John Lewis 'allows trans women into bra-fitting rooms' as retailer hit by furious gender row

WTAF!

Bring me the brain bleach now!

The one they were forced to shut down.

Lipsyncing seems a very apposite hobby though.

The incongruence of "presents as female" right next to a helpful photo of him presenting as a male in some sort of sadomasochism themed panto.

Oh.. no! It's Ruby! Now it is all coming back. That exhibition that JL had was also a real eye opener!

The one they were forced to shut down.

Oh.. no! It's Ruby! Now it is all coming back. That exhibition that JL had was also a real eye opener!

Bloody hell. I hadn't got my glasses on and zoomed in a bit on the right hand photo. I really wish I hadn't.

ElleWoods15

would you say that the man in this picture who works for the John Lewis company is sexually motivated?

Do you agree that if John Lewis allow men like this to work in their changing rooms, or fit bras, they need to be held to account and should be ashamed of themselves.

x.com/mforstater/status/1758802681643102706

While at the same time, denying that that's exactly what they're doing.

It's quite remarkable.

Blimey! It is remarkable when I see some people who genuinely believe they can censure a politician with decades of experience, with international representative duties included, on what tone is effective or not to a particular letter recipient and what words should and shouldn’t be said in that official communication on her letterhead.

For instance

x.com/mforstater/status/1758802681643102706?

Not asking for her to be ’nicer’.

Yes, you are.

The tone of her letter is base, and inappropriate coming from a member of the HoL writing in her capacity as such.

No, it is not. The letter is clear and unequivocal no room for misunderstanding, and it got the desired result very quickly.

Her second letter- essentially offering to (for want of a better word) mansplain at a meeting- is little better.

Again, no,

And please stop misrepresenting my posts on other threads.

No-one has misrepresented your posts they can be seen for exactly what they are.

Because as I said, the Internet is awash with BBBs. Let John Lewis be faced with endless online pictures of these men posing in their underwear, then deny that they're not sexually motivated.

They only have to look at the social media of some of their own employees, as featured in their now memory holed LGBT staff magazine

She's not a man, Elle, so she can't "mansplain". She's entirely reasonable to give this man, who is a man, advice based on women's rights.

Not asking for her to be ’nicer’. The tone of her letter is base, and inappropriate coming from a member of the HoL writing in her capacity as such.

Her second letter- essentially offering to (for want of a better word) mansplain (arguably incorrectly) at a meeting- is little better.

And please stop misrepresenting my posts on other threads.

You're missing the point. We've gone beyond pretending that this is about an oppressed minority who just want to pee, change, etc.

The type of man who wants to go into the bra fitting at John Lewis is absolutely your common or garden BBB. In other words a man with autogynephilia. BBB is the reality, not a slur.

The Baroness isn't noted for beating about the bush and personally I think it's a very effective move on her behalf.

If John Lewis even has half the reaction you've had, the obvious next step is to show them.

Because as I said, the Internet is awash with BBBs. Let John Lewis be faced with endless online pictures of these men posing in their underwear, then deny that they're not sexually motivated.

Perhaps you could offer consulting services to the House of Lords on a pro bono basis...

Yes, you are scolding, as you've done on other threads. Derailing the conversation by 'helpfully' pointing out that if women were just a bit nicer, politer, more professional in tone, yadda yadda yadda, we'd not have these problems.

Ie, it is all our own fault that men are walking all over us.

We've heard it a million times.

Edit for typo.

In the first letter, which is where BBB made his appearance, Baroness Nicholson asked for a copy of the JL trans inclusion policy. She got it.

I'm sure when Baroness Nicholson, who has spent decades in politics, needs some advice from an anonymous person on the internet about how to do her job effectively, she'll come straight to you @ElleWoods15.

Did she get the meeting she’s requested? I missed that.

"if she wants to be taken seriously" indeed!
🙄

And yet funnily enough Baroness Nicholson's letter did achieve the desired result. And in double-quick time. She knows what she is doing.

If you're going to get offended on anyone's behalf, how about the women and girls that these men are larping and whose privacy, dignity and safety is being compromised?

I’m not ‘scolding women’ if that’s directed at me. I’m pointing out that if she wants to be taken seriously, and have a discussion with the CEO of JL (which is what would actually benefit those posters who are upset by the JL policy) looking like a nutty rant isn’t the way to go about it, and it’s below the office she’s representing.