Men in Tajikistan ban women from wearing hijab. Man in US protests.

There are not many women in the video wearing the hijahb so if they as a majority supported the motion it would be surprising

The Hijab unfortunately is used as a tool of male supremacy.
Look at women in Afghanistan.

Corey is a shill for increasing Islamification, and enforcing ‘traditional ’ behaviour on American Muslim women. Hence his statement.

This.

The outrage should come from the women to whom this outrage is done but they don't because they have no support network. I'm not sure how much you know about what a Muslim woman/girl has to endure, they are indoctrinated into believing this is how they serve their men folk and God from birth and it is almost impossible to escape . Child forced marriages to much older men , rape, physical and mental abuse, even death if they rally against this fate , no power, no voice over their lives, no /little education, this is where the outrage should be ! There is no support for them either within or outside their families due to the burden of honour that is laid upon them due to their gender. I was lucky ,I was brought to England, was able to survive despite being ostracized from and feeling ostracized from my birth community and my adopted ( racism) one. In countries which practise Islam the female has no/little control over all aspects of her existence.

@DrNickedMaCorpus sorry I derailed your thread a bit! It’s not just ISIS it’s with religion as a whole. They’ve seen what it can do to politics and stability in a country and they want know part of it. Many of them are very autocratic and the two biggest risks to their stability are external interference (Russia) and religious interference (Islam). Clamping down on hijab’s is an extension of this.

For example; Iran has just mandated that hijabs must be worn on the street whilst Uzbekistan has just relaxed rules on religion (Edit: I say ‘just’ - but it was earlier this year) - and as a result lots of those who once hid their religious affiliation are now asking for more and calling for action against the government and justifying ‘jihad’ and demanding women where the hijab.

Other CA states will be watching this and the likely result will be a further clamp down on religious identities.

Fascinating thread thank you all.

I do that Mongolia is mad about breast feeding. They think it's fantastic.

I'll try to find an inspiring article I read many years ago.

I phrased that badly! Turkish is fine!! Russian is more challenging.

The smaller Central Asia countries have quite a complex attitude towards Russia. They’re EX-SU but the culture/language represents a difficult time in their history. They’ve also seen Russian actions in Ukraine (recent issues escalated this) and in Nagorno-Karabakh as deeply problematic - they view it as interference in domestic issues of those countries. And they’re all very ‘young’ countries so they worry about their own stability - particularly those who are more autocratic (Turkmenistan) - and what Russia might do to undermine that.

There’s also the Afghanistan ‘problem’ where when Russia withdrew lots of Taliban fighters moved through CA towards Russia.

BUT they need Russia for trade and typically for access to the west (which up until recently had no interest in CA). So, they’re ‘pragmatic’ - they recognised they need a relationship with Russia (CSTO, trade etc), but they don’t want to be reminded of their ties hence why it’s better to speak Turkish, if you can! In some of the countries there’s been an active shift to try and stop Russian being the second language.

They won’t hate you if you speak Russian, but it won’t endear you. Much the same way speaking English is France never really helps!

Azerbaijan is incredible - really worth visiting. TBH the whole region is just fascinating - both for the people/culture but also the politics!

@Killingoffmyflowersonebyone "It’s very Soviet Russia in many ways - and unless you speak Turkish or Russian (which I wouldn’t advise you do…) it’s quite hard to get by." Why would you not advise to speak Russian or Turkish, out of interest? Thank you for the insight. My step sister was meant to go and teach English in Azerbaijan many years ago, but met someone and got married so they stayed in the UK. I was disappointed as I loved the idea of going to visit her, no idea why as I knew nothing about Azerbaijan, I think I just wanted to go somewhere unusual!

Very happy to answer any questions! I’d start at Kazakhstan though (or Azerbaijan). The cultures are similar but they're more westernised so it’s a good starting point! Azerbaijan has more of a Turkey feel (but less westernised) and Kazakhstan does lots of business with China.

Even I found Turkmenistan very hard to handle for more than a week (I speak Russian and broken Turkish). It’s very Soviet Russia in many ways - and unless you speak Turkish or Russian (which I wouldn’t advise you do…) it’s quite hard to get by. Whereas in Kazakhstan most understand broken English or Russian. Azerbaijan, most people speak reasonable English IME, Russian or (if you really want to push your luck) Farsi!

The problem with Turkmenistan is the lifestyle is so different (as I’m sure your aware) that actually the language barrier is nightmare unless you’re with a Turkmen OR with a tour group! Kazakhstan has a lot of Europeans in (proportionally) and Americans as does Azerbaijan - so it’s ‘safer’ in a way that Turkmenistan isn’t (if that make sense). you can still get a sense of the culture but without throwing yourself in head first.

I went to Kyrgyzstan twice in the noughties. It was work-related and I was at a remote mine most of the time. I don't remember seeing anyone in hijab and I often saw the younger girls in the villages in short shorts and huggy t-shirts.

IIRC there is a kidnap-to-marry thing in the culture and I don't think that society is equal but I didn't see any evidence of clothing mandates.

I'd love to pick your brains. I'm dying to go. I've heard Turkmenistan isn't great to solo travel right now.

What thread are you reading? Most people were trying to work out the actual basis of the law, and stating that women should wear what they like. Possibly, most people couldn't find Tajikistan on a map.

And no, I think most organised religion, particularly Abrahamic religion, is bad for women's rights. One all-powerful, male god... doesn't sound great.

I’ve been to all the CA5 - Tag, Turk, Krgy, Uz, Katz).

Kazakhstan is definitely the most westernised with more liberal attitudes towards women but they are all pretty ‘liberal’ compared to their neighbours. Most foreigners don’t wear headscarves etc and when you meet people they’re very relaxed. Very similar to Azerbaijan, actually, where many are secular, they drink, don’t wear Islamic clothes etc. Women do tend to not be treated equally but that is more often due to having children and not returning to work. Several of them have female ambassadors to Western countries.

Many of the educated (in the regions educational prospects are limited) find religion - and particularly Islam - to be deeply problematic. In part because of their relative geography to Afghanistan and Iran - both of which have been responsible for terror attacks in these countries (in the name of Islam) - and the attitudes of those governments.

So it’s actually not simply a women’s right issue but a pushback against Islam and the fundamentalists - essentially protecting their own domestic security. Most CA countries are very secular.

I think the hijab is very problematic and I don't believe that a choice to wear it is really a completely free choice in most cases. However, I worry that banning it is only going to result in some women becoming effectively housebound.

Interesting article:

www.euronews.com/2024/06/24/why-did-muslim-majority-tajikistan-ban-the-hijab

I’m surprised I’m not seeing outrage here. There seem to be more excuses for the ban and justification and also prejudices against Islam, rather than outrage that a woman is being prevented from dressing as she chooses.

If woman chooses to wear hijab, why should a man ban her from wearing what she wants? Does the freedom to make this choice not apply to Muslim women?

Selective feminism.

That's fascinating in the context of human history. And so very ironic

Wouldn't it?

I'm fascinated with Central Asia and want to go to Tajikistan (and the rest of the Stans). Mongolia has really interesting gender roles. Women get power and learning and finances because a lot of the men are still herders and physically working outdoors. Also, religion didn't take a good hold. It's a true mixture with Buddhism and animism ahead of all the others but with everyone basically respecting and getting along with each other. The only clothing directive I heard from a Mongolian friend was 'Mongolian women ALL wear hoodies' because they pee outside and there's not bushes or trees!!

As you go west to Kazakhstan and Tajikistan there's more Islam and more religious people in general. That's never great for women.

A form of dress should not be banned , choices , voice and empowering women is the way the go !

Absolutely!!! ,😃

It'd be nice if there was a global ban on men telling women how they should dress, wouldn't it.