Lesbian dating app to use facial recognition to exclude males

Archaeologists will never tell you that a skeleton is 100% anything. Many older statements were based on height assumptions for instance

I’ve spoken to an archaeologist about this as I’ve seen this claim here before. He’s worked for over three decades and skeletons are rather his thing. He says that yes, you can tell whether an adult skeleton is male or female. He says sometimes you get more masculine looking female skeletons or feminine male ones but you can always tell the sex. He says for adolescents it’s not always clear and you can’t tell the sex with children, but for adults he said yes, you can tell the sex from the skeleton.

Well exactly. All these complaints of feminity policing and genital inspections fails to put the responsibility at the right door. That of gender ideologists who have told men, not only that they have a right to females places, but that they are righteous to claim these spaces as their own.

Until gender ideology came along, men did keep out of our spaces.

Lucky you to have both Whoopi Goldberg and Dylan Mulvaney beside you to use the camera on the app to verify.

Even Tinder used verification via camera only, matching their silly poses and making sure your head fit into their oval. Pretty sure this app won't accept photos to verify you are a woman.

Hopefully they also won't allow the original uploaded pic to be deleted once verification is complete so other pics can be uploaded instead (Tinder did) but not sure how much of a problem actual women catfishing other women is 🤷

I don't think facial recognition is something that should be used at all!

Is it not in everyone's interests to feed in a hell of a lot more faces to counteract the problem? I don't understand why this is so hard.

Or to have databases and programs for different ethnicities, which would be more reliable?

Surely the Chinese have a phenomenal one based on their population!

In terms of our own skills, we don't work as well on photos, we work on 3D information- including movement.

The software we use at work is trained on osteobiological data. I don't know what the lesbian dating app software was trained on.

Where did you get these images from. And are you confident that they haven't already been digitally manipulated?

Isn't it just awful that such technology is evennecessary and all because some men won't take no for an answer.

When I mentioned it, it was the fact that the AI is trained on historical beauty standards.
It will also reject more athletic women.
It's trained on what exists and because the media tell us feminine = delicate, dainty white women you see that DM gets a higher 'woman' rating than Whoppi Goldberg for instance or the actress who plays Brienne of Tarth. It's an issue because the data fed into it is racist (and sexist). And you're right that's not on.
For a whole host of reasons we need better representation of all different types of femininity in the media - I like to think that's something everyone on here could agree with?

Bumping this.

A simple, 100% accurate test should be to ask the person what sex they are.

We don't even consider that because we know some men will lie. They believe their needs and wishes are more important than those of the women they want to date.

Furthermore, cross sex identity activism has bastardised our language so much there isn't even a word that everyone agrees includes all female people and excludes all male people.

So people end up getting angry about the fairness of tools we only need in the first place because men cannot be trusted, when it's the latter that we should be really angry about.

Can I ask if you work in a big advertising agency?

No I work in news media, not advertising.

It's not phrenology at all! It's about western standards of femininity being the cultural standard globally and the negative impact that has on some women (look at comments many people make about the Williams sisters for instance).
Archaeologists will never tell you that a skeleton is 100% anything. Many older statements were based on height assumptions for instance.
AI facial recognition is like LLM. Only has good as the data it's based on. And that comes with a huge amount of human based assumptions.
Fortunately, as far as I'm concerned, I couldn't care less in this specific instance as I disagree with most people on this board. However, this will not do what people think. And will exclude plenty of women for no reason other than they don't meet Western standards. The so-called skeleton based issues are also used by 'trans-hunters' who end up attempting to 'out' half of Hollywood as being trans women! It's genuinely ridiculous.

This gave Dylan milvany (two separate pictures used) more % of accuracy than of me. An actual born woman.

So phrenology was a 'science' that racist white men used in centuries past. They believed that Black folks had fundamentally different skull shapes and that Black Women were more masculine and not as feminine as white women.

This vile ideology was used to justify the rape and abuse of Black Women during slavery and also to justify racial laws and discrimination. Basically, it was this idea that Black folks were less 'evolved' than white people and that their skulls could prove it.

It's unbelievable bollocks of course that has been disproved many many times. But as a Person of Colour, when I see comments alluding to the idea that AI might have difficulty 'recognising' Black people's faces, for me there's an underlying idea beneath it that Black people's bone structures mark them out as fundamentally different and less 'evolved' than Causacsians.

It's disgusting.

now I appreciate that you might not be aware of all that history, but those are the racist assumptions that lie beneath chat about Black people's faces, skulls, facial features etc. You probably didn't even realise that there was a racist idea beneath it and I am NOT calling you racist lol! Just thought it was something you might find useful to be aware of in future, especially if you work in media, which definitely needs more Black representation, especially in adverts.

Can I ask if you work in a big advertising agency?

I vaguely remember hearing this was an issue in the earliest version of Sall Grover's app but was subsequently ironed out. Ultimately comes down to the AI being fed a disproportionate number of white faces I assume, just as AI in general suffers from being exposed to too little/biased source material about women and thus in turn resulting in algorithmic bias.

With the B2C ones, or commercially available B2B ones that you may use in your work, I appreciate they may not be as accurate, but remember Moore's Law - they're getting better as we speak. I think your concerns about race are a bit overblown tbh, and kind of...phrenology coded? That makes me a bit uncomfortable. But I appreciate it's coming from a good place

I can accept that they’ll get better really fast. I don’t totally understand the phrenology coded criticism sorry!

I think they're really good! Scarily so...

With the B2C ones, or commercially available B2B ones that you may use in your work, I appreciate they may not be as accurate, but remember Moore's Law - they're getting better as we speak. I think your concerns about race are a bit overblown tbh, and kind of...phrenology coded? That makes me a bit uncomfortable. But I appreciate it's coming from a good place.

With something like the dating app, I think a user could use the software to support any suspicions they may have. So if you're a lesbian and only want women, and you get matched with a person who you think might actually be a man pretending to be a woman, then you can use the software to increase or decrease the likelihood of your suspicions being true.

I mean, humans already have a pretty decent facial recognition software built into our brains - we've been visually distinguishing males from females for longer than we've been walking fully upright! So I guess it would be able establishing a probably that the woman you're talking to is actually a fake, and then you can swipe left and move on to the next profile.

Quite. The fact that women have to go to these lengths is insane.

Fair enough - I remain very unconvinced by these softwares especially as regards race.

The Dylan picture was a newspaper shot from an agency I know doesn’t manipulate pictures. I work closely with them.

I'm a civil servant and can't name the product, sorry.

What’s the best software on the market? I’m genuinely interested- I work in media and we’re looking at a number of AI things and I’ve found they all perform much worse than the providers claim.

I'm personally less bothered about commercially (ie B2C) available FRS as it's still fairly basic and not as good as the products used by big organisations, border forces, government offices etc. Because with someone like Dylan Mulvaney, if you're using a picture that he's posted online or from a magazine, the chances are he or the photo editors have trimmed his face to make it look more feminine - in fact they may even have used AI software to re-jig his face to female skull proportions (yes, that product does exist!).

So, assuming the lesbian dating app is using B2C basic software, it won't be 100% accurate but users of the app can use it to support their other perceptions that will tell them whether they're looking at the profile of a lesbian or a dude trying to get sex by deception.

The best software on the market is many factors better than what's available B2C and doesn't miss, ime.

Just tried some out - Whoopi Goldberg came out as woman but with 86% confidence.

Dylan Mulvaney got woman as 98% confidence.

So it’s pretty useless.

https://www.nyckel.com/pretrained-classifiers/gender-detector/

This is the AI the app uses if you want to play around with it. I got 98% woman.