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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Anyone know why the thread about the death of the young transman has been deleted

411 replies

Taytoface · 19/08/2024 09:20

Horrific story about death due to surgical complications, was reading it and poof. Anyone know what happened. This is such important information to get out there.

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ArabellaScott · 20/08/2024 10:49

And you can see here the NHS is basing the 'gender dysphoria pathway' on activist organisations like WPATH and Stonewall:

https://www.cqc.org.uk/guidance-providers/healthcare/adult-trans-care-pathway

The adult trans care pathway - Care Quality Commission

https://www.cqc.org.uk/guidance-providers/healthcare/adult-trans-care-pathway

Dygger · 20/08/2024 10:47

ArabellaScott · 20/08/2024 10:37

It has various unintended consequences, one of which is that it dilutes and distorts the term 'far right' so that it becomes harder to actually discern the 'far right'.

People using the phrase to mean 'someone I hate' do the genuine work of countering fascism a huge disservice.

It's also grossly offensive to all those who have suffered at the hands of far right ideologues.

Plus, it's just fucking stupid.

Yes. There was a time when if someone accused me of being a transphobe I'd stop in my tracks and look at what I'd said/ written and think well, am I? But now I don't even hear it, it's so stripped of any meaning. It's unlikely to be long before the shock value of being accused of being on the far right wears off and 'far right' loses all meaning.

LilyBartsHatShop · 20/08/2024 10:46

Actually possibly you mean "alt right"?
That's like the cultural turn but for the right wing.

LilyBartsHatShop · 20/08/2024 10:45

Caliga · 20/08/2024 09:51

@OldCrone

I'm a bit mystified as to why you believe the fruitfarms is a political site. I haven't seen a lot of political discussion on that site. What makes you think it's a site discussing far right politics?

Far right just means politics? That's new. I must write that down.

I'm another poster curious to know what this non-politics-relatedpolitical definition of "far right" is?
Actually I think it might help me understand what many people mean when they use the term.

LilyBartsHatShop · 20/08/2024 10:43

KeirSpoutsTwaddle · 20/08/2024 09:00

she had a second account when locked out of the first. Gruffin22
And a post about the partial costs- said there’s more.

Is this suggesting that Sivert couldn't afford life preserving surgery? I mean, couldn't afford the surgery to fix up complications from the previous surgeries that were becoming life threatening?
It's all so heartbreaking.

oakleaffy · 20/08/2024 10:42

Lovelyview · 19/08/2024 09:34

It's a horrific story. There's a lot about it on Twitter. I was astonished to find out this surgery is going to be offered on the NHS at this clinic https://gendersurgery.chelwest.nhs.uk I don't know if it is already offered elsewhere on the NHS. I'm gobsmacked that anyone thinks this is a good idea.

Oh my goodness- Why is NHS funding what is basically a “cosmetic “surgery?

If People want to pay privately, then that’s on them.

There are de transitioners who bitterly regret having surgery.

It’s so risky.

Signalbox · 20/08/2024 10:37

I can’t believe the NHS offers this asa surgery. Where is the evidence for such invasive, dangerous, elective surgeries on healthy women?

ArabellaScott · 20/08/2024 10:37

Helleofabore · 20/08/2024 10:25

I think we know that this very lazy tactic of making accusations of 'far right' is how those with poorly supported discussion and opinions influence others. It is an attempt to shape the discussion to follow the acceptable discussion points.

I have watched it with my teen's friends. They were all so afraid of being seen as being even a little different from the accepted opinions that they simply repeat trope and mantras. Particularly those who have declared trans identities, unfortunately.

It has various unintended consequences, one of which is that it dilutes and distorts the term 'far right' so that it becomes harder to actually discern the 'far right'.

People using the phrase to mean 'someone I hate' do the genuine work of countering fascism a huge disservice.

It's also grossly offensive to all those who have suffered at the hands of far right ideologues.

Plus, it's just fucking stupid.

Abhannmor · 20/08/2024 10:37

To Exulansic held a memorial/ wake for her on Twitter yesterday apparently

ArabellaScott · 20/08/2024 10:34

KeirSpoutsTwaddle · 20/08/2024 07:41

To be fair, I’m moving further right with every post that certain folk here make. The more people try and tell me what I’m allowed to think and say, the more right wing I seem to get. I feel as though I’m being pushed right despite my inclinations

It's unlikely you really are, though.

Right and left wing are political positions based on views about the economy and policy. They're not emotive tribal identifiers based on feelz, whatever some people try to say.

No particular party can claim to embody either left or right wing, just as no women's group can lay claim to the whole of feminism.

I know you know this, and I know what you mean.

But it's another case of people trying to use language to distort reality. Resist!

OldCrone · 20/08/2024 10:34

Caliga · 20/08/2024 09:55

@Dygger

Thank you for that. Not many adults around here who refer to their teachers. And lots of women here willing to listen to people who are better informed than they are.

School holidays, eh?

Not many adults feel the need to critique others' posts like academic essays, and then tell them that they are, apparently, better informed while not being able to answer the question I originally asked.

And then imply I'm a pimply teenager on school break. Laughable.

What was your question?

BodyKeepingScore · 20/08/2024 10:32

lcakethereforeIam · 19/08/2024 09:28

I was just reading the linked Ovarit threads when it was deleted. I was wondering if it was about fictional person, planted to get us worked up about nothing, especially as the last letters of her name spelled 'terv' backwards, iirc.

It's a real person. I've been following them on TikTok for years.

OldCrone · 20/08/2024 10:31

Caliga · 20/08/2024 09:51

@OldCrone

I'm a bit mystified as to why you believe the fruitfarms is a political site. I haven't seen a lot of political discussion on that site. What makes you think it's a site discussing far right politics?

Far right just means politics? That's new. I must write that down.

Didn't you know that?

Right wing and left wing are political positions. What did you think they were?

WarriorN · 20/08/2024 10:30

It's how every authoritarian state has operated in history Helleofabore, whether they used religion or loyalty to the head of state.

Repeated social shaming for invented heresy to stop any discussion or debate in order to perpetuate the ruling ideology that the leader of the time is infallible.

lcakethereforeIam · 20/08/2024 10:30

What I find chilling, so much so that I've hesitated to write this post is the thought of all the other Griffin's that must be out there. Her suffering is over now, I don't know how unique it is that she documented it like she did. There are undoubtedly others though, suffering quietly. Perhaps still true believers, thinking that this procedure will finally fix everything. Or perhaps they've woken up enough to live in regret and shame, possibly afraid to say anything because their glitter family, their community will turn on them. Maybe they'll even be called 'far right'.

ChaChaChooey · 20/08/2024 10:26

Caliga · 20/08/2024 02:36

No. That's a classic response - "You just think it's far right because you think it's horrible". It encompasses all the hate and bilge that can't be expressed on the usual sites. This hostility and ideology stems most commonly from the far right. Sorry.

Silly sausage.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 20/08/2024 10:26

YY @Helleofabore it's very obvious.

ArabellaScott · 20/08/2024 10:26

Omlettes · 19/08/2024 19:12

There is no bottom to where Channel Four will go.
I remember how creative interesting and exciting they were in the 90s.
Alex Mahon the CEO is one of those women in power who try to out macho the men at womens expense.
See Sturgeon Thatcher et al.
They are about to show a series of women losing their virginity on national TV.
zephrapi.thesun.co.uk/tv/29923264/the-intimacy-retreat-channel-4-virgins/

I hate her with a passion for this erosion of anything sane .
If you are as disgusted as me, please drop her a line
https://www.ceoemail.com/s.php?id=ceo-9452&c=Channel%204-Chief%20Executive

And write to OFCOM
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/make-a-complaint/complain-about-tv-radio-or-on-demand-services/

It takes the same time as to comment here.

That needs its own thread.

Helleofabore · 20/08/2024 10:25

I think we know that this very lazy tactic of making accusations of 'far right' is how those with poorly supported discussion and opinions influence others. It is an attempt to shape the discussion to follow the acceptable discussion points.

I have watched it with my teen's friends. They were all so afraid of being seen as being even a little different from the accepted opinions that they simply repeat trope and mantras. Particularly those who have declared trans identities, unfortunately.

WarriorN · 20/08/2024 10:21

Respectful debate too - name calling eg "bigots" is a poor show without evidence.

In actual fact, I'd suggest you spend a long time on the farms before you comment, and come back with the evidence to back up your claims.

Otherwise it's just heresay and rumour.

Oh but....

I'm not making any comments on the place as I've not spent much time there and have no interest or time to do so.

NotBadConsidering · 20/08/2024 10:19

There are umpteen threads about “right wing” nonsense. This is thread about a poor woman who was operated on multiple times and left with horrendous complications. Let’s not get distracted from that.

WarriorN · 20/08/2024 10:12

There's "right" and "left" but there's authoritarianism on both sides.

The key to a progressive society that centres the wellbeing of humans (and the planet) is one that is able to debate freely without restriction.

The key to good effective medicine is being able to raise issues of harm and review and debate, using scientific evidence.

Populist media are propagating harmful rhetoric about medical science within the concept of "trans." There's been authoritarianism across all spheres of society.

When information is suppressed as much as it has been, it's going to come out in those less mainstream corners of society/ the web, along with anything else that's not allowed to be discussed.

Women here are intelligent enough to filter out what's important and what's not.

Helleofabore · 20/08/2024 10:10

Caliga · 20/08/2024 09:55

@Dygger

Thank you for that. Not many adults around here who refer to their teachers. And lots of women here willing to listen to people who are better informed than they are.

School holidays, eh?

Not many adults feel the need to critique others' posts like academic essays, and then tell them that they are, apparently, better informed while not being able to answer the question I originally asked.

And then imply I'm a pimply teenager on school break. Laughable.

No one is critiquing your posts like academic essays, unless you are referring to posters pointing out your lack of ability to support your statements. And then, yes, many adults DO do this on a discussion forum. You stated you have been on MN for a long time, yet you seem to not really have a grasp on how it works. But that is unsurprising.

And what questions do you have that have been left unanswered?

Taytoface · 20/08/2024 10:08

I like the hairy fruit farm place about as much as I like my sewer, but can appreciate that both perform a necessary function.

My sewer is dark and dank and smells and I would not want to spend much time there, but ain't nowhere else taking away all the shit.

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