Spouse says men can use Ladies to change baby nappy?

X-post @Bunty2727 .

You are far from wrong in questioning this and I for one hope you will carry on challenging men in this situation!

It really comes to something when we're fighting over whose needs are greater, a female child who is being sexually abused, a disabled person of any age, or a man needing to walk 5 mins to change a nappy. Child protection comes first. Always.

If men, or the leaders of this country, can't find a way to even THINK about not trampling over the rights of the first 2 groups, then I despair! I guess that's years of tory leadership for you. COME ON LABOUR. Sort this shit out.

Gosh, it's such a mystery isn't it?! If we are out in town and see either of these signs and need to change our baby's nappy, I wonder if it should be mine or my husband"s turn to do the honours?

www.burnhamnationwide.com/final-review-blog/illinois-equitable-restrooms-act-baby-changing-table-requirements

Here's an article that might be of interest.

When they're the ones confronting other men about SA and campaigning to keep women's spaces safe, then I could have some empathy for their hurt feelings. However, men who were doing this would have the awareness not be hurt that women are suspicious of them. They would understand and have empathy for women, because we have to live with that threat. Hurt feelings would not be a consideration for them.

I’ve never seen a man changing a nappy in the women’s loos. I’ve never heard a man say “I just nipped into the women’s toilet because there was no baby changing in the men’s”. I’m 51 and thinking I must have been living under a rock.

Because a rapist cares so much about the baby's comfort?
They'd just put the kid on the floor.

I avoid using baby change facilities even though I'm female, my two children have never liked being on the fold down tables for one reason or another and I've simply found other alternatives.

So if this is a huge problem, men need to agitate for better facilities, like women have done.

We also live in a time where most places have disabled / unisex facilities that have baby changes available. Dad needs to know where those are and that's on him, he could easily get that information from a Facebook group. It's called 'planning ahead'.

And what dad wants to go into a woman's changing room? None that I know of.

I would be fucking surprised if my husband ever thought it was appropriate to use the women's toilets for whatever purpose.

My position has always been, I don't want any males, not even my husband in the women's loos.

Places I've changed a nappy:

Back of my car, front of my car.
Corner of several play parks.
Quiet corner of several local parks.
In a pram.
Back of a church hall on a table.

If dippy dad hasn't the nous to come up with another idea, then that's his problem.

And we need more accessible toilets with changing stations. Until then, men are not welcome in women and girls spaces.

As far as I'm concerned the pre-teen's rights upthread trump adults in this case.

@Topofthemountain oh yes.
Different discussion but yes, it’s obvious that disabled people aren’t as important.

Actually I think women are inconvenienced too.

Because if it’s an issue for fathers to change their child, they are going to be less likely to do so. Instead of saying ‘yes of course’ theyll calculating how much more effort it’s going to take them. They’ll avoid taking their chikd with them abd then it’s mothers who loose.

The different, it’s worth to remember, is that women had no choice bit to go out with theur child.
Fathers have a choice. They know that. The regulator knows that too.
It’s unlikely to move quickly or easily if women do t put pressure too. If women just wait for men to do something they aren’t quite keen on and is costing them.
Waiting for men is again very naive

So, my take from this is, "It's not my problem, and I don't really care if disabled people are inconvenienced instead"

I agree women had to fight for these facilities, and men need to as well if they don't want to be limited when they're out and about.

Fine.
Why aren’t all women doing it then if that’s easy and normal? Why did we ask for baby changing facilities in the first place?

Whats annoying me there is that we pushed for those facilities but the ‘why don’t they do X and Y, it’s easy’ attitude is basically saying men are not worth the same consideration (let alone the babies who might not appreciate to be bare bottom outside in the middle of winter/when it’s raining etc….)

I do appreciate that is often the case for wheel chair users/disabled people, but I think a full grown able bodied man might be very able to think take a pushchair/park nearby/go somewhere with a garden to put a mat down incase I get stuck. What's not okay js just assuming women's toilets are the go to just because there's no other option.

Btw What is needed is a campaign from parents (both sex) to ask for neutral, separated baby changing facilities.

Not an attitude that is basically saying ‘I don’t want them there, I’m washing my hands from it. Men have to sort out an answer’ because it’s not helpful for anyone.

You’re assuming that either there are other CLOSE BY places available that will allow changing families not on the ladies or that people will know.

I think you might be in fur a shock around that.

Of course you could do what I do, which is ringing every place before you go hoping someone has a reliable answer.
I often have to do that because I’m a wheelchair user.
And I know answers are often unreliable. Plus it’s taking time and is very frustating.
Im pretty sure the situation will the same, if not worse.

The reality is that no it’s not best practice to have baby changing facilities only on the men’s. It’s also not great when they are in the disabled loo either!
But it’s naive to say that ‘you JUST have to say x or ring y’ because it won’t be the case.

Um, could go something like this:
Man with baby to bar/waiting staff: are there changing facilties here that aren't in the women's toilet? No? Okay I'll just grab xyz to go please/find somewhere else

Man with baby to friends invitation: yeah would be great to meet up. Have got baby with me though - does ABC have changing space that isn't in the women's bogs? Not sure? Let's to go to XYZ as I know they do there

🤷‍♀️

How do you do that?

Ive always seen that facilities say whether there is a baby changing room, not where it is aka in the ladies or not.

Any man in the women's toilets can fuck right off. I would be disgusted by his attitude.

How about men who are out with babies check what facilties are available before they make themselves comfortable?

It's not inevitable but it is a risk. An outcome doesn't need to be inevitable for women and girls to wish to avoid increasing the risk of it.

You can buy toilet brushes with tiny cameras in the handle and other innocuous-looking cameras that don't look out of place in a bathroom. The barrier to entry for livestreaming footage of girls and women on the loo to OnlyFans is a few hundred pounds.