odd dress that didn't fit. And started talking in a completely different soft 'feminine' voice and doing strange things with his hands that he must have deemed 'female'. He had lace like gloves on. It looked so outdated and strange.

The best way to describe it was he looked like Dame Edna or the character out of little Britain from 20 years ago in that the clothing was odd and it seemed almost designed to get a reaction. But he appeared to be deadly serious and nonchalant about it. A woman would have been clearly mocked if she dressed like it. It just leaves me wondering whether this is what he views women as?! Not that he knows any women who would act like this - he's surrounded by many women who express themselves in multiple ways but not in an Edwardian lady about to collapse way.

I drove him to the station trying to make small talk about the weather and his course and came back to everyone sat staring in disbelief. He's never said anything, acted in any way 'feminine' (whatever that means). He's at a RG uni, studying a science subject with 3 As at A level, and has organised himself a part time job. I only say this because life seems to be going well for him, rather than a potential response to something.

He is however autistic.

DD 17 is furious and says he's making a mockery of women and that woman is not a costume. She says he better not be going in female only spaces.

DD 15 looks stunned and keeps asking why he thinks he can just become a woman and what he thinks that means. She can't identify out of periods etc etc. DS 15 is laughing in disbelief. DH just looks completely confused and keeps muttering about getting loads of tattoos when he wanted to shock his parents thirty five years ago.

I genuinely don't know what to do next. Please bear in mind I'm in shock, had only just 'got over' my first born leaving for uni and all the emotions that brings.

I want to support DS19 with whatever gender expression he wants. When he still looked like him (and didn't appear to be 'dressed as' a mockery of women) I was shocked but we just thought ok, this is him experimenting with finding himself or whatever. But now I'm really worried about him and his future and whether others will look at him and think wtf. I'm also angry at the very (sorry to stereotype) 'teen boy' way he told us - late at night, no response, informing us what he was called rather than perhaps asking 'could you call me'. No consideration of the impact but I guess that might just be being 19.

I agree with what both of my daughters are saying. How do I say this because it then directly criticises DS? Do I accept he is an adult, has made his choices and my care and focus should be on them? I can't gaslight them and tell them they're wrong.

I'm now worried he's going to go into female spaces, as a clearly visible six foot plus male. This would make me angry.

He is at a university where I know lots of his lecturers (I am an academic in the same field). I know many are gender critical. Do I mention it to them first or let it be the elephant in the room?

I don't know what to say to my 85 year old mother. I think she will be very shocked and worried. I'm trying to work out if we have to tell her (she doesn't live nearby).

I don't know how much to talk to him or challenge this. I feel a kind of grief. I'm worried he's going to take hormones or do something irreversible.

We all dislike the name / think it's a very odd choice - which makes me feel very alienated from him.

And at the end of the day he's my 'baby' - I want him to be happy. I don't want people to criticise him. I want to support him but how do you do that when you question so much what he is doing? It wasn't the fact he declared himself to have a different gender but rather what followed - the declaration of name, strange clothing and fear of him going in women's spaces.

I also do absolutely realise he is an adult and can make his own choices and face the consequences. He has his own life (albeit he's being financially supported by us).

I guess it was just so sudden.

Any advice on what to do next would be gladly received.

OP posts:
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9
GatherlyGal · 07/10/2024 13:45

Autumnleavesareslippery · 07/10/2024 13:41

This I think. He’s always struggled socially particularly with fitting in with male friends as didn’t like some stereotypically male stuff (like many many men!). I fear it’s about acceptance and can only hope right now this is fluid and if he finds his feet he might realise you can have any characteristics and hobbies you want without being a woman

My daughter is like this OP. She is autistic and has always liked having short hair and wearing androgynous clothes. That used to be fine but now not being a "girly" girl or a "manly" man seems to mean you need to transition.

People actually told her she was a boy and needed to transition. That along with the desperate desire for friends and connection and being gay have all lead her to believe she's a man.

MounjaroUser · 07/10/2024 13:44

What's he usually like when choosing clothing? Does he copy what his friends wear? Is he happiest when his clothes conform with others?

I would be paying him a visit at university to see how he is there. Actually I'd be worried in case he was having a breakdown.

Autumnleavesareslippery · 07/10/2024 13:41

MounjaroUser · 07/10/2024 13:37

Does he commonly have intense passions that peter out after a while? Have there been people at school when he was younger that he's tried to emulate?

I wonder whether he was attracted towards the trans community at university because he was familiar with them at school (not personally) and knew they would be welcoming, where he found other groups harder to break into, and whether there's someone there who dresses in an outlandish way who he's trying to copy now.

This I think. He’s always struggled socially particularly with fitting in with male friends as didn’t like some stereotypically male stuff (like many many men!). I fear it’s about acceptance and can only hope right now this is fluid and if he finds his feet he might realise you can have any characteristics and hobbies you want without being a woman

OP posts:
Itisjustmyopinion · 07/10/2024 13:39

If he is trans then he requires support and so does the wider family. But to me this all seems as if it’s a bit odd, maybe even a dare. Is there a chance he has been put up to confuse his family as a piss take by friends (or people pretending to be his friends?)

The random late night announcement via text when you are in the same house
The old fashioned name
The odd clothes - he has teenage sisters, surely he knows what their style is
The voice and mannerisms

I don’t know maybe he is starting to transition but there is something that doesn’t quite add up in this situation

Autumnleavesareslippery · 07/10/2024 13:39

OrlandointheWilderness · 07/10/2024 11:42

Your family sound lovely OP. I suspect that no matter how things end up in a few years you will still have a lovely family. I don't envy you this challenge- I actually am not sure how I would address it.

Why is it transwomen never dress like me!?! Jeans and a hoody, no make up and nails. No fancy hair etc. I would have far, far less of a hard time getting my head around it if a true reflection of womanhood was represented, but no. It's always a stereotype. A bit of a strange one in this case too I'm afraid.

This. No female in his life dresses like this. Nothing else has changed. He has always had ‘gentler’ for want of a better word characteristics of being kind and open and supportive of others. That certainly doesn’t make him female. It’s all surreal.

And thank you.

OP posts:
MounjaroUser · 07/10/2024 13:37

Does he commonly have intense passions that peter out after a while? Have there been people at school when he was younger that he's tried to emulate?

I wonder whether he was attracted towards the trans community at university because he was familiar with them at school (not personally) and knew they would be welcoming, where he found other groups harder to break into, and whether there's someone there who dresses in an outlandish way who he's trying to copy now.

Demonhunter · 07/10/2024 13:26

If he thinks to dress feminine he needs to say he's a woman there's men like Jeffree Star and the fabulous John McLean that shatter that stereotype.

ElleWoods15 · 07/10/2024 13:23

MrsSkylerWhite · 07/10/2024 13:05

BinkyBeaufort · Today 13:02

I'd assume he was taking the piss, and do the same back. A few episodes of Little Britain's laydees, leaving a packet of tampons on his bed, stuff like that.
Or I'd dress up in his clothes and make him call me Uncle Ned”

Would you? Would you really?

Sadly @MrsSkylerWhite I fear she probably would, as would some other posters. I hope neither @BinkyBeaufort nor @nosmartphone have children in their care.

Brefugee · 07/10/2024 13:22

Newterm · 07/10/2024 12:07

I think it’s a shame there isn’t a New Romantics or Goth revival. Young people would be able to find their tribe and dress up like Steve Strange without having to declare themselves trans.

gosh i miss those days. All those beautiful young men like David Sylvian in perfect eyeliner...

Back to OP. Hugs. This must be incredibly difficult. But since your OP relates to the siblings rather than your 19 year old, i think you need to let them know that they have your ear, and your shoulder. and that they must feel free to let you know about their feelings, worries and fears. Your DDs sound as they have a fairly good grasp on what is at stake for them, and how womanhood isn't a costume, just be open with them all.

I also agree with PP - if your 19 year old is going to be going places with you, then they need to be dressed occasion and weather appropriate. That was the rule for me (new romantic then full on goth) growing up, and was for my DCs growing up. Not dressed appropriately? then you're not coming with us.

Time will tell, i suppose.

Silvers11 · 07/10/2024 13:20

Do you think he is confused between being trans and simply wanting to cross dress @Autumnleavesareslippery ? His choice of clothing sounds more like he thinks it's the same thing as being a drag artist? Hope you can chat to him and see where he is coming from without putting any pressure on him?

Demonhunter · 07/10/2024 13:19

Autumnleavesareslippery · 07/10/2024 09:13

I've name changed for this, have been a member for 19 years since pregnant with DS. I'm going to try and be factual as I'm in shock and dealing with a whole host of mine and my children's emotions. Yes I'm using 'he' here as none of us have got our heads around this. I'm trying to be very honest in how I feel and really need some support from people who have more of an idea about how to handle this than me.

DS (19) came home from uni on Friday. On Friday night at about 11 pm in the family chat he declared he was transgender. He informed us what he was called. It was an unusual name choice for a 19 year old - that of someone perhaps born 150 years ago. Think Enid. He told us he'd known for years.

All of us were in shock. I have DD (17) and DD and DS (both 14). I sent a message privately to him thanking for letting us know as I wasn't quite sure what else to say. He didn't read it and remained in his room. Didn't even bother with the usual teen response of a thumbs up.

Saturday and Sunday he acted completely normally, like nothing major had happened and he had told us he was vegetarian now or something. He seemed calm and relaxed. He looked exactly the same - a 6ft 2 broad shouldered man.

He then came downstairs to get a lift to the train station dressed as what I can only describe as a stereotype of what someone might think a woman looked like. Badly done make up. An odd dress that didn't fit. And started talking in a completely different soft 'feminine' voice and doing strange things with his hands that he must have deemed 'female'. He had lace like gloves on. It looked so outdated and strange.

The best way to describe it was he looked like Dame Edna or the character out of little Britain from 20 years ago in that the clothing was odd and it seemed almost designed to get a reaction. But he appeared to be deadly serious and nonchalant about it. A woman would have been clearly mocked if she dressed like it. It just leaves me wondering whether this is what he views women as?! Not that he knows any women who would act like this - he's surrounded by many women who express themselves in multiple ways but not in an Edwardian lady about to collapse way.

I drove him to the station trying to make small talk about the weather and his course and came back to everyone sat staring in disbelief. He's never said anything, acted in any way 'feminine' (whatever that means). He's at a RG uni, studying a science subject with 3 As at A level, and has organised himself a part time job. I only say this because life seems to be going well for him, rather than a potential response to something.

He is however autistic.

DD 17 is furious and says he's making a mockery of women and that woman is not a costume. She says he better not be going in female only spaces.

DD 15 looks stunned and keeps asking why he thinks he can just become a woman and what he thinks that means. She can't identify out of periods etc etc. DS 15 is laughing in disbelief. DH just looks completely confused and keeps muttering about getting loads of tattoos when he wanted to shock his parents thirty five years ago.

I genuinely don't know what to do next. Please bear in mind I'm in shock, had only just 'got over' my first born leaving for uni and all the emotions that brings.

I want to support DS19 with whatever gender expression he wants. When he still looked like him (and didn't appear to be 'dressed as' a mockery of women) I was shocked but we just thought ok, this is him experimenting with finding himself or whatever. But now I'm really worried about him and his future and whether others will look at him and think wtf. I'm also angry at the very (sorry to stereotype) 'teen boy' way he told us - late at night, no response, informing us what he was called rather than perhaps asking 'could you call me'. No consideration of the impact but I guess that might just be being 19.

I agree with what both of my daughters are saying. How do I say this because it then directly criticises DS? Do I accept he is an adult, has made his choices and my care and focus should be on them? I can't gaslight them and tell them they're wrong.

I'm now worried he's going to go into female spaces, as a clearly visible six foot plus male. This would make me angry.

He is at a university where I know lots of his lecturers (I am an academic in the same field). I know many are gender critical. Do I mention it to them first or let it be the elephant in the room?

I don't know what to say to my 85 year old mother. I think she will be very shocked and worried. I'm trying to work out if we have to tell her (she doesn't live nearby).

I don't know how much to talk to him or challenge this. I feel a kind of grief. I'm worried he's going to take hormones or do something irreversible.

We all dislike the name / think it's a very odd choice - which makes me feel very alienated from him.

And at the end of the day he's my 'baby' - I want him to be happy. I don't want people to criticise him. I want to support him but how do you do that when you question so much what he is doing? It wasn't the fact he declared himself to have a different gender but rather what followed - the declaration of name, strange clothing and fear of him going in women's spaces.

I also do absolutely realise he is an adult and can make his own choices and face the consequences. He has his own life (albeit he's being financially supported by us).

I guess it was just so sudden.

Any advice on what to do next would be gladly received.

I'm with you DD 17, it was my first thought too before I even got to that part.

Have you asked him why he thinks he is and what he thinks a woman is?

Lovemusic82 · 07/10/2024 13:19

As soon as I started reading I was thinking “is he diagnosed autistic” and then read that he is.

My DD is 20, in her 3rd year at uni and came out as trans during first year. She’s not masculine in the slightest but also never been into make up or clothes. She pretty much just wears what a 50 year old would wear, comfy clothing, slightly gender neutral. I have just been going along with it now for over 2 years in hope she will grow out of it, I’m not sure what else I can do? Dd is very immature (socially) and since being at uni has been in her first friendship group which happens to be mainly autistic trans and gay students.

I totally get how your DS’s sibling is feeling, she knows how ridiculous he looks and probably doesn’t want to be seen out with someone who is trying to imitate a female really badly 😬. Let her say how she feels to his face, she’s allowed to air her views and she’s allowed to refuse to be seen out with him.

colourfulchinadolls · 07/10/2024 13:13

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nosmartphone · 07/10/2024 13:12

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Bunnycat101 · 07/10/2024 13:10

It is really tough because as an adult you have no control and risk pushing your child away but at the same time, they need support and love as do your girls.

The thing that struck me was the caricature dressing. I worked with a trans women who dressed in a way that no other woman would in the workplace. Everyone was too scared to say anything but the mannerisms, dress etc was such an extreme representation of a stereotype of a woman that it often went too far. A conversation would have most certainly been had with any other female wearing the same. No-one would have batted an eyelid if they were wearing more normal clothes.

DemonicCaveMaggot · 07/10/2024 13:07

One of my DC is trans. They are also autistic. Most of their friends are autistic and also members of the LGBTQ community. Obviously not everyone who is autistic is going to be LGBTQ and not everyone who is LGBTQ is going to be autistic but there is quite a large overlap of both communities.

It makes sense. If his brain is wired differently, it may not just affect sensory perceptions and social interactions but how he perceives sexual orientation and gender.

SeptimusSheep · 07/10/2024 13:07

It is not easy, at 6ft 2, 'dressing up' as a woman. He will be ridiculed. He will be subjected to abuse. So no one decides to do this on a whim.

Someone very unaware of typical peer reactions might.
Someone idealistic might.
Someone socially out of kilter might.
He's autistic. It makes life difficult in an NT world.

But your daughters and younger son need reassurance here, and I think that they also need to feel of equal importance to your older son in your life. My younger child is quite vocal, often, about how quickly any conversation turns back to her autistic sibling's needs and difficulties. She's not a selfish child but she often feels sidelined. I did notice that although your title asked for help with the siblings, much of your post was about your son himself.

TISSHA · 07/10/2024 13:06

Worldgonecrazy · 07/10/2024 09:56

I would say, wear what you want but you the way you have chosen to dress and act looks like you are mocking / stereotyping women rather than copying what actual women might wear and you and his sisters, as women, are allowed to be upset by his perception and enactment of what he thinks a woman is. Be honest about the reaction he is likely to get. Then steadfastly ignore it. He is welcome to his fantasy but you and your family don’t have to enter it with him.

It’s hurtful when our children act in this way, he is an adult and can do what he wants. You have no idea how it feels to identify as transgender and he has no idea of what it is to be a woman.

Excellent response!

GatherlyGal · 07/10/2024 13:06

This is so hard OP.

In my experience as a parent of a gender-confused kid here are some things that helped us:

The gender questioning is likely linked to the autism and and other "identity" issues. I can almost guarantee there are other things going on either with friends or relationships or another mental health condition which your son believes will be fixed by his becoming a woman.

You need to keep him close. You don't have to accept he's a woman or anything or even use the chosen name but any ridicule or punishment or lectures about women's rights will alienate him and not help in the longterm.

If you do not keep him close there are numerous professionals and less well-meaning people around who will exploit that distance and possibly damage your relationship. He needs you now more than ever.

He also probably needs some kind of support like therapy and if you can afford that and he is willing I suggest you get it in place asap.

Try talking openly about what he's feeling and why. He will have read and studied about gender identity and convinced himself that this is FACT. Try to talk without agreeing or disagreeing and see if siblings can be encouraged to do the same.

I see my job as a parent in this situation to get my kid as close to 25 as I can without any permanent medical treatment / surgery. I know I may fail in this and I know my kid will do what they will do. In the meantime I try to tread the very delicate line of providing love and support while thinking the whole ideology that has captured swathes of people and institutions is a massive pile of bollocks which doing untold harm to vulnerable people.

MounjaroUser · 07/10/2024 13:05

Why didn't you go to his room to talk it through, OP?

MrsSkylerWhite · 07/10/2024 13:05

BinkyBeaufort · Today 13:02

I'd assume he was taking the piss, and do the same back. A few episodes of Little Britain's laydees, leaving a packet of tampons on his bed, stuff like that.
Or I'd dress up in his clothes and make him call me Uncle Ned”

Would you? Would you really?

MounjaroUser · 07/10/2024 13:04

Autumnleavesareslippery · 07/10/2024 10:54

Yep - no emotion in it whatsoever. Could as well have read 'I'm going into town tomorrow, won't be back for dinner'. It was the not bothering to read the response, whilst sitting in our house that threw me.

I would feel just as you do, but could it be he was terrified of reading your responses?

ThisIsAlmostHalloween · 07/10/2024 13:02

"help him to be the best woman he can."

He can't be a woman. He's a man. He can play dress up though but sounds like he's doing it badly.

What experiences growing up shaped you into a woman?

The female friendships, relationships. Thw dynamics of navigating the world as a girl. Your first crush. Your first kiss. The first time you recieved unwanted attention from a male. Your first bra fitting. Getting your bra strap 'snapped' by a boy in PE. The pain and embarrassment of your first period. UTIs. PMS. Period cramps. Etc
Etc
Etc

What does this 19 year old boy know about being a woman?

That they wear lace frocks and white gloves??

Do they??

It's a parody. It's appropriation. It's drag. It's a fetish. It's a shock tactic. It's attention seeking. It's a cry for help.

It's not womanhood

BinkyBeaufort · 07/10/2024 13:02

I'd assume he was taking the piss, and do the same back. A few episodes of Little Britain's laydees, leaving a packet of tampons on his bed, stuff like that.
Or I'd dress up in his clothes and make him call me Uncle Ned.

But then I can't be doing with all this trans shit. A few, a very very few, people may have genuine problems with how they see themselves in society but it's mostly bandwagon jumping or an excuse by misogynistic men to invade women's spaces for various reasons.
Another 6 months and he'll grow out of it.

Awaiting deletion........

Rorymyers · 07/10/2024 13:01

Branleuse · 07/10/2024 12:29

Id try and ignore it as much as possible. I dont affirm my childs preferred gender identity, but ive told them i understand its important to them, so im just going to treat it the same as I do with other friends and family who have different religious or other strong beliefs to me.
Im not going to pretend I believe something that I dont believe and know not to be true.
I think your daughters are quite right, and im glad they arent as scared of upsetting him as you clearly are.

Telling OP to ignore? How? Its not like an invisible thing is it so how do you ignore your male child suddenly dressing as a woman.

OP your DS needs to fully realise that once he steps out of that door he is a representative of you and your family and how people perceive him is how they perceive your family. would your other DC friends not make fun of them if they knew ? does your DS consider them in his decision?

OP I would not force your other DC to accept if they don’t want to. You as a parent however , have a duty to support. But let the DC react how they deem fit. Your DS clearly sprung this on them too and did not care for their thoughts so it’s only fair.

so many layers to this OP but your solution is not on MN. Your family sound lovely.

goodluck.

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