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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Labour is betraying women

331 replies

IwantToRetire · 18/09/2024 00:41

. . . If Starmer’s government has achieved so much depressing stuff in 71 days, roughly 4 per cent of the way into a possible 5-year term, what they might achieve by the end of it fills me with dread. I believe that Labour showed us, and in some instances told us, what they would do, or not do, to ensure the continued erosion of women’s rights, and they are doing exactly what they said. Why some feminist women, seemingly in a blind bond to Labour, didn’t believe them escapes me. It also infuriates me that they think Labour deserve a bit more rope to hang us with.

Some prominent left-wing women, before the election, pleaded with us to trust Labour and allow them space to make the right decisions. They suggested that it was wrong to focus on the single issue of gender ideology, because women would benefit in so many other ways under a Labour government.

I wonder, did they envisage this Labour government? The one maintaining unequal benefits, placing violent men amongst their female victims and keeping the blurred line between gender and sex embedded in law? I can understand if those women were now as dismayed as the rest of us at what they are seeing, but instead they appear to be spinning for Labour, suggesting the violent men aren’t really being released or excusing it by blaming the Tories. They suggest we should wait and see what happens, keep the faith, trust the process. After many years of being told that women are influencing Labour “behind the scenes” my faith in that has gone.

If you are a feminist woman openly critical of Labour you may now be accused of “right wing drift”. This is nonsense. Instead, should scrutiny not be focused on how far Labour have drifted from the left? This is where condemnation should be aimed. . . .

NB - these are only some paragraphs from the article - you can read the whole article here - https://thecritic.co.uk/labour-is-betraying-women/

Labour is betraying women | Jean Hatchet | The Critic Magazine

The outrage many women are feeling at some of Labour’s initial acts in government, which will deeply affect women’s lives, is loud and righteous. The past week has been particularly egregious…

https://thecritic.co.uk/labour-is-betraying-women

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ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 23/09/2024 21:49

"Working people" aye.

Quadrature money now picked up by the Telegraph but originally on Open Democracy:

www.opendemocracy.net/en/labour-given-4m-from-tax-haven-based-hedge-fund-with-shares-in-oil-and-arms/

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/23/cayman-islands-hedge-fund-labour-rceord-donation-quadrature/

"An investigation last year by The Guardiann_ found that the company owned $170 million (£125 million) of shares in fossil fuels firms, including major polluters. It also reportedly holds millions of pounds worth of shares in US-based private healthcare companies and arms manufacturers.
...
The firm’s gift to Labour has only now come to light because it was accepted just before tighter transparency rules kicked in for the election periodd_.
Normally donations are published every three months, but during campaigns parties must declare what they have received every week.
Rishi Sunak called the snap poll on May 222_, with the Electoral Commission’s “pre-poll reporting” obligations kicking in a week later on May 30.
Electoral Commission records show that Labour accepted the £4 million from Quadrature on May 28, before the new rules had come into force. As a result, the donation was not made public until long after the election took place.
The timing of the declaration will raise questions over whether the party was seeking to avoid the controversy of it being published during the campaign."

duc748 · 23/09/2024 21:48

They don't represent "working people"

Well, they could try starting...

RVEllacott · 23/09/2024 21:26

When we heard Rachel Reeves' speech in the radio DH and I both commented how inappropriate the self congratulations were because of how few people actually voted Labour. They don't represent "working people" (which is what she kept saying). They actually represent a relatively small percentage of the population.

StainlessSteelMouse · 23/09/2024 20:56

Let's face it, we are being governed by Sussex University Student Union.

duc748 · 23/09/2024 20:50

I don't see why they couldn't have just made the WFA taxable. But as noted, the govt have been remarkably politically inept.

IwantToRetire · 23/09/2024 20:38

I've been half listening to some news reports from the Labour Party Conference (seriously reporters are so useless, just being chummy with their interviewees).

And am now beginning to wonder that in line with their student union style policies and posturing, that they are going on about Tory deficit being far worse than anyone imagined (more serious economists have pointed out that compared to other european countries it isn't that bad) and to illustrate just how awful the Tories are, they had this mad idea that if that made the first cuts against pensioners everybody would join in and say its all the Tories fault.

I really think their thought processes are so batshit they really thought this.

Because if not why chose this group to demonstrate their "fiscal" rules are real.

I hear that nurses have rejected their pay offer, and cant see how given the other pay awards Labour has made that they wont have to go along with an improved offer.

They just look like bullies picking on pensioners who cant after all go on strike.

And if fuel allowances are such a major drain why aren't they looking at recouping all the lost income from tax avoidance.

Some sub human MP said the really important thing was that by cutting the winter fuel allowance for this year, Labour would balance the books for this year.

So when or if there is an increase in deaths of pensioners this year, Labour will be able to say well it was worth it because we balanced the books for this financial year.

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ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 23/09/2024 20:14

There was then a load of crowing at how badly the Tories had done in the election

So badly that Prof Curtice was inspired to write this

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/23/the-writing-is-on-already-the-wall-for-labours-government/

The writing is on already the wall for Labour’s floundering government
Keir Starmer’s ‘loveless landslide’ was always volatile, and his weak political antennae has seen his party sink in the polls

...

"Although Labour won a landslide victory in terms of seats, its success was built on fragile electoral foundations. Faced with having to deal with a difficult if hardly unexpected fiscal crisis, that fragility has rapidly been exposed.
The electorate did not embrace Labour in July. Voters’ principal objective was to see the back of a Conservative government in which they had lost confidence thanks, above all, to “Partygate” and the Liz Truss “fiscal event”. Where Labour were best placed locally to defeat the Conservatives they enjoyed a significant advance. Elsewhere, other than in Scotland where Labour benefitted from the similar travails of the SNPP_, the party’s vote typically fell back.
It was Reform, not Labour, who gained most from Tory disenchantment. Nearly one in four 2019 Conservative voters switched to Reform compared with just one in eight who backed Labour.
As a result, Labour won just 35 per cent of the vote – in an election where only three in five voted. Never before has a party won an overall majority with so low a share of the vote. Consequently, the pool of voters willing to give it the benefit of the doubt is unusually small.
That said, Labour’s victory did occasion a boost in Sir Keir Starmer’s personal popularity. According to Ipsos, net satisfaction with the new Prime Minister increased from -21 before the election to +7 immediately afterwards. Similar improvements were registered by both YouGov and Opinium.
But this boost has rapidly disappeared. According to Ipsos, Sir Keir’s net satisfaction rating is down back to -21. Opinium reported at the weekend that his net approval score has plummeted from +18 in July to -26 now, lower than at any time while he was Leader of the Opposition.
...

Sir Keir is not helped either by his apparently weak political antennae. He took a long time to recognise that his decision before the election to admit the Tory MP, Natalie Elphicke, into Labour’s ranks was bound to lead to questions about the continued suspension of Diane Abbott. Now it has taken Labour too long to appreciate that the receipt of highly personal gifts and hospitality would look bad for a party that had mercilessly attacked the ethics of the last Conservative government.

In truth, Labour badly need Sir Keir to be quicker off the political mark."

JenniferBooth · 23/09/2024 19:50

When the Grenfell report came out a few weeks ago Starmer gave a speech in the HOC about how working class people are ignored and should be listened to.

Well post Grenfell and post lockdowns (when it was key workers who gave it their all) we are still waiting.

JenniferBooth · 23/09/2024 19:20

RedToothBrush · 21/09/2024 16:36

That would be my reading of the data yes.

Men live with parents longer before leaving home. They are less likely to be single parents.
Men and women tend to remarry within 5 years of a divorce but a higher percentage of men remarry.
Men don't live as long.
Women are less likely to be single but more likely to be divorced or widowed.

So what men do is live at home much longer, find a wife/partner and then the pattern is to be more likely to remarry, not looking after the kids and die earlier.

Women marry/partner up earlier, end up with the kids, less likely to remarry and then are more likely to be widowed.

Every part of this ultimately favours men over women.

Yep Then there is this......
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13844765/Fury-Sadiq-Khan-suggests-prisoners-given-choice-housing-cut-reoffending.html

Sadiq Khan suggests prisoners should be given first choice of housing

The Labour Mayor of ­ London said 'a certain percentage' of prisoners should be prioritised despite rough sleeping hitting its highest level in London in a decade.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13844765/Fury-Sadiq-Khan-suggests-prisoners-given-choice-housing-cut-reoffending.html

StainlessSteelMouse · 23/09/2024 17:42

And, although now not recognised, far more people from working class backgrounds being able to break through into traditional MC work such as the media.

Nobody would believe you now if you said that, not too long ago, journalism was a working class profession. Bright kids got jobs at local papers, built a track record, then graduated to Fleet Street. Some even made it into the BBC, though that was always a more exclusive club.

Now the local papers are mostly gone, national newspapers are in remorseless decline, and journalism is more and more a public school and Oxbridge scene.

It's very like the gentrification of Labour politics. It used to be that you couldn't become an AEU sponsored MP unless you were a time served engineer. That kept Parliament more male and white than it should have been, but at least it meant there was working class representation. I'd be surprised if, out of the 400 odd current Labour MPs, there are more than a handful who have worked a manual job. And if you did a survey, you'd find that lots of them are nepo babies.

IwantToRetire · 23/09/2024 17:18

we have a society where people mainly rented, and there was sufficient housing,

If the boomers (and those from early generations) did have an advantage it was in fact the post WWII committment to house building.

Not to make a quick profit by to make up for the loss of housing stock during WWII.

I often think if a government was able to say, housing in the UK is an emergency and we will emulate the post war Labour Government https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/zsd68mn/revision/5

Given the deplorable state of some private rentals, and lets face it social housing, a nice prefab on a small development in a vacant lot in a town or city would be a relief.

Although given the standard of current "skills" in the housing sector that Grenfell has so horribly shown, the UK probably doesn't have the competence to do this.

The 'Homes for All' policy - Rebuilding the country after 1945 - WJEC - GCSE History Revision - WJEC - BBC Bitesize

Learn and revise about rebuilding the country after 1945 for Unit 1 Depression, War and Recovery WJEC with BBC Bitesize.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/zsd68mn/revision/5

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IwantToRetire · 23/09/2024 17:02

Well many years ago, when even then there were cynical socialists, they put forward the idea the first of all taking on a mortguage and then student debt wasn't about benefiting those who fell for the fairy tell, but to create wage slaves.

If, and it certainly wouldn't match the life style expectations of today, we have a society where people mainly rented, and there was sufficient housing, it was far easier for people to be able to move to take up job offers etc., or heaven forbid decide to opt out of the rat race.

So the idea that some how the 70s was a time of plenty in terms of current standards of living (even a quick bit of research would show you how it wasn't), it did have a far less rigid structure. And, although now not recognised, far more people from working class backgrounds being able to break through into traditional MC work such as the media. And of course, the fact that most free university courses went to young people from working class backgrounds.

But although nobody talked about a squeezed middle at that time, there were still many other more traditional ways of getting into a profession through apprentiships or being an article clerk. But that meant accepting you started at the bottom and worked you way up. Not parachute into a middle management job never having managed anything.

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duc748 · 23/09/2024 16:56

Except that now the universities are increasingly full of Chinese students. They are a money-making business, but it doesn't do much for the UK economy.

TempestTost · 23/09/2024 16:49

But to take this back to an earlier point - it is in some way a good example of the thinking of the PMC - the solution to poor wages or other problems in the working classes is apparently to get everyone to go to university and work in an office.

There is a deep, but well hidden, lack of respect and appreciation for work that is practical or hands on within that thinking.

TempestTost · 23/09/2024 16:46

To be fair, this idea that everyone should go to university seems to have been taken up across at least the English speaking western countries. Where it seems to be a universal disaster.

Just a ton of debt for kids, people not trained in the right kinds of skills, wasting their time for four years or so out of the job market, and also the destruction in many ways of university education, and increasingly the reputation of universities too.

IwantToRetire · 23/09/2024 16:39

It doesn't help that we have such a superficial news media.

Now that the first negative response to the fuel allowance cuts have been and gone, the news "reporters" are letting Labour make out not to worry, if you survive the winter you will get a pension increase.

Not only does that mean the media are no longer questioning them about those just over the pension credit limit who will end up worse off than those on pension credit, but by passes why there is a triple lock.

The triple lock was introduced because it became obvious that compared to other european countries UK pensioners were getting poverty pensions. So it isn't some sort of aren't the pensioners lucky, it about trying to restore pensions to a decent level.

And in fact it politicians and the dozy media talked about the reality it would then mean that at some point (and I dont know today's comparisons) a Government could put forward that the triple lock was no longer needed. But given how brain dead both politicians and news reporting are suspect that in no time at all pensions would revert to poverty levels.

In my really bitter moments everytime I here some whiney youngster going on about how the boomers had it so good (like starting work at 15, not being able to go to university because less than 20% got free education, and so on) I almost hope they do cut pensions so that when this whiney generation gets to retire they will find they are living on a pittance.

One thing for sure, thanks to Blair's pretentious claim that everybody should have university education so that we have a more skilled workforce has in fact proved the opposite. University seems to produce people less able to do actual work.

When did we become so stupid as a country. Some of us might sneer at Trump supporters, but many in this country are just as deluded in thinking politicians are talking sense and practical realities. Just because they are a very tiny, tiny bit left doesn't mean they shouldn't be equally derided.

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SquirrelSoShiny · 23/09/2024 16:08

RVEllacott · 23/09/2024 16:00

There are some interesting points on this thread which I'm just catching up on. I heard part of Rachel Reeves' conference speech when I was on my lunch break. I don't often bother listening to political speeches but even I was surprised how cringeworthy and uninspiring it was.

There was a section about how proud she was to be a female Chancellor and the strong women who had gone before her whilst conveniently ignoring the fact that Labour struggle to define what a woman is and the Tories managed to elect their first female leader almost fifty years ago - something Labour still haven't achieved.

There was then a load of crowing at how badly the Tories had done in the election which made her seem ridiculously petty rather than a grown-up with an important job. At what point are Labour going to stop going on about the Tories and own their decisions?

There was some light relief provided by a heckler so clearly not everyone in the conference hall was on board with the nonsense.

Yes I've pretty much lost faith in Labour completely until they demonstrate good faith towards women.

RVEllacott · 23/09/2024 16:00

There are some interesting points on this thread which I'm just catching up on. I heard part of Rachel Reeves' conference speech when I was on my lunch break. I don't often bother listening to political speeches but even I was surprised how cringeworthy and uninspiring it was.

There was a section about how proud she was to be a female Chancellor and the strong women who had gone before her whilst conveniently ignoring the fact that Labour struggle to define what a woman is and the Tories managed to elect their first female leader almost fifty years ago - something Labour still haven't achieved.

There was then a load of crowing at how badly the Tories had done in the election which made her seem ridiculously petty rather than a grown-up with an important job. At what point are Labour going to stop going on about the Tories and own their decisions?

There was some light relief provided by a heckler so clearly not everyone in the conference hall was on board with the nonsense.

Withless · 23/09/2024 03:39

Of course Carrie Johnson famously rented her dresses!

IwantToRetire · 23/09/2024 00:20

I don't understand what you mean. I said I did not think she would be criticized for wearing the same dress to a very fancy event more than once.
I mean, maybe some of the guests who are former mean girls might notice, but who cares what they think? I hope not Mrs Starmer.
In any case, renting or borrowing is totally appropriate and common at events like that if she wants to wear something totally new.

I think I misread your comment as somehow I missed the I don't at the start of the sentence.

And I totally agree that for "grand" occassions renting seems right. And very green!

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TempestTost · 22/09/2024 23:54

IwantToRetire · 22/09/2024 23:42

wearing the same thing more than once would get any real criticism

Why? Its normal to have a limited number of outfits / suits and obviously wear that more than once.

She's only in the public eye because she is "the wife". She's not a fashion guru or in the public eye for being a walking ad for some dress designer.

Its madness.

Deserves another thread, but quite honeslty a lot of the madness we now experience is because of fear of what the media might say.

So our politics (and just about everything else) is dumbed down to the level of not upsetting some unprincipled news paper editor who just cant wait to contrive a shouty headline.

I don't understand what you mean. I said I did not think she would be criticized for wearing the same dress to a very fancy event more than once.

I mean, maybe some of the guests who are former mean girls might notice, but who cares what they think? I hope not Mrs Starmer.

In any case, renting or borrowing is totally appropriate and common at events like that if she wants to wear something totally new.

IwantToRetire · 22/09/2024 23:42

wearing the same thing more than once would get any real criticism

Why? Its normal to have a limited number of outfits / suits and obviously wear that more than once.

She's only in the public eye because she is "the wife". She's not a fashion guru or in the public eye for being a walking ad for some dress designer.

Its madness.

Deserves another thread, but quite honeslty a lot of the madness we now experience is because of fear of what the media might say.

So our politics (and just about everything else) is dumbed down to the level of not upsetting some unprincipled news paper editor who just cant wait to contrive a shouty headline.

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TempestTost · 22/09/2024 22:36

I don't really think that Mrs Starmer would get any serious blowback or criticism if she wore things from high street shops most of the time, even members of the royal family do and no one that matters has a problem with it. Especially British brands.

They do, unlike most of us, go to some functions that require special clothes, but I also do not think that wearing the same thing more than once would get any real criticism. And it's very common for people to rent for these kinds of occasions anyway, again, even at very high levels in politics.

I do think you could make the argument that an off the rack suit isn't going to look great on the PM, but by the same token even a very well dressed man needs a very limited number of good suits. And if they are really good quality bespoken stuff they will last a long time and not need to be replaced often, and will represent pretty good value for money.

Literally no one expects them to be constantly wearing designer stuff (glasses!) and they wouldn't be criticized for not doing so, it's just a bs excuse.

Floisme · 22/09/2024 20:33

See I don't expect them to pretend they can only afford to shop at M&S and holiday at Butlins. I know they earn considerably more than I ever did and I don't begrudge them buying nice clothes, I just expect them to fund the cost of their clothes and city breaks from their own salaries, especially when they keep warning us about more pain ahead. And I think it beggars belief that not one of them had the wit and imagination to ask their wealthy donors to divert their contributions to a food bank.

UltraLiteLife · 22/09/2024 20:24

StainlessSteelMouse · 22/09/2024 20:21

Maybe what women need to do to get a fair hearing from Labour is to club together and buy Keir some nice suits.

If that's what it takes we could crowdfund it. Maybe that and an informal dinner at No. 10 so a sensible person could talk to him.