Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

The IOC: “ we don’t want a return to the bad old days of sex testing”

167 replies

InterrudelyUpted · 02/08/2024 18:57

I want to give some really important context to this: it was a classic “throwing the baby out with the bathwater “ argument.

Of all the many types of DSDs that affect people born with XY chromosomes, Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome (CAIS) is one of the rare ones that confers no male puberty advantage at all. That’s because no matter how much testosterone may be circulating inside your endocrine system, your body is completely immune to it. People affected by this have zero male advantage, apart from possibly being a bit taller than average. They grow up looking completely female on the outside, with pretty typical female muscles and speed and strength and pelvis width and everything.

But CAIS people were used as an example of whataboutery to show the flaw in a straightforward argument that “all XY people have an advantage because of going through male puberty”.

It’s actually quite simple to separate out CAIS from other people with XY chromosomes, your genetic test comes back showing you have XY chromosomes but then they very quickly establish that you no receptors and therefore no male puberty and no male advantage. And CAIS women tend to be pretty shit at sports anyway due to the aforementioned lack of testosterone. But hey go, that’s where we are.

Can’t do sex testing in sports because it might theoretically offend a small bunch of people with a DSD who actually want to be left completely out of it anyway.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
maltravers · 03/08/2024 20:17

Be happy Coke! We’re letting men batter women in the name of progress!

quantumbutterfly · 03/08/2024 20:00

They may be pushing the DEI buttons to satisfy a marketing demographic. Many companies are.

Floisme · 03/08/2024 19:42

If I were the Coca Cola CEO I'd be getting concerned about my products being associated with this shower.

quantumbutterfly · 03/08/2024 19:26

maltravers · 03/08/2024 19:09

It’s important to have your priorities straight obviously.

Got to keep your corporate sponsors happy in every way...

WickedSerious · 03/08/2024 19:11

StickItInTheFamilyAlbum · 03/08/2024 14:42

Doubtless the IOC expect everyone to understand that asking women's opinion is a social nicety and polite convention. There's no intention of heeding what the majority say and acting on it. (Thinking of all the consultations I've filled out and that CS or govt. decided to set aside.)

ETA:

who probably voted Reform.

All of the women athletes who live outside the UK and have non-UK nationalities managed to vote in the 1990s and vote Reform @ 30 years later?

Truly no end to the perfidy and squeakiness of women.

Edited

There is no level to which we will not stoop.

maltravers · 03/08/2024 19:09

quantumbutterfly · 03/08/2024 19:06

Note the product placement during his speech-making.

It’s important to have your priorities straight obviously.

quantumbutterfly · 03/08/2024 19:06

Note the product placement during his speech-making.

maltravers · 03/08/2024 18:38

The bad old days when we had to keep men out of women’s sport, is that it?

StickItInTheFamilyAlbum · 03/08/2024 14:42

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 14:31

My money is on they are all evil bigots.
By which I mean the women who votes in favour of testing, not the IOC who ignored them.

Edited

Doubtless the IOC expect everyone to understand that asking women's opinion is a social nicety and polite convention. There's no intention of heeding what the majority say and acting on it. (Thinking of all the consultations I've filled out and that CS or govt. decided to set aside.)

ETA:

who probably voted Reform.

All of the women athletes who live outside the UK and have non-UK nationalities managed to vote in the 1990s and vote Reform @ 30 years later?

Truly no end to the perfidy and squeakiness of women.

WickedSerious · 03/08/2024 14:39

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 14:31

My money is on they are all evil bigots.
By which I mean the women who votes in favour of testing, not the IOC who ignored them.

Edited

Transphobic,racist bigots who probably voted Reform.

Snowypeaks · 03/08/2024 14:38

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 14:31

My money is on they are all evil bigots.
By which I mean the women who votes in favour of testing, not the IOC who ignored them.

Edited

😁

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 14:31

RedToothBrush · 03/08/2024 14:00

So the actual athletes taking one voting to keep it by an overwheling majority.

WHY?

Why was it import to them?

My money is on they are all evil bigots.
By which I mean the women who votes in favour of testing, not the IOC who ignored them.

Datun · 03/08/2024 14:31

lonelywater · 03/08/2024 14:10

so, if I have this right, the IOC binned sex tests (of any sort) in 1999 (which incidentally means they have no way of making a determination of the sex of any competitor, beyond a passport). They did this despite 82% of women athletes wanting to keep them. Not remotely suspicious at all. It does increasingly look like the TRA's have been beavering away in the background for decades, which explains why we are in this current mess. If only a proper journalist could overturn some stones I dare say the results could be of interest.

It's astonishing, isn't it!

You can get a letter from your doctor to change your passport.

Absolutely no changes necessary.

I wonder if this will make Starmer think again about how simplifying the acquisition of a GRC might just have future implications.

Datun · 03/08/2024 14:28

WickedSerious · 03/08/2024 13:44

Some of the bilge I saw spouted on another forum this morning left me feeling as if every drop of blood in my body had been passed through a Soda Stream.

Brilliant.

And because it's soo stupid, and soo easily disprovable, I'm sure this is all going to unravel - straight to the point of reality.

Hardly anyone is a TRA, or doesn't understand basic biology, or is ideologically driven.

Proper, grown-up, informed people will prevail.

lonelywater · 03/08/2024 14:10

so, if I have this right, the IOC binned sex tests (of any sort) in 1999 (which incidentally means they have no way of making a determination of the sex of any competitor, beyond a passport). They did this despite 82% of women athletes wanting to keep them. Not remotely suspicious at all. It does increasingly look like the TRA's have been beavering away in the background for decades, which explains why we are in this current mess. If only a proper journalist could overturn some stones I dare say the results could be of interest.

OvaHere · 03/08/2024 14:06

RedToothBrush · 03/08/2024 14:00

So the actual athletes taking one voting to keep it by an overwheling majority.

WHY?

Why was it import to them?

Corruption?
Money?
Backhanders?
Misogyny?
All of the above?

RedToothBrush · 03/08/2024 14:01

StickItInTheFamilyAlbum · 03/08/2024 13:08

Exactly, sex testing is much much less invasive than drug testing- and that is going to continue.

tbf, it's less invasive than being body scanned and patted down when travelling through some airports.

Its less invasive that a covid test...

RedToothBrush · 03/08/2024 14:00

Floisme · 02/08/2024 19:19

I think Sharron Davies probably knows a thing or two about the Olympics and 'the bad old days of sex testing' and here's her view:

'How anyone looks should not be the issue. A simple sex screening test. Took me 2 mins in 1976. Cotton bud wiped on the inside of your cheek. Female athletes voted 82% in favour of keeping it in 1996. The IOC still stopped it so why ask?'

https://x.com/sharrond62/status/1819076377234362602

So the actual athletes taking one voting to keep it by an overwheling majority.

WHY?

Why was it import to them?

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 13:49

WickedSerious · 03/08/2024 13:42

I love it when a thread takes an educational turn.

Happy to help 😁

WickedSerious · 03/08/2024 13:44

Datun · 03/08/2024 12:14

"some want to own the definition of woman'"

Tell me he didn't say this!

(I'm afraid my blood pressure will do for me if I actually watch that clip).

many more statements like this and the frantic un-saying of things, and he's going to bloody hang himself.

Some of the bilge I saw spouted on another forum this morning left me feeling as if every drop of blood in my body had been passed through a Soda Stream.

WickedSerious · 03/08/2024 13:42

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 13:33

What???? you mean people can't change sex? Burn the heretic.

I love it when a thread takes an educational turn.

Runningupthecurtains · 03/08/2024 13:33

Snowypeaks · 03/08/2024 13:16

And sex testing is one and done - for life.

What???? you mean people can't change sex? Burn the heretic.

Snowypeaks · 03/08/2024 13:16

And sex testing is one and done - for life.

StickItInTheFamilyAlbum · 03/08/2024 13:08

Exactly, sex testing is much much less invasive than drug testing- and that is going to continue.

tbf, it's less invasive than being body scanned and patted down when travelling through some airports.

MoveToParis · 03/08/2024 12:53

InterrudelyUpted · 02/08/2024 18:57

I want to give some really important context to this: it was a classic “throwing the baby out with the bathwater “ argument.

Of all the many types of DSDs that affect people born with XY chromosomes, Complete Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome (CAIS) is one of the rare ones that confers no male puberty advantage at all. That’s because no matter how much testosterone may be circulating inside your endocrine system, your body is completely immune to it. People affected by this have zero male advantage, apart from possibly being a bit taller than average. They grow up looking completely female on the outside, with pretty typical female muscles and speed and strength and pelvis width and everything.

But CAIS people were used as an example of whataboutery to show the flaw in a straightforward argument that “all XY people have an advantage because of going through male puberty”.

It’s actually quite simple to separate out CAIS from other people with XY chromosomes, your genetic test comes back showing you have XY chromosomes but then they very quickly establish that you no receptors and therefore no male puberty and no male advantage. And CAIS women tend to be pretty shit at sports anyway due to the aforementioned lack of testosterone. But hey go, that’s where we are.

Can’t do sex testing in sports because it might theoretically offend a small bunch of people with a DSD who actually want to be left completely out of it anyway.

Exactly, sex testing is much much less invasive than drug testing- and that is going to continue.