Algerian boxer filing legal claim over online harrassment

Is it a libel action? I thought it was "online harassment".

It's certainly an eye-opening post.

And yes I know it's typical for female boxers to wear a groin guard.

My point here is we are expected to believe ideas that certain cultural taboos are bigger than they are in practice.

JKR has the argument about what the IBA has disclosed. And a public interest defence. She wouldn't need to prove that anyone was male.

Well given fairness in sport is at stake I think it'll be an easy win.

All this 'oh but they sometimes lose' I bet that's true across weight categories too
Sometimes he lighter competitors will win against the heavier - shall we get rid of weight categories too?

One of the photos circulating has been one with the individual concerned wearing a groin guard whilst being hugged by coaches.

At the same time we are being told about cultural taboos about men and women in 'these countries' without reflecting on if those cultural taboos were so big there's no way that a female athlete would be a) wearing a groin guard b) being hugged by 'her' coaches.

Step back and think about this. If that picture is genuine (and it's possible it's not), what does the picture say?

Where is the racism/lack of cultural understanding in this narrative?

What we don't talk about is cultural leanings towards understanding systems and being willing to game the system for gain. That might include propaganda or financial benefits as well as individual gain. Not every country has the same cultural respect for the concept of fairness. They see the rules as the limit not necessarily the spirit of the rules. Some countries have much higher tolerance of corruption too. And this is the space the IOC should be all over and addressing.

I believe that in a UK libel case the defense of truth burden is on the defendant. So JKR would have to show proof that the boxer is male, not the other way round.

But the complaint is in Paris anyway so UK rules are irrelevant. I've no idea how it works there but I do know that in some European countries truth is not an absolute defense. If what you write is true but the motivation served no purpose other than to cause harm, you can still be found guilty of libel.

Having posts removed for calling a male "he" is ridiculous.

So we've got a tiny minority (5-Ards) and then another tiny minority of that set (so severely affected that they don't notice they have a penis when they didn't before) and then another tiny minority (sporting talent).

You missed one - a tiny minority with genitalia on the female end of the scale in the first place. Most are ambiguous rather than "look female"

It's unfair even if an amazing woman does sometimes beat a man, because the men are bringing male advantage into the category which is supposed to exclude it. The male boxers are so much more powerful they don't have to be as skilled as the women they are fighting.

I note your sympathy is only for the men, not the women left bloodied, battered and in Carini's case with a broken nose.

Very telling.

As I said upthread, I don't think 'good legal advice in the best interests of the athlete' is being applied here. Even if they think it's a winnable case. It won't end if the case is won, if the ongoing questions about sex are unresolved.

I don't believe he is a woman, so I'll refer to him as "he".

Thanks for your concern.

This is what you said:

You will note he didn't always win which spoils the argument about women will never have a chance in sport.

If a strawman argument is all you have it's best you go and educate yourself.

'What is the purpose of the IOC?' falls into this point too.

The purpose of the IOC is to talk about and tackle cultural taboos and issues that may be more prevalent in less developed countries which includes medical issues.

You're having a laugh aren't you?

The more sunlight the better. Especially this time, given the amount of misinformation in circulation. And an harassment suit is sunlight.

It keeps it in the news. It pushes the entire subject further towards those who want clarification.

I can't imagine Khelif's advisers' motivation, to be honest. Perhaps they think this will put the issue to bed. Or maybe it's a just slice of normal male entitlement.

One of the strands of support for Khelif has been stop speculating about a 'masculine woman', it's sexist, harassing, etc.

But now, they've practically guaranteed its continuance!

And I don't get this it's not cheating if it's within the rules. Is there some official meaning to the word cheating that means that? Because the dictionary definition can mean it's just unfair.

"Act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage."

I think what people aren't getting is that the masculinisation at puberty for 5-ARD XY indivduals (eg Semanya confirmed, these boxers suspected) isn't confined to their muscle growth.

Most get some penis growth, some get their testicles dropping, most end up identifying as male.

It can be the case that they're not diagnosed until investigation for missed periods if they had very severely underdeveloped genitals at birth, but this isn't CAIS or Swyer - there's a ton going on due to virilisation which would certainly send most people to the doctor.

So we've got a tiny minority (5-Ards) and then another tiny minority of that set (so severely affected that they don't notice they have a penis when they didn't before) and then another tiny minority (sporting talent).

Or we have coaches looking out for this condition and exploiting it in full knowledge of the cause.

I never said men never lose. One of the big issues that is raised is women will never be able to win, well women have won which ruins that argument doesn't it.

I'll leave you all to froth about these two people and their unenviable situation.

Instead of commenting with rubbish, why don’t you read the previous threads regarding this?

Seriously - it is fully explained that the IBA released all the information they are allowed to WITHOUT THE AGREEMENT OF THE boxers in question.

The boxers could release the information whenever they wanted to - but they refuse (and didn’t appeal their ban for having XY chromosomes) because they are fully aware of the truth ie. they are both biologically male.

They haven't faced punches delivered with male strength.

Those losses were earlier in their careers, when they were less skilled than they are now.

If I took testosterone and entered the women's 100m, I would come dead last. I would still be gaining an unfair advantage because of taking a banned performance enhancing substance.

Poor people show honour and decency as well as rich people.

They couldn't be forthcoming because they are bound by issues over privacy. Quite rightly.

They are trying to point out an issue with their hands tied. And then are being criticised for having their hands tied. It's not their fault their hands are tied.

They have been told not to release the tests under Data Protction rules. The athletes have suppressed the information. Wonder why!

This article, posted on another thread, is from a French source, thank you eatfigs for the translation. It is an interview with Georges Cazorla, one of the large team of 'experts' who have brought Khelif to where they are now, a gold medallist after only taking up boxing at the age of 17. It was a huge and well-financed process, using Khelif as raw material to get the gold medal at the Paris Olympics, no expense spared, no holds barred.

Astonishingly, the interviewee more or or less admits that Khelif has 'problematic' chromosomes, which can only mean XY not XX, and although he is a scientist, he relies instead on Khelif's womanly 'feelings' and 'girl's sensitivity.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5138713-thread-4-two-female-boxers-set-to-compete-at-paris-2024-were-previously-disqualified-from-womens-world-championship-for-having-xy-chromosomes?reply=137453779&utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share