I have started to hate the term “identify as”

That's what the letter B is for and it's not an identity.

The word ‘Identify’ to me means when you identify a type of plant or insect.

When a person in an interview (or whatever) starts going on about identifying themselves my mind switches off. I’m not even reacting to it anymore I am just bored.

From a 40 something women.

What you're missing is that bisexual people exist (regardless of whether or not they prefer the term queer to bisexual) and they are no less bisexual for being in long-term relationships.

Absolutely. I referred to Mussolini in my first post, but I wasn't wrong. Mussolini's corporatism divided people into economic/ political estates. POMGIT (post modern gender identity theory - I just made it up) divides them into estates based on - nothing.

"But if that's the case, then identity must remain undefined as it's continually in a state of flux. How can you then use "identity" as a way of establishing someone's position in society in respect of rights and obligations? How can you reliably ascertain the "degree of oppression" that any individual suffers? Any law requires some kind of objective tool for identifying people."

@JustSpeculation Yes, I agree - individual views of the self (I am clever, I am pretty, I am charismatic) run into social opposition all the time. Being able to hold onto your self-perception has been framed as being a matter of good self-esteem for oh, decades now. And generally that's not a bad thing. When someone approaches a potential romantic partner, she needs to have a sense of being a worthwhile partner herself, because if she gets turned down she'll need to be able to pick herself up and try again with a different person. This is core idea of resilience.

BUT. It's quite a harmless thing to think of yourself as perhaps a little better looking, or a little cooler, or a little cleverer then you actually are. What we gets you through the day, etc. Where we're running into problems is when individuals decide that their entirely uncorroborated sense of self MUST be recognised by society & other individuals AS A MATTER OF HUMAN RIGHTS, OR ELSE.

And lo and behold, this uncorroborated sense of self is not only unquestionable and avoids social co-creation, it actually comes with loads of power and privileges! No wonder it's worth declaring yourself the most vulnerable person etc etc - it's like donning a suit of Teflon armour.

According to my teen at one point pretty much half her year was identifying as LGBTQ+, including herself…. Now she like many of her friends have come through this phase, so in a way “ identifying” is perhaps quite accurately reflecting young people’s willingness ( even a keenness perhaps ?) to “ try on” these special identities for a time before they mature . In one way it’s good as those kids who are always going to be bi or gay will have a softer environment to experiment in but equally may be less good for those who have other challenges eg. Autistic girls identifying as trans.

Just imagine if we were all told that we have to refer to colours according to someones 'subjective opinion' on them?

So anyone with colour blindness could dictate to everyone else that trees are actually 'red', so we all had to refer to them as being 'red', even within schools, nurseries etc?

It's just fekkin madness !

I'm afraid I'll always challenge any 'biologically male' person who enters a female only area and I'll always challenge changing 'pregnant woman' to 'birthing parent' etc, because it's lunacy to try to enforce the 'opinion' or 'views' of the few upon the whole of society IMO.

I couldn't care less how other people 'identify' etc, that's their business, and I fully support their entitlement to choose, and I'm happy to say 'his', 'her' etc but I DO very much mind when they try to insist that I ( and the entirety of our society!) have to change MY 'views' and 'identity' to assuage their feelings when they couldn't give a shiny shit about mine? i.e I'm not changing my 'view' that a person with a penis is a man, a person with a vagina is a woman, and unless you've got 4 legs and fur then I won't be calling you a fekkin 'cat'.

I think Danni Minogue mainly identifies as "someone with a "queer" reality show to promote"...

I think this comes from a very bad place, given the amount of really awful behaviour and activity from those who peddle this nonsense.

I've been fighting this bullshit since 1984.

What on earth??? Oh boy.

“identify as” was appropriated from language used around disability. For over a decade people have been asked if they 'identify as disabled' by large companies, because its a personal decision.
There is no register of disabled people, and some people who have a disability don't consider themselves to be disabled at all.

Unfortunately now some people have decided to identify as disabled, and this probably isn't going to end well for disabled people. There is no central register because we all know how that turned out the last time.

Yep, when people say “I identify as” I usually mentally change that to “I’m not”. I also file the person saying it under People to Avoid because the next minute they’re spouting crap about how they, a ‘gender-queer demi femme aromantic lesbian’ are officially The Most Oppressed Ever - when they’re actually a privileged white man.

Totally agree OP.
And as for the 30% who "identify as" LGBTQ+, I remember a woman I know who is one of those 30%, she'd say she's a nice binary lesbian but in reality she's just a woman married with a guy who wears nail polish.

I have to just say that I'm a man, I'm suddenly in a gay relationship, unbeknownst to my DP who as far as he's concerned wasn't gay when he woke up this morning and is now among the 30%

I'm applying for jobs at the moment and several have asked if I "identify as disabled" which pisses me off so much, because it implies that as I could also identify as not disabled but my eyes still wouldnt see properly no matter what I identify as

Interestingly the firms who ask this advertise themselves as "disability friendly" but it turns out they are only disability friendly if the disability doesn't need any reasonable adjustments.... So not disability friendly at all

Ironically the ones who don't ask what sex, gender, sexual orientation or disability I "identify as" have actually been the most disability friendly 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️

I think all this doesn't come from a bad place, it comes from wanting social justice.. but it's just gone too far and I'm glad it seems like the younger generation are realising that.

Maybe a good reply to 'I identify as ... insert identity here...' should be 'Oh I used to love playing 'pretend' as a child' and then change the subject. 😉

In Another Corner Of The Internet where some of us used to hang out, there was an acronym, SAFC (Shit, And For Cunts), "Identify as" is firmly in that bag.

For me "identify as" alerts me to the fact that either a lie or absolute word salad is about to come out of the mouth of the person who said it!

It has got to the point where hearing it is provoking a visceral reaction in me!

Luckily I identify as a placid person so the urge to throw things never manifests itself into reality!

This wording is on the rise because of the increased visibility of transgender people, as in 'a trans woman is a man who identifies as a woman'. This is unique to trans because the 'positionality' depends entirely on the belief and not on any independent verifiable facts.

If you're thinking 'but this applies to religion too, as in 'a Christian is someone who believes in the risen Christ '', then no. The belief identifies them as a Christian but says nothing about the existence of the risen Christ.

Because of this, some trans people read this wording as transphobic. The ones that might not are the ones whose view of their transness is easier for the rest of us to grasp (like Debbie Hayton with the you know what and Andrea Long Chu with the ahem playful sex fun approach).

I've been reading about the 20th century history of transsexualism and it's given me an alarming new (to me) insight into how the campaigners for the GRA saw things, and how some still see things now.

In short, these TW believe that they really are women (I might do a separate post about this but not here because this is too long already). They think that GRCs and the GRR are othering and that they should instead be able to correct their original birth registration as was possible before the April Ashley case in the 60s. They think that intervention at puberty is as vital as for any (other) DSD. And if they're willing to cede space to women, it's not because they are biologically male. It's because they are women with a body type that for example might give them an unfair advantage.

This leaves a lot less psychological room for negotiation than I thought (and explains why some of my conversations with trans friends go as badly as they do) but maybe I'll save expansion on that for another post too.

Apologies if this was obvious to everyone except me! I really didn't know it.

In this oddly-written story about the Miss USA pageant that leaves me none the wiser about much, the contestant involved "self-identifies as Mexican Indian".

As pp have already said, it just makes you think that perhaps she... isn't? Or there'd be no 'self identify' about it?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-68982769

When I hear "identify as" I immediately jump to "pretend to be".

Bloody love Ian Dury!

The best way to deal with this bollocks is the reductio ad absurbum.

If asked what you identify as, whatever answer you give, make sure you change your mind 30 minutes later. And immediately contact the appropriate people.

If you experience any pushback then you SCREAM about your oppression. I mean really SCREAM. If you can cry so much the better.

And woe betide the first person who dare suggest you aren't taking it seriously. As you unburden you lifes struggle to be recognised as (say) a Chippendale Chair. And now these fascist bastards are going to erase your identity with their "rules".

If you are really luck you will spend more time correcting your pronouns than actually working. Which you thank your ever supportive employer for.

My DD uses ‘crip’. If she had a theme tune it would be Ian Drury’s Spasticus Autusticus. She is at times v outspoken but it’s hard work, she gets chastised at times by able-bodied people for using the disabled toilets as she is not an in your face crip. But last time it happened she had the guts to complain to customer services in the store she was in.