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Original poster

AntiSocial on Radio 4 started right now (Friday lunchtime) on misgendering

104 replies

nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:06

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001xfw6

The programme consistently fails to meaningfully engage with trans.

OP posts:
Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:35

Queer academic asked about Forstater case and to be fair she is explaining that misgendering isn't permitted in the workplace to the extent that it amounts to harassment.

OP posts:
Albatrossing · 22/03/2024 12:35

they seem to be trying to make it as dull and wearying as possible so that any concerns are just bored out of the listener.

DrBlackbird · 22/03/2024 12:34

CriticalCondition · 22/03/2024 12:26

Wish I could listen to this now but I have to go out. Will catch up later. Vainly hoping Adam doesn't run to his previous form for cutting short his GC guest.

He’s doing a shite job here. The tone of voice in reference to the Forstater case. His choice of guests and the time he’s giving them makes clear his position on this matter.

DrBlackbird · 22/03/2024 12:32

BaronMunchausen · 22/03/2024 12:23

Yes, i checked the first alphabetical half-dozen of his colleagues and none of the others had pronouns. He seems to have indicated he's a trans identifying female?

Show quote history

No, I don’t think so. More likely gay. Possibly just not wholly invested in understanding or appreciating the potentially negative impacts on women.

So far I’m not impressed with the handling of this important topic. Chalmers’s opinion it’s going to be fine. Police Scotland (who are nice to trans people) say it’ll be fine. Hamlin saying just don’t be unkind and it’ll be fine. Now omigod another bloody academic from queer studies now speaking. I’m giving up.

Women wear your scold’s bridles so you don’t stir anything up, don’t hurt menz feelings, don’t be deliberatively unkind.

Know your place and it’ll be fine. God. What could possibly go wrong.

BaronMunchausen · 22/03/2024 12:32

BaronMunchausen · 22/03/2024 12:23

Yes, i checked the first alphabetical half-dozen of his colleagues and none of the others had pronouns. He seems to have indicated he's a trans identifying female?

Show quote history

(...think I may have mixed up the two male-sounding speakers)

Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:32

Academic in Queer Studies on now.

OP posts:
Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:31

You confused Hamlin's voice for a man's!

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Helleofabore · 22/03/2024 12:31

ok. I am lost in the voices.... sorry

Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:30

It was Hamlin, Beaumont Society, who described IW in that way.

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Helleofabore · 22/03/2024 12:29

I just heard that. Yes.... Willoughby is now being described by apparently a uni lecturer as a 'female'.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/03/2024 12:29

Is "orchid crushing" something to do with orchidectomy?

That's the assumption.

BaronMunchausen · 22/03/2024 12:29

JKR cited as an example of "deliberately hurtful" misgendering. Think and believe what you like, but don't say it.

Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:28

Hamlin: India Willoughby has a GRC so is female.

They're really moved to inhabit the word "female" in the recent past haven't they?

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Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:26

Has anyone else noticed Hamlin's voice getting more blokey as the programme goes on?

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CriticalCondition · 22/03/2024 12:26

Wish I could listen to this now but I have to go out. Will catch up later. Vainly hoping Adam doesn't run to his previous form for cutting short his GC guest.

Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:23

Hamlin says Susan's concerns are not valid because the legal commentator said there's nothing to worry about.

Hamlin says it's simple "if you're not being deliberately hurtful to someone, you're safe".

Hamlin laughed indulgently and dismissively at a question about potential misuse of powers by the Police.

An appearance by the Hate Monster!

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CriticalCondition · 22/03/2024 12:23

nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:13

Is "orchid crushing" something to do with orchidectomy?

Possibly, nauticant, possibly.

There's a lingering shot of a withered orchid being crushed by a TW hand with glittery green nails. There are violins.

BaronMunchausen · 22/03/2024 12:23

nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:19

https://www.gla.ac.uk/schools/law/staff/jameschalmers/

pronouns: He/him/his

Yes, i checked the first alphabetical half-dozen of his colleagues and none of the others had pronouns. He seems to have indicated he's a trans identifying female?

DrBlackbird · 22/03/2024 12:22

nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:18

James Chalmers is confident that the Police won't use the new powers to apply to misgendering.

That might because he has skin in the game… so perhaps not quite the disinterested legal view another invited guest would have been.

Chalmers, J. and Leverick, F. (2020) Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Bill: A Report for the Justice Committee. Documentation. Scottish Parliament Justice Committee

Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Bill: A Report for the Justice Committee - Enlighten Publications

https://eprints.gla.ac.uk/227107/

Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:19

https://www.gla.ac.uk/schools/law/staff/jameschalmers/

pronouns: He/him/his

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Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:18

James Chalmers is confident that the Police won't use the new powers to apply to misgendering.

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Original poster
nauticant · 22/03/2024 12:17

Legal commentator very glib about the Police in Scotland being very restrained in how they'll apply their new powers under the coming Hate Crime laws there.

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SirChenjins · 22/03/2024 12:16

It’s never a transman, is it?

Will listen now, thanks for the heads up.

BaronMunchausen · 22/03/2024 12:15

"a particular flashpoint"...

Helleofabore · 22/03/2024 12:14

Thanks Nauticant. Listening.