Bondi killings

You’ve used an example of a killer who didn’t specifically target women and described that as “the most comparable” UK example, to argue that male rampage killers targeting women isn’t something that happens very often. It might be a recent UK example, but it isn’t the most comparable.

There’s this example where the killer targeted women and girls on the school run, mowing them down with his van, and killing one mother in front of her children. Similar to the Bondi killer, any men affected were “collateral damage”. In this case, his partner had recently ended their relationship. Again mental illness a factor.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-22783319

You can be mentally ill and misogynistic, the two aren’t mutually exclusive. Strange how he targeted mainly women. The first people he went to was a woman with her baby.

Mental illness may release the inner demon but why does that demon invariably tell the men to target women?

Also, even though this chat is primarily about feminism, I find it nauseating that so many people were desperate for the attacker to be Muslim when he wasn’t and actually killed a Muslim man who was defending other people.

It doesn’t necessarily have to be outright misogyny to target women either. At one end we have Elliot Rodger style misogynistic terror attacks with a woman hating manifesto. At the other we have men intent on going on the rampage and they mainly select women simply because they’re weaker and a softer target, but not for ideological reasons. And everything in between. All of them are attacks on women - and the result is the same.

Only today I was walking DD to the park with DS in the buggy and during a 10 minute walk, 2 men tried to speak to us. One looked odd, the other quite rough. I can’t even walk from A to B without being expected to pay attention to men I have never clapped eyes on before. It usually happens at least 3 times a week, and you guessed it, NEVER when I’m with DP. Always when I’m alone or with the children.

Even DD asked ‘mummy why do men talk to us all the time?’, and she’s 4. She’s clocked that we get this kind of unwarranted attention constantly whereas Daddy doesn’t.

I’m fed up with it. Leave us the fuck alone. Sometimes conversation happens organically between strangers and that’s fine and healthy, but approaching exclusively women with the purpose of demanding attention isn’t that.

Basically pretty much everything men do regarding women they don’t know has some kind of sexism about it.

Yes.

It's fair to say nobody knows enough to comment yet. But it's absurd to say that there is no reason to suspect he killed women because of misogyny, and I find it a really strange phenomenon that people are so quick to try and suggest that it's somehow unethical to even consider that as a cause.

The most comparable case to this that we've had in the UK was that of Valdo Calocane, and he killed two men, one woman and attempted to kill more.

We all know how powerful testosterone is and how it can make people very aggressive (rumoured to even affect the trans men who take it too).

Men are nearly 100% behind all these attacks, but I wouldn't say that men are never victims of these sort of violent crimes.

I just think they see female lives as cheap, easy targets and hold them in contempt.

In the video, he runs after a group of people fleeing the shopping centre. One of the men in the group stops and faces him off, and he runs away.

I don’t care what people say, these types are never so mentally unwell that they go after men and women indiscriminately. They always always go after women, the elderly and children.

In public I’ve regularly been stopped over the years by ranting odd types who clearly get a kick out of intimidating members of the public. I’ve NEVER seen them try it with a youngish well built man, not once. Or any men at all actually. They know what they’re doing somewhere underneath.

Luke Batty's father has mental health issues too. I don't know what can realistically be done but there needs to be intervention before these men kill.

All we know is that the guy had a history of mental health problems. We know nothing about his state of mjnd at the time of attack.

It's really striking how some people rush to the feminist board to close down conversations about male violence.

DD and I were shopping there on Friday, it is just incomprehensible to think of that happening in a suburban shopping centre. Sydneysiders are in shock as apart from the Lindt cafe siege that sort of thing just doesn’t happen here. I keep thinking about that poor baby girl and the fact that if she survives she has lost her mum (and the other families too of course). Hard not to think he targeted women and I’m glad he was shot not left with some lawyer getting him off on mental health grounds.

Not telling anyone what to think.

But if anyone is looking for a rational explanation or ideology then they won't find one. Because someone with such serious mental health problems isn't, by definition, thinking rationally or cogently.

@TempestTost we'll have to agree to disagree with each other

No, not really. We didn’t have the internet for wild speculation amongst the general,public, and we didn’t have as many of these incidents, or become aware of those happening abroad.

I remember hearing about this as it was happening, because we were driving back from Newbury and the traffic was diverted. We assumed it was a random crazy person, because that was who did those things then. And so it was .

@Kalevala no, I believe it was a crime scene that meant they were not allowed to move vehicles

They also didn't know till later it was only one attacker as rumours were floating around that it was multiple attackers... which makes sense not allowing vehicles to leave

Not sure that it's fair for you to tell people how to think and respond to something as terrible as this. I understood what *MissScarlet' was saying.

They weren't allowed to drive home on the day?

The killer had a series of serious mental health problems, including diagnised schizophrenia and was known to the authorities.

There is no need to ascribe an agenda beyond this to explain the terrible things he did, except to perhaps recognise as a society that community mental health treatment hasn't been a wild success since the closing of the asylums in the 80s and 90s, and until more people are institutionalised as a precaution then more of this will happen.

I saw a clip of a newspaper saying his family contacted the authorities after they saw footage on the tv and thought it was their son.

I saw a post (I live in NSW) on my Facebook feed from Westfield saying that from tomorrow people that have cars parked in Westfield Bondi Junction can start picking them up, and also that they won't be charged (obviously). But the most beautiful thing were the strangers offering to pick up cars for people that may not be able to face going back - or the contact information of police that could the same.

The devastation continues to unfold.

One woman who was killed was a lovely 25 year old, who was shopping for makeup for her wedding.
Her fiancé, a police officer, responded to the emergency call despite his shift having finished, and went to assist at the shopping centre.
His colleagues discovered his fiancée was one of those killed - and had to help the officer from the scene.

My thoughts and prayers go to them all.

https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/nsw/bondi-junction-stabbings-dawn-singleton-shopping-for-her-wedding-when-she-was-killed/news-story/14cf6023c39b930c7428e8132c573925

@ArabellaScott thank you for your thoughts, it's created huge trauma, we are working through managing our children and as mum to an 11 year old boy who is at school here with their many friend chat groups monitoring what's being shared and talked about. Schools have already organised Councelling, as have the local council have offered free Councelling services for anyone who was there at the time or even just affected at a distance.

As I said, this has had a huge impact on our small community, everyone knows someone who was there or witnessed these murders.

We are all holding our loved ones a bit closer today.

@MrsSkylerWhite this is irrelevant, Westfield shopping mall has cameras everywhere, every moment of this will have been captured on video.