Is this a safe place to ask a question without being flamed?

That's lovely for you. What do you suggest happens to the women who cannot use a mixed sex space, regardless of how a male person identifies or how lovely he may be?

> *women don't want your male friends in their loos, changing rooms etc.

I did not say women wanted men in there.

I do not want a man in the loos with me unless it is at home. They would seem out of place, and I should wonder why they were not using the gents.

My point is that I would not feel threatened in most situations.

I would not feel threatened, or be bothered by a trans-women, in the loo. I have not knowingly met one in there because I might not even notice.

OP, you need to consider that it's not about you as an individual and your trans friend as an individual.

It's about women and girls as a sex class (and please remember that the only thing we all have in common is our body type - we are not defined by feminity, or oppression, or clothing, or sexuality, or toy preferences); and it's about transwomen as a sub-group of the male sex class, with all the evidence suggesting that their behaviour parallels that of other males. And there you will find your answers.

Not to mention who gets to do, and who gets to be used.

Who gets to take and who has to give.

Who is the active seeker of pleasure and who is just the receptacle and prop.

This.

OP, I'd suggest reading some of the articles by Dennis Noel Kavanagh, the lead of the Gay Men's Network. He discusses the homophobia towards LGB people from the TQ and queer movement clearly and in depth, and his background is a legal one.

It's telling children what's permitted (boys) and required (girls), isn't it?

(edit for typos)

@DrBlackbird thank-you

Agree. Profit and other male gains

That’s grim, it’s reducing women to an orifice to be fucked 🤮 how can that possibly be considered suitable for children

One of the drag queens who will be 'performing' goes by the name of 'Filla Crack'

Quite! The morphing of LGB into 'Queerness' with its emphasis on fetish and highly sexualised display turns many people off.

And I've totally had it with drag. At today's Pride event - the city's main touristic area is being taken over. This is an area of the city visited by people of all demographics, including families. Having drag and sexual display force fed onto visitors is not doing 'the community' any favours.

You put women and girls first OP.

The starting point for any Woman who thinks she's a feminist should be how this impacts the most vulnerable women and girls in society.

So whilst you might consent to males in your spaces you need to think about how you supporting that impacts women in prison, women in refuges, disabled women who need intimate care givers, women in hospital.

It's not about you as you go around your life, it's about the wider picture.

The thing is though they are under threat but it's trans ideology that's the threat. Homosexuals are criticised for their "genital preference" ie being homosexual. Trans women talk of the cotton ceiling (lesbians knickers) like it's oppressive when a lesbian doesn't want to have sex with them. Young gay children are led down the path of transition when really they would have just grown up to be gay.

The forced teaming of LGB with the TQ+ is I think doing damage to acceptance of homosexuality. People feel uncomfortable or grossed out by the overly sexual displays by this ideology and don't see it as gender ideology they see it as LGBTQ+

I've never noticed 'a men'.

Interesting, isn't it?

The thread managed 5 pages of thoughtful, calm and considered posts explaining their responses and reasoning to the OP so I agree no derailing but instead continue the conversation.

@NameChangedForThisDiscussion so sorry for your horrific experience. Sometimes it is just so shit being female.

I am so concerned about the explosion of trans identities in her friendship group. Due to the prevailing wind, I cannot even speak freely with my DC. It is a tightrope walk of not alienating them and pushing them towards 'well meaning' and 'kind' people that are all too ready to help. I think there are far too many people with 'no skin in the game' that mean well, that want to be inclusive, but who are throwing, mainly, young girls under the bus.

Likewise, I walk the same tightrope. Thank god for Isla Bryson who opened my DCs eyes that not all TW are just being their authentic selves. Though unfortunately my DCs are still inclined to hand over women’s sporting accolades to men. It’s the influence of many friends of the DCs who are swept up in this identity tsunami in acritical response of inclusivity. Though I don’t blame them. Boundaries have been gradually pushed for years by men with agendas. One friend went as far as asking their GP for CSHs who apparently expressed bafflement. Shortly after that DC met a nice boy and is completely happy in a heteronormative relationship but what if the GP was a GI advocate as so many seemingly are and had practiced affirmation?

My wish is for this thread to go to every Labour politician ‘ally’ to better understand the issues and experiences and concerns of women as individuals and as mothers.

As others have said. It is not anti/pro trans. It is anti/pro women’s rights.

Consent is a big one as the first response lays out very well - whilst you may have things you are comfortable with or not, other women and especially teen girls like my daughter are stating very clearly they don't want men in their "safe spaces." - which are places where they have a right to be kept physically safe.

Pronouns have become a hotly contested subject - compelled speech is the opposite of free speech and it does have a negative effect on the reporting of accurate crime and health statistics.

I won't be doing a course but I wanted to endorse the recommendation of JCJ. I find her a very clear thinker and explainer.

The sufferers of that colonization include the very young women who for many reasons are uncomfortable with the expectations the colonizers have of them in terms of appearance, presentation, accessibility, and who go over to the dark side themselves, even if they manage to avoid the horrors of mastectomy, toxic hormones etc

Another thing, I'm reluctant to criticise anyone else's grammar and spelling for the obvious reasons (I'm not even happy about those 'ize' spellings the checker advised) but has anyone else noted how frequently the GC posters write 'a women'? It's almost a tell. I've never noticed 'a men'.

Yeah,think of the menz FFS.

OP (and anyone else interested) if you'd like a guided tour round some of the feminism literature supported by small group discussion, you might be interested in the courses that Jane Clare Jones runs, eg

https://feminist-thought.org/course-1-part-1/

I did an earlier version of this one and it was great - lots to read and really thought provoking.

And the intimate association of the LGB with the TQ+ creates an intense sense of family feeling and shared cause...to the extent that people who are same sex attracted now believe, and repeat the idea, that gay rights are "going backwards".

'Pride' happens today in my city, and this is going to be one of the big talking points...how LGBTQ+ rights are under threat and actually going into reverse. I've got a young gay nephew coming today, and who is going along to a book signing at the event. He's 16. This is the environment he is being brought up in and exposed to. One in which he will be led to feel his rights and acceptability are on the line, when actually gay rights are as strong as they've ever been.

So many young people who socialise in or around the 'queer community' now have it drilled into them that they must be 'trans allies'. and for many who happen to be lesbians, in particular, it is just a short push further to imagining that they too are 'trans'. Especially when 'being trans' is so on trend and cool, and being a lesbian just isn't queer enough

There's no such thing as 'trans' - it's just colonisation of women by men for massive profit.

Bingo. And even here, and the one radfem site I'm familiar with, we have to tiptoe around or the site owners will descend on us, delete posts, ban users.

Yep, it's a massive con. And plenty of evidence that it is so, for those who have the intelligence to look (oh, and understand it's about a lot more than "toilets"). I think a lot of people—including teens thank god —are starting to question it, mainly because TRAs keep overstepping the mark. Also the number of pervs being outed (Mr Beast's mate being the latest) is getting frankly embarrassing for the "but these are such vulnerable soft people and definitely not like other men" lobby, given it's quite obviously a (very male, very offender) pattern of behaviour.

There's no such thing as 'trans' - it's just colonisation of women by men for massive profit.