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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Body language in this interview

33 replies

Seriestwo · 07/06/2024 08:12

this GB news interview between Joanna and Camilla was unsettling but I didn’t know why.

This Twitter poster commented on Joanna’s darting eyes.

Does anyone know what that eye movement might suggest in body language terms? Google says stress, trying to escape or lying.

Is it possible it’s something else? I have an autistic niece and she looks out the corner of her eye, so her eyes can flick, but not quite like this.

Anyone got insight into body language?

Tv interview

x.com

https://x.com/theonlyguru/status/1797907810552033688?s=46

OP posts:
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SinnerBoy · 10/06/2024 11:43

I think he was revelling in his silly arguments, knowing fine well that they made no sense, but thinking he'd got one over on her. He was definitely trying to dominate and not discuss, with his ridiculous claims that nobody knew if Camilla's a woman or not.

If I was blind, I'd hear a man, if I was deaf, I'd still see a man, for that's what was in front of us.

Camilla had several facial tics, indicating - "Fuck's sake, have you heard yourself? Nobody believes you, you fool. I'm sure even you don't believe you!" She seemed to be exasperated, with the feeling that she was dealing with an overgrown toddler.

ChateauMargaux · 10/06/2024 11:34

@Seriestwo thank you... I can understand you questioning yourself... I often think that those who question their own thinking, repeatedly, and read, inform themselves and still hesitate to pronounce themselves 100% right are much more right than those that are 100% sure of themselves and their opinions. It is good to go back and reassess your opinions, the positions you take, your belief, rather than blindly going forward in the full belief that you are 100% right - because no one is 100% right on anything, ever!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 10/06/2024 11:14

Exactly.

Chersfrozenface · 10/06/2024 10:55

Well, if a man says he is a woman, then obviously he is lying, because changing sex simply isn't possible.

So there is that.

Thelnebriati · 10/06/2024 10:46

Body language is a tool and like any other tool it can be misused. This interview is not a police interview and posters here are not trained interrogators.

There are no reliable indicators for lying. If you've been told that, you have been lied to.
When peoples eyes move to the right it might be because they don't have any memories to draw on. Thats not proof they are lying. It might even indicate deception and still not be lying; it has to be read within the context of the situation.

Seriestwo · 10/06/2024 09:49

The Gift of Far is by Gavin du Becker. It’s quite an old book now, about “trust your gut”, that people who miss or ignore social cues can become victims. He is looking at big crimes like celebrity stalking or kidnapping - but there are parallels with just wandering around the world while being female.

thanks for all the insights, you made me realise there is something about Joanna that makes my gut talk to me. I posted because I think that my brain warns me, like my kids do, that maybe I am becoming transphobic.

I am so angry about the loss of women’s rights and being repeatedly told that my views are old fashioned that I worry that I am starting to resent all trans people. I’ve been thinking about it and sure that I’m not, it is that there is something unsettling about the way this particular person behaves in the interviews I’ve seen which is similar to the way a similar person behaves in my professional life.

it might simply be the gap between me seeing someone who is male and them insisting that they are like me.

I find it unnerving when people like Joanna say that they pass, that no one has ever had a problem with them in our spaces etc, I don’t think I’m alone in thinking “yes, mate, we leave and don’t say anything to you because we see threat”

whatever it is, it makes something go on in my gut.

OP posts:
ChateauMargaux · 10/06/2024 08:36

@Seriestwo I would love to hear more about the book your mentioned - the gift of fear - would you like to share?

RebelliousCow · 10/06/2024 08:18

Postsynapticdensity · 10/06/2024 07:55

I also think that his eyes are constantly checking two different areas of the screen, his image and Camilla’s, like many of us do when we go on zoom.

it is true that we all tend to look down on the left to access memories (check it out on yourself), but looking to the right does not mean you are lying.

There is no single gesture that universally shows one is not telling the truth, like scratching your nose or averting a gaze. These gestures could be normal to you, your baseline. When we lie we often feel stressed about it because our brains are working twice as hard and we don’t want to get caught, obviously. So what indicates lying is those stress signals and a deviation of your baseline, doing things you don’t normally do. Increased blinking can be caused by this stress or by the brain kind of whirring like a machine while we work extra hard to tell a lie. Body movements like a caged animal (rocking side to side on your legs), staring at the interviewer, talking about “what happened” instead of what you did (distancing) etc can all be signs of guilt or lying, but they need to be read in a cluster and deviations of the persons baseline.

Joana here is just checking himself on the screen and smirking because in my opinion, he’s highly amused by Camilla’s outrage.

Edited

I'd say looking to the right suggest uncertainty and guardedness over either what you are saying, or what you are hearing.

I don't think the interviewer seemed outraged - she just couldn't believe his utter cheek or nerve. He's clearly a man. Does he really think we are so stupid as to pretend not to notice?

Postsynapticdensity · 10/06/2024 07:55

I also think that his eyes are constantly checking two different areas of the screen, his image and Camilla’s, like many of us do when we go on zoom.

it is true that we all tend to look down on the left to access memories (check it out on yourself), but looking to the right does not mean you are lying.

There is no single gesture that universally shows one is not telling the truth, like scratching your nose or averting a gaze. These gestures could be normal to you, your baseline. When we lie we often feel stressed about it because our brains are working twice as hard and we don’t want to get caught, obviously. So what indicates lying is those stress signals and a deviation of your baseline, doing things you don’t normally do. Increased blinking can be caused by this stress or by the brain kind of whirring like a machine while we work extra hard to tell a lie. Body movements like a caged animal (rocking side to side on your legs), staring at the interviewer, talking about “what happened” instead of what you did (distancing) etc can all be signs of guilt or lying, but they need to be read in a cluster and deviations of the persons baseline.

Joana here is just checking himself on the screen and smirking because in my opinion, he’s highly amused by Camilla’s outrage.

RebelliousCow · 09/06/2024 13:59

DrBlackbird · 08/06/2024 13:12

Surely he’s just reading an auto script set up on his computer?

The questions that were posed weren't predictable, though, they were spontaneous. It was a live interview.....so he cannot have been reading from a script. You could see how he was conflicted with every question.....between what is the 'corerect response' and what he secretly knows to be true - hence the continual left -right shifting eyes.

You can experiment wih this using your own automatic body language in response to certain types of mental cue. For example - imagine a past event in your life; you will find you eyes move to the left ( and downwards too - if a sad memory), you eyes may go to the left and slightly upwards if you are actively trying to recall something.....

If you are puposefully lying or trying to hide the truth/full truth of a situation you will not look to the left - but downwards to the right.

We all unconsciously pick up on body language, but you can train yourself to become more conscious of it. We all know when we just don't trust someone but cannot explain why; or that someone gives us the creeps.....

RebelliousCow · 09/06/2024 13:49

Manxexile · 08/06/2024 14:59

Does body language/facial expression analysis etc have any scientific foundation or evidence base at all?

Yes, or else it wouldn't be used by police experts, and similar. There is a long history of 'Body Language' studies. Very interesting.

Manxexile · 08/06/2024 14:59

Does body language/facial expression analysis etc have any scientific foundation or evidence base at all?

testing987654321 · 08/06/2024 13:50

CleftChin · 08/06/2024 12:06

He's not used to looking at a camera - he's on an ipad or a laptop and keeps looking at himself and her on the screen, rather than just looking straight at the camera as she does.

You see it all the time in zoom (or whatever) meetings

Yeah, he just looks like he's scanning the screen repeatedly, probably looking at her then himself.

GailBlancheViola · 08/06/2024 13:24

And yet again no doubt of the sex of Joanne, no need to prove it it's blatantly obvious.

DrBlackbird · 08/06/2024 13:12

Surely he’s just reading an auto script set up on his computer?

NonCrimeHakeIncident · 08/06/2024 12:09

Joanna definitely looks like they’re smirking a lot.

That was an interesting watch, thanks for sharing @RedToothBrush

CleftChin · 08/06/2024 12:06

He's not used to looking at a camera - he's on an ipad or a laptop and keeps looking at himself and her on the screen, rather than just looking straight at the camera as she does.

You see it all the time in zoom (or whatever) meetings

Thelnebriati · 08/06/2024 12:03

He is using home equipment such as a lap top, and may be reacting to whatever he is looking at. He's also using home lighting and a home camera.
TV studios have make up and lighting professionals, so they don't make the presenters look like ghouls or mass murderers.

RebelliousCow · 08/06/2024 12:01

Thelnebriati · 08/06/2024 11:57

This is a technique you can use to demonstrate that the women in porn are not actually enjoying the sex; take a piece of paper and hold it over his eyes when he speaks and then replay the vid while covering his mouth, you'll see an apparent disconnect between his facial expression and his eyes. The shape of his cheeks makes it look like he is smiling, but his eyes have little expression or warmth.

Yes, he's a total creep...... and is a good example of why women don't want men with fetishes in their private spaces, no matter how "harmless" they think they are.

RebelliousCow · 08/06/2024 11:58

Looking to the left:
Glancing to the left suggests that you are remembering facts or having visual thoughts. This is often a good way to check whether someone is telling you the truth. It can also mean that someone is having a conversation with themself internally or is rehearsing their next line.

Looking to the right:
Typically, looking to the right signifies lying. This is because we tend to look to the right when we are imagining things, but towards the left when we are remembering. However, it is also thought that looking to the right and downwards suggests self-doubt, while looking to the right and up indicates that a person is telling untruths.

Looking up:
Glancing upwards often suggests that a person is bored. It may mean that they are looking at their surroundings to find something that stimulates them more than the conversation they are currently having.

Looking down:
If a person looks down when speaking to someone they view as more powerful, it could be a sign of submission or shyness. It can also indicate that they are nervous or hesitant about taking part in the conversation and are avoiding eye contact because of it.

His Left to Right eye movement suggests he's trying to remember the correct script ( to the Left) in response to the fact he knows he's not being truthful ( to the Right)

Thelnebriati · 08/06/2024 11:57

This is a technique you can use to demonstrate that the women in porn are not actually enjoying the sex; take a piece of paper and hold it over his eyes when he speaks and then replay the vid while covering his mouth, you'll see an apparent disconnect between his facial expression and his eyes. The shape of his cheeks makes it look like he is smiling, but his eyes have little expression or warmth.

RebelliousCow · 08/06/2024 11:55

"If someone 's eyes keep moving when talking to you , it could indicate that they are feeling nervous , distracted , or unsure about what they are saying . It could also mean that they are not fully engaged in the conversation or are trying to hide something"

Yes, an avoidance tactic or way of defending the self. He knows full well why he is not a woman and that sex is a biological category. Total dishonesty.

Loopytiles · 08/06/2024 11:45

It looks like the person is reading pre-prepared lines aloud. Have seen similar at work with people giving presentations on videoalls

Seriestwo · 08/06/2024 11:41

Cazpar · 07/06/2024 13:08

Have you ever been on a video call OP? It's very difficult if your webcam is not directly above the screen where everyone else is. The instinct is to look at everyone else's faces but if you do that then you look odd on camera. You need to look into the camera.

In my experience this results in much flicking back and forth.

Why on earth you'd try to ascribe some sort of lying sinister personality to it I've no idea.

I never said sinister. I said it’s odd. That’s not eyes scanning text, they are flicking. Nystagmus’s is an oscillation, that’s not what it is either.

this person is getting more air time and there is something unusual about the non verbal communication that has me confused.

youve got me thinking though, maybe I need to re-read “the gift of fear” to work out why I’m so unsettled by this persons interviews that I asked MN about it.

OP posts:
Wehadabetamax · 07/06/2024 21:11

terryleather · 07/06/2024 13:41

I think there's a medical condition that causes your eyes to move constantly from side to side and it's not something that a person can control.

I was going to say this. It reminds me of someone I know with nystagmus. I'm not saying that it is, but it is a possibility.

Nystagmus | What is Nystagmus? | Causes & Symptoms | Fight for Sight

Nystagmus is an eye condition that causes constant involuntary eye movement, typically from side to side and it can affect both eyes. Find out more today with Fight for Sight.

https://www.fightforsight.org.uk/about-the-eye/a-z-eye-conditions/nystagmus/?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw34qzBhBmEiwAOUQcFzn53DwPQk_lobzLBLWcx9VyNSHAls9QNp1ZeoUVq4cUTei_lfQ6MRoCGAgQAvD_BwE

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