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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Finally! Keeping children safe in education has been updated!

89 replies

WarriorN · 25/05/2024 12:04

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6650a1967b792ffff71a83e8/Keepingchildrennsafeinneducation_2024.pdf

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MrsOvertonsWindow · 23/06/2024 10:17

WarriorN · 23/06/2024 10:13

She's not saying she's chucking it all out. She wouldn't commit to details

I'll bet she won't. It will be interesting to see what Labour propose as the current draft lays outs some basic principles very clearly that will be difficult to overturn.

WarriorN · 23/06/2024 10:13

She's not saying she's chucking it all out. She wouldn't commit to details

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WarriorN · 23/06/2024 10:12

I've just watched; she's commenting on the draft guidance for gender questioning children

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WarriorN · 23/06/2024 10:03

Aspects of keeping children safe in education?

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MrsOvertonsWindow · 23/06/2024 10:02

mrshoho · 23/06/2024 09:48

Bridget Phillipson on bbc with Laura K this morning admitting aspects of this guidance will be reviewed. There we have it. Fuck u Labour.

Wonder what that means? They'll continue to give trans lobby groups unrestricted access to schools to carry on gaslighting children that they've been born in the wrong body but a sex change will cure them?
Or they've read and understood Cass and will continue to restore safeguarding and remove Stonewall's sticky tentacles from schools?

mrshoho · 23/06/2024 09:48

Bridget Phillipson on bbc with Laura K this morning admitting aspects of this guidance will be reviewed. There we have it. Fuck u Labour.

BoostBar · 14/06/2024 13:22

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 14:15

Trans children are no longer mentioned, they are referred to as "gender questioning" children.

T has been removed from the initial sentence, saying that being lesbian, gay or bisexual is not in itself an inherent riak factor for harm (T was added at the lobbying of Nancy Kelly of Stonewall).

The second paragraph states that Cass has identified that caution is necessary with children questioning their gender, as there remain many unknowns about the impact of social transition, and that children may have wider vulnerabilities, including complex mental health and psychosocial needs, and in some cases additional diagnosis of ASD and/or ADHD.

Then recommends that families should be encouraged to seek clinical help and advice.

4th paragraph, schools need to take a cautions approach, consider the broad range of individual needs and do this in partnership with the parents of the child.

5th paragraph, is the same as before, stating that there needs to be open communication.

Thank you so much! Really appreciate your time here. 🙏

TicklishLemur · 13/06/2024 19:57

MrsOvertonsWindow · 13/06/2024 19:45

I share that anguish. But I am cautiously optimistic that no matter how deeply the dodgy adults are embedded in the LP, the emerging data demonstrates appalling outcomes for so many children and young people. The sense of self preservation is strong in many politicians and as it becomes apparent that they chose the wrong side of history in promoting sterilisation and bodily harm in young people, there will be a change of direction.
I hope.

Me too. I hope my grandkids will look back on this in the future and it will be a thing of the past seen akin to lobotomy. Fingers crossed very very few children will be granted use for the purposes of the research and once early results come out it is all halted and they are given the compassion care they deserve.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 13/06/2024 19:45

TicklishLemur · 13/06/2024 19:15

Yes I was a little disappointed with the cass review as I feel it didn’t go far enough. It still supports puberty blockers as part of a clinical trial for certain groups of children. However, on balance I appreciate that they had to be practical considering where we were starting from and it will protect a lot of children.

Once the research has been done and proves the dire consequences the government will be well placed to ban their use completely for gender questioning children. I just feel anguished for the children who will be sacrificed for research purposes. Especially as they are likely to be the most vulnerable - early onset gender distress (suggestive of sexual abuse or other severe forms of trauma) and affirming parents incapable or unwilling to do the right things to address their child’s mental illness.

I share that anguish. But I am cautiously optimistic that no matter how deeply the dodgy adults are embedded in the LP, the emerging data demonstrates appalling outcomes for so many children and young people. The sense of self preservation is strong in many politicians and as it becomes apparent that they chose the wrong side of history in promoting sterilisation and bodily harm in young people, there will be a change of direction.
I hope.

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 19:43

Ah yes, I see what you mean.

I was only saying that I think KCISE will stay as written.

WarriorN · 13/06/2024 19:31

I really cannot see how Labour could make part of KCISE statutory, and other parts not.

@WeMeetInFairIthilien only kcsie is going to be statutory at the moment in September.

Everything else - the gender questioning children guidance particularly, isn't in place yet and nor will it be statutory (though schools would have to follow it given it's in kcsie.)

For example, it still doesn't state in kcsie that single sex toilets are part of safeguarding. It's the law yes, but they've not emphasised the safeguarding aspect.

Labour could easily forget the rest. I was shocked how much basically disappeared within education over night when the tories got in.

Kcsie is statutory so they'd have to legally challenge/ change it I believe.

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TicklishLemur · 13/06/2024 19:15

WarriorN · 26/05/2024 08:42

It would be hard to remove what has been written as it's evidenced based and referred to the Cass review.

However, it doesn't mention the law regarding toilets - safety for girls and also what should be done with a gender questioning child re toilets. The proposed guidelines did but who knows if they'll go through now

It is however safeguarding children who are gender questioning by not treating it as a given and recognising that there can be driving factors

It involves parents which is good. However some parents are vehemently for transition.

And Cass doesn't fully rule out transition.
It's better than it was but still some way to go.

Yes I was a little disappointed with the cass review as I feel it didn’t go far enough. It still supports puberty blockers as part of a clinical trial for certain groups of children. However, on balance I appreciate that they had to be practical considering where we were starting from and it will protect a lot of children.

Once the research has been done and proves the dire consequences the government will be well placed to ban their use completely for gender questioning children. I just feel anguished for the children who will be sacrificed for research purposes. Especially as they are likely to be the most vulnerable - early onset gender distress (suggestive of sexual abuse or other severe forms of trauma) and affirming parents incapable or unwilling to do the right things to address their child’s mental illness.

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 19:05

I really cannot see how Labour could make part of KCISE statutory, and other parts not.

The whole point, is that it is all statutory.

Likewise, I would be super surprised if the changes were scrapped for September. Education is a behemoth, it takes forever to turn.

My MAT has already had a focus session with the school leaders, on what they need to include in the September inset programme, and how they are going to train us in it all.

10,000 staff received this today, that's a hell of a double back, if it is changed.

I may well be wrong, but I can't see how this can be turned around - the Labour manifesto stated that they will work to implement the Cass recommendations (OWTTA)

MsGoodenough · 13/06/2024 19:02

Consultation linked by sex matters on X.

Finally! Keeping children safe in education has been updated!
MsGoodenough · 13/06/2024 19:01

There is a consultation on it which closes on the 20th I think. We need to all reply as the TRSs will be! I imagine Labour will reverse it all for 2025...

WarriorN · 13/06/2024 16:45

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 11:25

It will be statutory from Sept 2024

There is the expected bit at the top, that this "is under review, pending the outcome of the gender questioning children guidance consultation, and the final gender questioning guidance documents being published."

There is also a table which highlights where all of the updates are found, including this one

What is a concern is what happens if Labour get in?

Which parts will be statutory and which may not make it?

Cass is ensconced now and the T is separated in kcsie. This is good.

But the proposed guidance published a while ago isn't yet 'safe' - it could be shelved.

However, Cass has influenced nhs and as is now in kcsie this is significant.

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WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 14:16

Hope that helps, I can only apologise again for the poor photo, I couldn't get it to upload any other way

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 14:15

Trans children are no longer mentioned, they are referred to as "gender questioning" children.

T has been removed from the initial sentence, saying that being lesbian, gay or bisexual is not in itself an inherent riak factor for harm (T was added at the lobbying of Nancy Kelly of Stonewall).

The second paragraph states that Cass has identified that caution is necessary with children questioning their gender, as there remain many unknowns about the impact of social transition, and that children may have wider vulnerabilities, including complex mental health and psychosocial needs, and in some cases additional diagnosis of ASD and/or ADHD.

Then recommends that families should be encouraged to seek clinical help and advice.

4th paragraph, schools need to take a cautions approach, consider the broad range of individual needs and do this in partnership with the parents of the child.

5th paragraph, is the same as before, stating that there needs to be open communication.

BoostBar · 13/06/2024 12:16

Can anyone summarise the changes re: Gender questioning in KCSIE for a thicko? I need to spell it out very clearly to my child’s school, TIA!

TeamPolin · 13/06/2024 12:08

As the parent of a gender questioning ASD child, I welcome this with open arms. Caution should absolutely be the watchword here....

BeelzebubsGargoyle · 13/06/2024 12:01

Ah, right, thanks. I was squinting at it on my phone!

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 11:25

It will be statutory from Sept 2024

There is the expected bit at the top, that this "is under review, pending the outcome of the gender questioning children guidance consultation, and the final gender questioning guidance documents being published."

There is also a table which highlights where all of the updates are found, including this one

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 11:18

Sorry about the image quality, I have to take a screenshot of a photograph of a screen (image size issues)

This is the new KCSIE, for training and active from Sept 2024

It is listed as "KCISE 2024 - Pending publication of final version"

Over 10,000 staff have received this, having been told that this is what our safeguarding policies will be based on, come September.

BeelzebubsGargoyle · 13/06/2024 11:14

Is that the outdated provisional guidelines that have since been made statutory?

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 13/06/2024 11:12

This has just been sent round to every single member of my very large Multi Academy Trust...

Finally! Keeping children safe in education has been updated!
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