Are you voting in the next general election purely on the transgender issue?

You seem to mean that David Cameron did not set up a supermajority so that Remain would win? That's not very democratic and considered improper in the UK (ever since the Scots won a vote to have an Assembly in 1979 and did not get it because 40% of the electorate (not the turnout) did not vote for it - a piece of gerrymandering all objected to - so, all referendums work on the principle that the winner is 50%+1). There was no disinformation - not that anyone was listening since almost all voters had decided how they would vote years ago - and anyone who had been listening outside the London bubble would have known how much disaffection there was from the EU. A refenda can only have a Yes/No answer, a three way split is impossible (and will favour the status quo, which may not be what the electorate wants). As for using underhand methods, the Remain campaign got an extra 9M in funding from the supposedly neutral government in the form of a leaflet urging us to vote Remain - I'd call that gerrymandering if I was not polite.
NB Liddington's reference to voter turnout was to the 1979 Scottish referendum. A voter turnout bill would never have got through Parliament - everyone thought it unfair and, as he implied, it is all about making sure the status quo/answer the government wants is certain to be the result. Not democratic. (Where he got the idea no-one was going to act on the result I do not know. Cameron was clear that the result would be acted on, and (bar the undemocratic 1979 Scots referenda) all referenda have been acted on by the UK.)

At the moment i’m not sure what a tory vote would mean, as it looks as though Rishi will be booted and I could not vote for a party led, say by, Mordant given she has not been open and honest about about her position and is clearly ambivalent due to family ties.

I agree @BusyMummy001, no one actually knows what they will get from a Tory vote beyond the chaos of another🙄 leadership contest where Penny TWAW Mordaunt is one of the favourites to win.

PM Sunak is out on his hole the day after the election. If he lasts that long.

It was a democratic vote and the people voted for what they wanted. I voted to leave, I believe in national sovereignty as the best guardian of democracy, and the EU is as about as democratic as a box of oranges.

Well said.

And look - much much more than a single issue 🙄, who knew?

Hopefully Labour will not continue to privatize it like the Tories, who seem to hate it, and will put in some more money, rather than spending it on daft anti-immigrant schemes. They cannot be worse than the Tories.

Points I will be considering:

Education - will my children be taught facts in school or will their education be dominated by an ideology that leads them to deny biology, ignore their boundaries, and transition them in secret, ultimately leading me to need to home educate them? If I do withdraw them, would social services threaten to take them into care to ply them with harmful drugs? Would my daughters have fair sports?

NHS - will I be able to access this or be called a bigot and denied care because I want same sex care? Will I and my daughters be allowed to request same sex carers, especially for intimate care, or be required to endure sexual assault if we need health care? Will the health care we are provided with be safe and effective for women or will the effect of treatment on women be unknown and potentially dangerous because research and clinical monitoring conflates the sexes? If my children need mental health care, will they be safe? If any of us need an in patient stay, will our privacy, dignity and safety be protected?

Freedom of speech and religion - will this be allowed? Or will I be forced to follow the beliefs of gender ideology? Will I be accused of a hate crime if I followed mainstream religious beliefs or read the Bible to my children in my own home? Will I be allowed to call a man a man? To refuse to undress in front of men? If I am arrested, will my human rights be considered or only those of male police officers?

Employment - will women be protected from discrimination based on their sex? Would a public board be considered equal if it is made up entirely of men? Will I be sacked if I don’t follow gender ideology? Or like a ‘wrong’ post? Will my business be blacklisted if I don’t subscribe to a Stonewall award or similar award scheme?

I have no one to vote for - it’s making me think we need a new party that looks after women, children. Keeps democracy at the forefront. We have 36 million women in this country. Maybe it’s about time they actually had a proper voice rather than wrangling and pleading with the patriarchy.

I'm just waiting for him to pop up on our screens to tell us he's in good spirits and his captors are treating him well.

I'm voting for our local independent.

No way I'm voting for the Tories after the last 14 years

Labour is a definite no because Kier Starmer is so slippery and unwilling to answer a simple question that he seems either entirely untrustworthy or stupid (and we know he's not stupid). Yes I know you shouldn't vote for the leader but he sets the tone for the party so if he doesn't have the balls to acknowledge reality in case it upsets some TRAs then it's a nope from me (and our local Labour candidate is just as unwilling to commit one way or another)

Lib dems and greens are so into the Kool Aid there is no chance I'm voting for either

So independent, spoiled ballot or no vote for me

@Vaccances
Here are places where you can read about what I wrote earlier on this afternoon which you asked about.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jul/24/labour-vows-to-modernise-simplify-and-reform-gender-recognition-act

A thread where I commented about the Guardian report
ScrollingLeaves · 19/04/2024 23:14

The Labour Women’s Declaration about it.
https://labourwomensdeclaration.org.uk/lwd-responds-to-the-uk-labour-partys-pivot-on-sex-and-gender/

Labour Women’s Declaration about the spousal contract aspect.
https://labourwomensdeclaration.org.uk/the-spousal-consent-clause-in-the-gra-an-important-protection-for-women
(Which I think someone else (BonfireLady?) has mentioned today too.

Spectator article about Kier Starmer and the “Ban Conversion Therapy Bill”.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/labours-trans-inclusive-conversion-therapy-ban-will-be-a-disaster/

Kemi Badenoch about how banning conversion therapy if it means affirmation only is problematic.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/dec/06/gender-affirming-care-for-children-form-of-conversion-therapy-says-badenoch

Thank you very much @ Chariothorses

I'm just going to see what Labour's manifesto says before I commit. If they are still planning to make it easier for men to falsify their identity documents then I probably won't vote for them. The other thing is if they are planning on bringing in hate speech laws that'll put me off voting for them as well. but I expect them to win comfortably anyway. They don't need my vote.

No

How,Keir? Andwhat, Keir? You've said what you don't like and you've said what you want to fix, but what does "fixed" look like? All we've seen so far on this is an even worse outcome for transwidows because you've misunderstood the "spousal veto" - it's not a veto on the transition, it's a right to divorce a husband and not a wife. Irrespective of anyone's views on homosexual marriage (personal I support it, and I've seen the same from many posters), the idea that a woman should be forced to accept a divorce record where the marriage that has been ended is between two women, simply because the man now identifies as a woman, is just plain wrong. [My emphasis]

This is so well expressed, @BonfireLady.

"So why is it so hard for Keir Starmer to say those six words? That 'sex is immutable and it matters'? What's stopping him from saying it?"

I don't know @AutumnCrow but I suspect it's mostly due to him being a pathetic feeble critter. It's still socially unacceptable to state biological truths, and even with the CASS report it'll take years before people are comfortable challenging the trans agenda.

Agree completely with what a pp wrote:
"Yes I will be voting based solely on this issue in the next GA" and I will also vote that way in my local council, Mayoral and PCC election.

I used to be a member of the Labour party. I can't imagine ever giving them my vote again.

As I say I'm voting tactically against the Tories, due to their utter disregard and trashing of our children's future safety and life on this planet. Rather than with any particular enthusiasm for any other party! Seemingly the Greens are (sadly) the most captured lot out there. But they aren't an option on the ballot form where I am, so not an issue for me.

Agreed. And if he is a hostage, he needs to recognise it and step aside. That would be the responsible, grown-up, leader-ish thing to do.

So good they said it thrice!

Grabbing this one again as I had missed it the first time. Thank you Dineasair for giving it a bump.

Labour have been great at stamping their feet and delivering rhetoric, exactly as we need from the Opposition. Despite the flip-floppy nature of the substance, Starmer is a marked improvement on Corbyn in this respect IMO. He does at least engage.

However, back to the substance.. How, Keir? And what, Keir? You've said what you don't like and you've said what you want to fix, but what does "fixed" look like? All we've seen so far on this is an even worse outcome for transwidows because you've misunderstood the "spousal veto" - it's not a veto on the transition, it's a right to divorce a husband and not a wife. Irrespective of anyone's views on homosexual marriage (personal I support it, and I've seen the same from many posters), the idea that a woman should be forced to accept a divorce record where the marriage that has been ended is between two women, simply because the man now identifies as a woman, is just plain wrong.
And if they can't be bothered to understand what they should change and what "better" actually looks like, how can we trust them to do this with any other rhetoric statements? How will they improve the NHS? Where will the money come from? What does "better" look like? Etc etc.

Aye, maybe.

I don't need a leader in a hostage situation.

I'm only speculating but could he have a family member or life-long friend who is identifying as TQ+? Has it become an issue too close to home?

So why is it so hard for Keir Starmer to say those six words? That 'sex is immutable and it matters'? What's stopping him from saying it?

Well I voted Green last time because of the climate and look what happened there (Scotland).

Climate change

Living wage/cost of living

Housing crisis

Destruction of the NHS

Vote based on these issues, because these things impact on us every single day, and continue to campaign for single sex spaces and women's rights.

No.