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All new hate crimes legislation - JKR stands firm

68 replies

Britinme · 18/03/2024 19:22

As reported in the Daily Telegraph, the Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Act at Holyrood in 2021 will come into force on April 1 after Police Scotland said it needed time for “training, guidance and communications planning”.
The legislation creates a criminal offence of “stirring up of hatred”, expanding on a similar offence based on racist abuse that has been on the statute book for decades.
Offences are considered “aggravated”, meaning they could lead to stiffer sentences, if they involve prejudice on the basis of age, disability, race, religion, sexual orientation or transgender identity.
Activists have already unsuccessfully attempted to have the author arrested for “misgendering” after she publicly called India Willoughby a male.
However, on Xitter, Rowling said "If you genuinely imagine I’d delete posts calling a man a man, so as not to be prosecuted under this ludicrous law, stand by for the mother of all April Fools’ jokes." and "If you genuinely imagine I’d delete posts calling a man a man, so as not to be prosecuted under this ludicrous law, stand by for the mother of all April Fools’ jokes."
Who's breaking out the Harry Potter Butterbeer popcorn? (https://youreverydayfamily.com/harry-potter-butterbeer-popcorn/)

JK Rowling vows to defy ‘ludicrous’ new hate crime laws

Harry Potter author insists she will continue to argue online that trans women are not women after Scotland tightens curbs

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/03/18/jk-rowling-keep-calling-a-man-a-man-snp-hate-crime-laws/

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hellsBells246 · 20/03/2024 23:48

StealthSpinach · 19/03/2024 07:55

Sex has deliberately not been included.

Shows how much consideration is given to women, doesn’t it?

Wtaf???? Insanity.

hellsBells246 · 20/03/2024 23:46

Offences are considered “aggravated”, meaning they could lead to stiffer sentences, if they involve prejudice on the basis of age, disability, race, religion, sexual orientation or transgender identity.

Surely SEX is included in this list, @Britinme ??

StealthSpinach · 20/03/2024 23:41

Redshoeblueshoe · 20/03/2024 21:09

Police Scotland are at it now. Telegraph article on Twitter saying they have created a character called Jo who wants to send all trans people to the gas chamber.
These people should be sacked

She should sue. They are absolutely delusional and so transparent.

mrshoho · 20/03/2024 23:23

What a scary future when this law comes into force. The SNP offer platitudes that it will be followed in the spirit of the law as intended but that is complete bullshit as we have seen with the ribbon photo debacle.

Madcats · 20/03/2024 23:17

I've missed most of it (thank you DD), but they are discussing this on Newsnight (probably started at about 10:45pm).
Lucy Hunter Blackburn and somebody Mackenzie (?) from the SNP who was involved in the drafting of the legislation.

Then, of course, they have a lengthy piece about how the "men who want to be women" have long waiting lists for hormone treatment.

MsFogi · 20/03/2024 22:50

Hmm they may have left sex out but I suspect the police could be pretty busy with women over 40 claiming ageism. I think we could have a field day - chap on the checkout didn’t ask me for ID when I bought a bottle of gin, I ‘feel’ like I am 15 and I identify as being 15 therefore I perceive this to have been a hate crime etc etc

SudokuMania · 20/03/2024 22:40
  • You could weave any sex based harassment into this.
SudokuMania · 20/03/2024 22:38

lonelywater · 19/03/2024 01:18

if I understand it right (according to Roddy Dunlop, KC, and others) the definition and test of the hate part is, get this-"whatever the recipient perceives it to be". Just let that sink in for a bit-no proof, no corroboration, no third party validation. If one were so minded it would only take, say, a few thousand vexatious phone calls a day from the terven to render this completely unworkable. Not that I would ever suggest such a course of action. No siree.

Could you use this to stop street harassment?
You're out for a lovely run when some male yells "faster you fat cow".
That could be reported as a hate incident - you perceive he only yelled out because you were middle aged, so you have one of the named characteristics - age.
You could weave harassment into this.

DuesToTheDirt · 20/03/2024 22:30

Good grief. Why are the police so captured? Is it because the police force is full of misogynists? Or because they've given up on other crimes and women are an easy target for them? Or is there some other reason?

SidewaysOtter · 20/03/2024 22:25

https://archive.ph/atDS1. Upsadaisy and over the paywall…

My flabber is truly ghasted.

Snoopy1612 · 20/03/2024 22:09

lonelywater · 19/03/2024 01:18

if I understand it right (according to Roddy Dunlop, KC, and others) the definition and test of the hate part is, get this-"whatever the recipient perceives it to be". Just let that sink in for a bit-no proof, no corroboration, no third party validation. If one were so minded it would only take, say, a few thousand vexatious phone calls a day from the terven to render this completely unworkable. Not that I would ever suggest such a course of action. No siree.

Don't we still need corroboration for prosecution in Scotland? Or are they going to be recorded as incidents against the "offender"? The other thing is how are they going to police social media - does it only apply if you post on Scotland or are a Scottish resident.....be a bit messy!!

DuesToTheDirt · 20/03/2024 22:04

Up to 7 years in prison for this.

And wee scrote rapists getting community service.

maltravers · 20/03/2024 21:44

Redshoeblueshoe · 20/03/2024 21:09

Police Scotland are at it now. Telegraph article on Twitter saying they have created a character called Jo who wants to send all trans people to the gas chamber.
These people should be sacked

Someone based in Scotland should report them for a hate crime against JKR (whipping up hate against her) on 1st April.

UtopiaPlanitia · 20/03/2024 21:29

The Irish government is 'well jell' that Scotland gets to bring in draconian hate speech laws first 😏

Ireland wants to be the most progressive wee Celtic nation on earth*

(*actual women’s rights not included)

AmaryllisChorus · 20/03/2024 21:10

FrippEnos · 19/03/2024 05:12

Offences are considered “aggravated”, meaning they could lead to stiffer sentences, if they involve prejudice on the basis of age, disability, race, religion, sexual orientation or transgender identity.

I wonder if the article left "sex" out completely or whether its not in the proposed legislation.

Oh did you not read their reasoning? It would be 'harmful to women' to legislate against misogyny.

From Gov.UK:
"making misogyny a hate crime may be: “more harmful than helpful, both to victims of violence against women and girls, and also to efforts to tackle hate crime more broadly” and that “…we have reached the view that hate crime recognition would not be an effective solution to the very real problem of violence, abuse and harassment of women and girls in England and Wales, and may in fact be counterproductive in some respects.”

It's like the pigs' logic in Animal Farm.

To paraphrase: We can't include sex, as sexual hatred against women is so widespread it's normal and we can't be bothered. Ladies - we have decided to protect you by not protecting you. You know it makes sense! Run along.

Redshoeblueshoe · 20/03/2024 21:09

Police Scotland are at it now. Telegraph article on Twitter saying they have created a character called Jo who wants to send all trans people to the gas chamber.
These people should be sacked

Original poster
Britinme · 20/03/2024 21:02

Extracts from the above article:

On the one hand, there is nothing surer to bring to a swift end both this abysmal law and the SNP’s appalling stewardship of Scotland than to see a famous and beloved author – not to mention philanthropist – prosecuted in the Scottish courts because of her insistence on saying out loud biological facts that everyone else acknowledges.
But in the meantime, Scotland risks a grim, dark period of cultural restrictions, where England-based actors, comedians and playwrights fear to head north of the border because of the pervasiveness of our self-appointed, volunteer Stasi and the willingness of Scottish police to waste everyone’s time by investigating hurt feelings while burglaries and car thefts go unaddressed.
For example, no “reasonable person” would find fault in Ricky Gervais’s recent routines, broadcast on Netflix, making fun of trans activists’ insistence that we must respect the pronouns of male rapists who identify as women. But after the beginning of next month, who would seriously dismiss the prospect of such a performance becoming the subject of a complaint to the police – a complaint that is at least likely to be investigated?

and

Scotland, thanks to devolution, has created a dystopia in which true freedom of speech can now only be practiced at the cost of one’s career and even one’s freedom.

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Isthisexpected · 19/03/2024 09:16

AlisonDonut · 19/03/2024 08:58

They said years ago that sex had to be left out as otherwise the police would never do anything else other than investigate sex based crimes.

And we can't have that now can we?

Well quite. Says it all really.

PogueMahoneRishi · 19/03/2024 09:12

fascinatingdei · 18/03/2024 20:57

As someone subjected to vile sectarian abuse my whole childhood, I’ll be extremely disappointed if this legislation is used in this way rather than against actual bigots.

It will. The woman that was charged in 2021 for posting a photo of a ribbon was reported because the idiots thought this Act was law once it received Royal Assent. They reported her tweets a day or so after the Assent, assuming they'd get her arrested. So, now they realise it will come in on April Fool's Day they will go on a reporting spree.

AlisonDonut · 19/03/2024 08:58

They said years ago that sex had to be left out as otherwise the police would never do anything else other than investigate sex based crimes.

And we can't have that now can we?

fromorbit · 19/03/2024 08:57

Cailin66 · 19/03/2024 07:14

It’s not in the legislation.

Show quote history

Yeah the legislation protects everyone except prejudice against women or men on the basis of sex - one of the commonest forms of hate. Crosssdressers are protected though under the trans bit so I guess if you are a women that wears trousers and no make up you could use that identity as a defence. A man in a skirt is protected a woman in a skirt isn't - one of the most absurd aspects of the whole thing.

However, Hate Monster, someone who everyone takes seriously, is a JKR and women's rights supporter. Going to be attending Let Women Speak Edinburgh. It is great that the famous actor who was a star in the Furry Potter film series has always backed women. When Hate Monster agreed to appear in Police Scotland's advertising campaign HM didn't realise it would be use to promote anti-woman hate. HM is talking to a lawyer.

The muppet community is generally behind JKR see pic. She received the highest award muppets can offer as the first ever recipient of "The Jim Henson Celebration Honor".

All new hate crimes legislation - JKR stands firm
All new hate crimes legislation - JKR stands firm
All new hate crimes legislation - JKR stands firm
Chrysanthemum5 · 19/03/2024 08:55

Sex has not been included and apparently that's because not including it is more beneficial for women. They had spurious reasons but the real fact is that the police said if misogyny were included it would take too much time as it is so constant

StealthSpinach · 19/03/2024 07:55

Sex has deliberately not been included.

Shows how much consideration is given to women, doesn’t it?