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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What is your definition of TRA?

110 replies

Betweenthe2 · 21/05/2024 16:37

Just curious, I am have always read this as someone who is an activist for trans right, but I feel like it is sometimes used on here for anyone who isn't fully GC. What do you mean when you say it?

OP posts:
Helleofabore · 23/05/2024 06:41

Well, if it helps OP, Tickle asked the same thing on Twitter to Jane Clare Jones.

aa below

“Hi JaneClareJones, I know this might sound a bit weird but work with me pls. How do you define TRAs? I know what the acronym is but many people seem to be using it to conjure up a non-flattering identical image every time it is used in every situation. It perplexes me.”

The best answer referred Tickle to look in the mirror (as someone who as sued and significantly harmed a woman’s business who had stated the business was for female people only and this male person has dragged her through court as punishment. Look up Tickle vs giggle).

https://x.com/theroxyepoch/status/1793148203111747705?s=46&t=HTxp6zC_d4GZ2FFv4a-YeQ

What does OP think. Is Tickle a TRA?

x.com

https://x.com/theroxyepoch/status/1793148203111747705?s=46&t=HTxp6zC_d4GZ2FFv4a-YeQ

SapphosRock · 22/05/2024 21:58

People who believe female only spaces should include people born male.

They believe the male's right to identify into that space trump's every woman's right to keep it single sex.

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 20:36

anyolddinosaur · 22/05/2024 17:20

We get people commenting on these threads who are not gender realist, they are looking for something to say on twitter. Assuming every poster is genuine is naïve.

What do you mean by "someone who is not fully GC" though? Do you mean the people who havent really thought about it or the true believers? Those who are not actively promoting the ideology are, by definition, not activists.

I'm definitely not on twitter, I hate it!

I would say that not fully GC could be someone who hasn't fully thought about the issue, or someone who has thought about it and come to some different conclusions than the prevailing narrative on here.

Those who are not actively promoting the ideology are, by definition, not activists.

I agree with this. However TRA is used as insult here, along with "incapable of critical thought".

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RedToothBrush · 22/05/2024 17:53

EmpressaurusOfCats · 21/05/2024 16:59

TRAs are homophobic & misogynist people who put men’s preferences above women’s rights.

This.

If you campaign for trans 'inclusion' but can't see the issues of homophobia and sexism AND ACKNOWLEDGE present in GI during discussion then you ARE a trans right activist.

YouJustDoYou · 22/05/2024 17:28

Facists and bigots who shout down and vilify/name call anyone who thinks women and girls should have sex-based protection rights. Masked, aggressive people who aggressively shout down and call peaceful protestors vile slur words. People who will not debate. Their way or the high way. People who believe that lesbians are transphobic for refusing penis of the trans-identifying variety. People who think women need to shut up and know their place and accept what they are told they need to accept. People who think PTSD-suffering rape victims are vile transphobes when they don't want to be forced to describe their rape trauma in the presence of a male.

anyolddinosaur · 22/05/2024 17:20

We get people commenting on these threads who are not gender realist, they are looking for something to say on twitter. Assuming every poster is genuine is naïve.

What do you mean by "someone who is not fully GC" though? Do you mean the people who havent really thought about it or the true believers? Those who are not actively promoting the ideology are, by definition, not activists.

TheClogLady · 22/05/2024 17:20

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 15:44

I would have thought that labelling women who disagree with you as handmaidens is pretty mysogynist ...

It’s not disagreeing that makes the handmaiden label applicable, it’s dick-pandering at the expense of other women and girls.

Dumbo12 · 22/05/2024 17:08

What rights do trans people want, that they don't already have?

RebelliousCow · 22/05/2024 17:08

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 15:34

I have always taken it to mean someone who is an activist for trans rights.

So this would be someone who perhaps lobbies in that area, or has a social media account dedicated to it, or who runs an organization to do with it etc.

An actvist could be seen as anyone who actively pushes a certain ideology.

Circumferences · 22/05/2024 16:47

What's a a TRA?

A trans rights activist.

Yknow, those fellas in black balaclavas that shout at women for attending meetings.
Those dudes at pride who scream at lesbians.
Those online keyboard warriors who send death and rape threats to women.

You know who they are, we know who they are.

Why the disingenuousness?

Emmelina · 22/05/2024 16:37

I always saw it as "Trans Radical Activists", the more extreme end that sees every question as a slur and goes out of their way to tell everyone how your view is wrong (doxxing and the like).

i know many trans rights activists and they are much more reasonable!

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 16:11

try and pretend that JKR is Voldemort now.

This made me chuckle

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DeeBeeCee · 22/05/2024 15:45

I would class it as those supporting trans rights over women’s rights whether overtly or not. For example pronouns in social media bio, following ‘celebrity’ TRA cheerleaders, Dylan Mulvaney etc on Insta. Liking events that prominently display the TRA flag etc.

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 15:44

misscockerspaniel · 22/05/2024 15:42

A misogynist / handmaiden, a zealot for the cause, who lacks or fails to apply the skills necessary for critical thinking. Simple.

I would have thought that labelling women who disagree with you as handmaidens is pretty mysogynist ...

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misscockerspaniel · 22/05/2024 15:42

A misogynist / handmaiden, a zealot for the cause, who lacks or fails to apply the skills necessary for critical thinking. Simple.

WandsOut · 22/05/2024 15:41

Cattenberg · 21/05/2024 17:27

I agree that they’re activists. Some people think we use “TRA” synonymously with “trans” but that’s not the case at all. Many TRAs aren’t trans and many trans people aren’t TRAs.

This.

Not all Trans people are TRAs
Blair White for example, Miranda Tardley, Rose of Dawn, all transsexual, all get targeted by TRAs for calling out shitty and threatening behaviour.

Most people who just casually support people's rights to dress how they choose and love who they love aren't TRAs - unless they are donning balaclavas and screaming in women's faces or pouring urine on themselves. Threatening to rape JKR etc.

TRAs are the unhinged biology deniers who threaten, accuse, set up witch hunts. But if also include Daniel Radcliffe and Emma Watson in as the "acceptable faces" of the TRA movement as they actively promote the religion of trans kids and try and pretend that JKR is Voldemort now.

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 15:34

Helleofabore · 22/05/2024 15:23

What do you believe the term to mean OP?

I have always taken it to mean someone who is an activist for trans rights.

So this would be someone who perhaps lobbies in that area, or has a social media account dedicated to it, or who runs an organization to do with it etc.

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Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 15:32

RebelliousCow · 22/05/2024 14:25

I'm not sure what you are angling for here?

Personally I wouldn't go out of my way to use pronouns as a " courtesy" at all. For me, such terms of reference are something that are negotiated between two people in an existing relationship - not something that should be expected or enforced. Courtesy goes two ways.

I am not angling for anything. I was just asking a question about what the poster said.

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Helleofabore · 22/05/2024 15:23

What do you believe the term to mean OP?

Helleofabore · 22/05/2024 15:11

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 14:00

A post 2 posts above you says

anyone who believes in gender identity

That supports @Bringbackthebeaver@Bringbackthebeaver post.

The post you refer to is also rather accurate. Because people who believe there are ‘trans children’ for instance usually tends to be someone who is fully supportive of gender identity. Rather than merely believing that people who have declared a gender identity should have the right to believe in their identity, but not the right to insist that everyone else believes or even treats them as the sex they want to be.

And seriously, anyone at this stage wholly supporting all the work that Mermaids and stonewall do without question or reservation at this time is probably ideological in their support or have missed the many reports of the over reach and the issues within those charities.

There are plenty of people who don’t fit the feminist view point but who also don’t fit the extreme trans activist view point but will use pronouns and will do other things without believing that those activists are right to push to subordinate sex and to prioritise gender where sex actually matters.

There are also plenty of people who don’t post to shame feminists who don’t agree that people get to demand compliance to treat others as they demand to be treated, but still choose to use pronouns etc for their own motivations. It is not either / or as the poster indicated.

illinivich · 22/05/2024 14:50

Depending on the situation, trying to enforce or minimises the damange of preferred pronouns can be TRA.

The media could argue that referring to eddie izzard as she is just polite, but it does reinforce the idea that izzard is a woman, or wants to be seen as a woman, or we should see izzard as a woman.

The same applies to everyday social interations. If someone in a group trys to shame everyone into calling a man she, they are trying to influence how everyone sees that man. That is activism.

RebelliousCow · 22/05/2024 14:25

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 14:19

using wrong-sex pronouns,

This stood out. Many people who consider themselves gender critical will use pronouns that people ask for as a courtesy. Would you really describe these people as Trans Rights Activists? Seems like a sure way to alienate people who are broadly on your side!

I'm not sure what you are angling for here?

Personally I wouldn't go out of my way to use pronouns as a " courtesy" at all. For me, such terms of reference are something that are negotiated between two people in an existing relationship - not something that should be expected or enforced. Courtesy goes two ways.

VinnieVanDog · 22/05/2024 14:24

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 14:19

using wrong-sex pronouns,

This stood out. Many people who consider themselves gender critical will use pronouns that people ask for as a courtesy. Would you really describe these people as Trans Rights Activists? Seems like a sure way to alienate people who are broadly on your side!

I would say that's becoming less common among ppl who refer to themselves as GC (which I don't, because I don't feel a need of a label to describe someone who just states the truth) but it sort of depends how it's done? If someone goes out of their way to push wrong-sex pronouns on others and then I would call them a TRA, if they're using them for the sake of a quiet life I would put them in the second category I outlined in my first tweet.

Betweenthe2 · 22/05/2024 14:19

using wrong-sex pronouns,

This stood out. Many people who consider themselves gender critical will use pronouns that people ask for as a courtesy. Would you really describe these people as Trans Rights Activists? Seems like a sure way to alienate people who are broadly on your side!

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VinnieVanDog · 22/05/2024 14:09

To me it's anyone who promotes Gender Ideology by using the jargon/using wrong-sex pronouns, TWAW etc or attacking people who refuse GI.

People who won't challenge the lies and brainwashing do an equal amount of damage but I can sympathise with their position to an extent and wouldn't class them as TRA.