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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
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MissScarletInTheBallroom · 01/05/2024 19:48

crinkletits · 01/05/2024 19:44

Diana Rigg was spot on about Daniel.

What did she say?

tellmewhenthespaceshiplandscoz · 01/05/2024 19:45

The holocaust refers to the planned and systematic gathering up and murdering of over 6 million Jewish people. The intent was to eradicate a group of people from the earth in their entirety. Hundreds of records were kept and subsequently destroyed.

Quite unique but sadly unique to the Jewish people

crinkletits · 01/05/2024 19:44

Diana Rigg was spot on about Daniel.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 01/05/2024 19:42

BackToLurk · 01/05/2024 19:31

Can someone clarify whether the Potterheads (I have no idea whether that is what they are called) that were devastated by JKR's tweets because it 'literally trashed their childhoods' as they loved the books so much are the same people who always said the books were 'racist & antisemitic'?

No, funnily enough they have only started saying the books are "problematic" since JKR started speaking about women's rights, and will say things like, "Looking back there have always been issues with the books but we didn't know any better back then."

Winnading · 01/05/2024 19:35

BiggerBoat1 · 01/05/2024 14:04

I find all the hate a bit sad. He's expressing an opinion, just as JKR does. You may not agree with him, but the personal insults are a bit childish.

Point out the hate please.

I dont hate him, I'm not overly bothered about him and as a heretic who has never watched a Harry Potter film or read the books (soz jk) I have no idea about his acting talent or lack of. Still his comments are juvenile and male pandering.
No thought to women. So that leads me to dislike him. Dislike is not hate.

BackToLurk · 01/05/2024 19:31

Can someone clarify whether the Potterheads (I have no idea whether that is what they are called) that were devastated by JKR's tweets because it 'literally trashed their childhoods' as they loved the books so much are the same people who always said the books were 'racist & antisemitic'?

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 01/05/2024 19:30

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:42

I don't think it's as black and white as that. She has her main character literally owning a slave. After the big final battle, her main characters thought is of that slave will bring him a sandwich. That to me isn't a clear cut message that slavery is wrong 🤷🏻‍♀️

Your argument is weak to non-existent. House elves are not humans. They are a different species to humans and they have been indoctrinated from birth to believe their role is to be subservient to humans. Harry inherits Kreacher. He doesn't want him, but he is stuck with him. You could just as well say that dogs who seem to enjoy being pets are being exploited by humans.

I think it's also interesting and far from black and white that Hermione is initially ridiculed for her stance on house elves by other teenagers who have limited life experience and accept the status quo without questioning it. It takes the experience of life under the Death Eaters and Voldemort, who are eugenicists, speciesist and totalitarian, to make the others start to see things more as Hermione does.

Peskysquirrel · 01/05/2024 19:19

@MissScarletInTheBallroom Are you seriously suggesting that JK Rowling should have stepped in and said, "Guys, you can't use Australia House as the filming location for Gringotts because there is a six pointed star on the floor which represents the six states of Australia and doesn't look much like the Star of David, but in 20 years' time some arsewipes who have got it in for me because I don't believe humans can change sex will be saying on social media, a thing which hasn't been invented yet, that this is antisemitic."

😆Brilliant!

Livingtothefull · 01/05/2024 19:15

'I feel that the statement "trans women are women" erases the identity and dignity of women, who actually need and are allowed to have words and spaces for themselves which don't include members of the opposite sex.'

That is 100% correct @MissScarletInTheBallroom . I find the TWAW statement so inherently creepy and sinister. It actually reminds me of the 1984 quote 'War is Peace/Freedom is Slavery/Ignorance is Strength'. I sense a cynical intention behind it - to demand people accept a self-contradictory statement that is manifestly untrue.

illinivich · 01/05/2024 19:03

FlirtsWithRhinos · 01/05/2024 18:41

"And any meaningful conversation to protect women's rights / women's spaces won't happen with her leading the movement. Her awfulness is a distraction from the actual issues"

Called it.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4849558-the-news-agents-podcast?reply=127665033

And I'm pretty sure I wasn't the first to say it either.

Yep.

We're going to see a lot of this.

illinivich · 01/05/2024 19:02

I feel sad for jon stewart that he had never heard of goblins before he watch the film. Despite reading the book.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 01/05/2024 18:49

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:39

If you're expecting me to pull out a quote of a character using a slur then you clearly don't possess much critical thinking ability 🤣 as linked in the article above, her depiction of the goblins leans into harmful antisemitic Jewish stereotypes

Actually, I am expecting you to do that. Because the article you linked to is full of crap.

It doesn't mention the rather important fact that after trans activists lost their shit all over Twitter about JK Rowling's "antisemitism", Jon Stewart went on record saying he was making a light-hearted joke about the films and he does not think JK Rowling is antisemitic.

It also claims that she depicts the goblins as "hook nosed" in the books. So my challenge to you is to quote the part where she actually does that. Because I have actually gone back and looked and cannot find any reference to the goblins' noses.

Everything else referred to in the article is about the Warner Bros films, which were produced by the grandson of German Jews who fled the Nazis in the 1930s.

Are you seriously suggesting that JK Rowling should have stepped in and said, "Guys, you can't use Australia House as the filming location for Gringotts because there is a six pointed star on the floor which represents the six states of Australia and doesn't look much like the Star of David, but in 20 years' time some arsewipes who have got it in for me because I don't believe humans can change sex will be saying on social media, a thing which hasn't been invented yet, that this is antisemitic."

TeaGinandFags · 01/05/2024 18:49

Transgender women are women. Any statement to the contrary erases the identity and dignity of transgender people and goes against all advice given by professional health care associations who have far more expertise on this subject matter than either Jo or I.

Right, mate.

So when a transgender person has surgery the anaesthetist needs to know the biologicak sex: a male receiving a female dose won't go to slerp while a femsle receiving a male dose won't wake up.

Sex matters. Fantasies don't.

PTSDBarbiegirl · 01/05/2024 18:43

"Sad" his language is almost pre school. No emotional literacy or any respect for the safety of women, happy to stand by when JKR spoke up against transing, homophobia and mysogyny and was thrown under the bus. He's got her to thank for his multi millions. Tosser.

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:42

PickledMumion · 01/05/2024 18:40

It's a book for children. It shows how standing up for what you believe in, and doing the "right thing", isn't always easy, and how other people can give you a hard time for it (and JKR wrote this before anyone had sent her death threats for understanding very basic human biology at a time when that was considered to be blasphemous......)

But it's very clear throughout the writing what she considers the "right" thing" to be in the context of slavery. Obviously.

I don't think it's as black and white as that. She has her main character literally owning a slave. After the big final battle, her main characters thought is of that slave will bring him a sandwich. That to me isn't a clear cut message that slavery is wrong 🤷🏻‍♀️

FlirtsWithRhinos · 01/05/2024 18:41

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 17:51

I mean you can dismiss my viewpoint like that if you want. But I'm not an outlier, the opinion that she is awful is widespread. And any meaningful conversation to protect women's rights / women's spaces won't happen with her leading the movement. Her awfulness is a distraction from the actual issues 🤷🏻‍♀️

"And any meaningful conversation to protect women's rights / women's spaces won't happen with her leading the movement. Her awfulness is a distraction from the actual issues"

Called it.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4849558-the-news-agents-podcast?reply=127665033

And I'm pretty sure I wasn't the first to say it either.

The News Agents Podcast? | Mumsnet

Has anyone listened to last night's episode yet? It is an extended interview with Wes Streeting. I really like what he has to say about managing...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4849558-the-news-agents-podcast?reply=127665033

ilurktherforeiam · 01/05/2024 18:40

PorcelinaV · 01/05/2024 15:26

He is entitled to his own opinions sure, but I think that some loyalty would be appropriate given how much hate and demonisation she got.

So he doesn't have to agree with her, but he could have been speaking out to defend her right to speak and say that sections of the trans lobby were way too hostile. Assuming that's his genuine opinion of course.

Maybe I missed it, but I didn't notice him doing much to stand up for free speech and civil debate over the issue.

Yes. And not one of them actually read what she wrote!

They were all quite happy to make statements based off of what the TRAs were saying about what JKR wrote. The very least they could have done was read her actual words before they posted. They couldn't even give her that much respect, and that tells me that they were happy to have the chance to get behind a movement that was slamming her. They wanted to use her fall to push themselves into popularity with the new woke crowd. And this is why they are dicks, not because they have an 'opinion'.

PickledMumion · 01/05/2024 18:40

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:35

I get what youre saying, but equally Dobby was treated as an outlier, shunned by his community

Hermione was treated as crazy for elf rights activism

and then by the end of the story...nothing has changed. Slaves are still slaves and no one seems to really care. It's not the liberating tale of elf rights your implying

It's a book for children. It shows how standing up for what you believe in, and doing the "right thing", isn't always easy, and how other people can give you a hard time for it (and JKR wrote this before anyone had sent her death threats for understanding very basic human biology at a time when that was considered to be blasphemous......)

But it's very clear throughout the writing what she considers the "right" thing" to be in the context of slavery. Obviously.

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:39

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 01/05/2024 18:37

Can you quote a passage about goblins from one of the books which you personally believe is antisemitic?

If you're expecting me to pull out a quote of a character using a slur then you clearly don't possess much critical thinking ability 🤣 as linked in the article above, her depiction of the goblins leans into harmful antisemitic Jewish stereotypes

whynotwhatknot · 01/05/2024 18:37

terrible actor ive tried watching other films but he comes aross so wooden so yes he'll only get parts because of hp an that looks like its drying up

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 01/05/2024 18:37

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:24

I mean her writing of the goblins has been widely condemned for being antisemitic

sje also had a whole slave race is in the books but it was cool because they LOVED being slaves....wtf

Can you quote a passage about goblins from one of the books which you personally believe is antisemitic?

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:35

PickledMumion · 01/05/2024 18:32

OK, I know this isn't really the place for a HP derail, but you've really misunderstood the plight of the house elves within the books.

Sirius literally dies because he treated Kreacher so badly. Dobby is a shining hero, and beacon of hope - his freedom is so integral to his character that Harry writes "here lies a free elf" on his grave. "Magic is might" is shown to be a hideous supremacist belief. Slavery is not "cool" in JKR's writing.

I get what youre saying, but equally Dobby was treated as an outlier, shunned by his community

Hermione was treated as crazy for elf rights activism

and then by the end of the story...nothing has changed. Slaves are still slaves and no one seems to really care. It's not the liberating tale of elf rights your implying

PickledMumion · 01/05/2024 18:32

Nidysheyzjsbsgwhw · 01/05/2024 18:24

I mean her writing of the goblins has been widely condemned for being antisemitic

sje also had a whole slave race is in the books but it was cool because they LOVED being slaves....wtf

OK, I know this isn't really the place for a HP derail, but you've really misunderstood the plight of the house elves within the books.

Sirius literally dies because he treated Kreacher so badly. Dobby is a shining hero, and beacon of hope - his freedom is so integral to his character that Harry writes "here lies a free elf" on his grave. "Magic is might" is shown to be a hideous supremacist belief. Slavery is not "cool" in JKR's writing.

illinivich · 01/05/2024 18:32

I think he has given money to them.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 01/05/2024 18:30

SaltPorridge · 01/05/2024 18:28

Going back to the OP, isn't this publicity for the Trevor Project, and is Radcliffe saying he was involved with them for how long? In what capacity? Is he being paid to promote them?

Yes and Tbf I assume DR hasn’t the faintest idea that their are toddlers that could design more robust research approaches than the Trevor project

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