Labour Losing women

@canttellyouwhereorwhatido I'm very sorry to hear about your parents but my 21 year old DC has a perfect healthy body. Labour support an ideology that tells them the way to deal with the problems in their head is destroy their perfect healthy body (which I grew in my own female body). This is backed up by the NHS which isn't fit for purpose - not because the Tories haven't put enough money into it - but because they put ideology before evidence based medicine.

When I plead with my DC not to take hormones, their reponse is "it must be the right thing because it says so on the NHS website". The fuckers that perpetuate this nonsense have blood on their hands. I have spent hundreds of pounds I can't afford on paying for therapy for them from a non-affirming hugely experienced therapist (a Tavistock whistleblower) who's practice could be outlawed by the fucking idiots in the Labour party.

Its negligent verging on criminal and, if you think there's any other issue anywhere close to this in importance for the thousands of families whose lives are collapsing due to this scandalous shitshow, you're completely mistaken. I subscribe to the substack Parents with Inconvenient Truths about Trans and every single day there's a new essay published by a parent who is watching their child and family disintegrate in this cesspit. It's heartbreaking and I don't need you or anyone else to tell me that this isn't the most important issue because it really is.

Lantyslee all best wishes for you and your child and family.

I agree with what you say,
”That the Labour front bench can come out with this utter crap in the week the WPATH leaks have emerged demonstrates they're either extraordinarily stupid or totally morally bankrupt.”

I don’t think a Labour landslide is a foregone conclusion, I really don’t. Labour need a significant swing back and although they have made some gains in the wall that formally identified as red,, there is still a huge amount to be done. Labour is associated still with Corbyn. Reform are also thought to be polling favourably, and Labour need to ask why that it is.
Personally I think they’re all a bunch of self-interest bunch of lobby snakes. If I don’t spoil my ballet it will be the SDP.

I agree and will be looking to vote independent if at all possible - if not I shall spoil with one of Posie's stickers (again). I cannot vote for the shit show that is either the Labour or Tory parties at the moment. I could not have that on my conscience tbh.

@canttellyouwhereorwhatido I feel really let down by Labour on this issue.

I have never voted Tory in my life.

But I can't vote Labour whilst they are hellbent on removing women's rights and putting children on, what they must know, are harmful pathways.

They have collectively lost their minds on identity politics.

It is up to Labour to make themselves vote worthy on these issues. If women don't hold them to account then we are agreeing that these things don't matter.

I can't do that.

I care too much about vulnerable women.

My child isn't in the same position as @Lantyslee 's DC but she is autistic and is vulnerable to this ideology too.

Our children deserve so much better. Labour is going to make counselling them unlawful ffs, they call it 'conversion therapy'.

So if you are going to vote Labour which is your choice that is fine, but please don't lecture other women on our choices.

For me this is too important. Labour could earn our votes but instead they persist with this harmful ideology.

I really believe this is the way forward and hope there are more come forward for this election.

It's not an either/or, though, is it. Labour have said they will pretty much stick to Tory spending plans, so there's no bonanza for the NHS around the corner. However, it seems a racing certainty that Labour will get in, whether posters here like it or not. So the best that can be done is to hold them accountable. FWIW I don't think the Tories are taking the line they are on gender cos they think it will win them votes, after all, most posters seem to concede that the issue won't drastically affect voting patterns for the GBP as a whole anyway.

There are very few women on here celebrating the Tories. But read Lantyslee's post upthread (at 20.33) and tell me that their child doesn't deseve safeguarding? There's a massive medical and ethical scandal happening to children and young people, along with the systematic removal of women and lesbian's rights. That's a big issue and it speaks to the lack of ethics on the part of politicians pushing this stuff.
When labour can be captured by queer theorists openly exploiting children, what other groups will they be captured by? How will they find the courage to stand up to organised crime, the Putins of the world if they're too scared of (or too in thrall to) transactivists?
I've never voted tory but I'm not giving my vote back to labour until they wake up and start recognising the harm that's happening to children and women. Until they do that, my vote is no longer for them.

But you believe the Tories ?? Does Johnson, Truss etc truly fill you with belief. If so there is no hope ..

I don't disagree that it's an outrage . I absolutely wholeheartedly agree with you all .. BUT .. a revoked GRA at the expense of completely destroyed public services.. is too higher price to pay for me .. this is ONE issue versus about 10,000 others .

I'm MUCH more concerned that there are 100s of SEN kids not in education because the transport is not available to take them to school .

My parents both died within 8 days of each other last year.. completely fit and healthy, NO medication for either of them .. my mother had to wait 19days in bed in a hospital with 60 patients being cared for by 2 nurses and 5 HCAs .. got a bed sore as no one to turn her .. sepsis and died 8 weeks later .. dad has a chest infection, insufficient staff, lab tests took ten days.. pneumonia/covid no intensive care available... died . It's a fucking disgrace ..

All of this is streets ahead of some fucking nonsense about saying you are a woman when you have a penis between your legs ..

It needs to be stopped .. but not at the expense of this lot staying in charge.

So long as Labour can tell me they will protect single sex spaces whole ALSO telling me men can be women I cannot trust them on anything.

Leaving aside women's rights it's just such egregious bullshit. It's an outrage to common sense. It's science denying, reality denying, faith based bollocks. And worst of all they plan to forge on with Hate Crime law expansions so nobody will be able to question it.

Do you HONESTLY BELIEVE any promise they make

I don't believe a word Labour say, no.

Yes it’s a complete mess

It’s also a western phenomenon as @Lantyslee says

We are in the middle of Orwell meets McCarthy and I’m not sure how we’ll get out of it given major institutions such as UN and the WHO are also signed up

So what are Labour's policies on those issues, how will they fix them and how will they pay for them?

The EA was also Labour legislation, and by all accounts, written in a rush and a dogs bbreakfast. Which is why nobody is really clear on how to apply the SSEs, for example. And why Lady Haldane managed to decide women were both biological women only and also men with genderfeels.

I don't care who bought it in . The whole issue is not one I am prepared to risk this horrid bunch of incompetent shysters getting in again on .

The NHS
SEN education provision
Education in general
Courts backlog is HORRIFIC
Care for the elderly.
Fucking POTHOLES !!

Basically EVERYTHING they have driven into the ground whilst lining their own pockets comes WAY ahead of someone telling me he is a 'woman' ..

Much rather argue, campaign and demonstrate on this issue with a Labour government than this lot who will tell you whatever you want to hear in order to stay in power .

Do you not recall the promises of the sunlit uplands they promised with BREXIT ... they lie !! Then lie again ..

Do you HONESTLY BELIEVE any promise they make if no longer expedient to do so ...

The ONLY reason a Tory is interested in supporting the anti trans lobby is because it's just about the ONLY thing that they think will get them a vote ..

The moment one of them has shares in a new miracle drug that can make a man lactate and breastfeed .. they will be changing their pronouns faster than they change mistresses . You are being had .

@Lantyslee from me too and agree

I‘m so sorry you are facing this. Adults who created and support this ideology have failed dc

Thank you @Lantyslee and I'm so sorry.
This is what drives so many of us. Knowing what is happening to children and young people. The unforgivable gaslighting and manipulation enabled by the craven capitulation by once respected politicians, deliberately turning their backs on the young and vulnerable.

This bullshit has emerged during a Tory government because it's a global phenomenon which has taken hold thoughout developed countries over the last 5 to 10 years.

IMO we would be further down the line with mutilating vulnerable people's bodies and removing the rights of women if we'd had any other party in power in Westminster because the Conservatives have at least pushed back against some of it. That doesn't mean the current government has been a good one (however you might define that) but I believe they've been better at moderating gender identitity fuckery than any other UK political party would have been.

That the Labour front bench can come out with this utter crap in the week the WPATH leaks have emerged demonstrates they're either extraordinarily stupid or totally morally bankrupt. As someone who's trying to save their gender identifying child from destroying their body I cannot tell you how replusive I find Angela Eagle and those who share her views. I will not be voting Labour, nor I imagine, will any of the other desperate parents I've met.

The GRA was brought in by Labour in 2004

Without it we wouldn’t have the problems we do with sex based rights v gender ideology

I am not a frequent visitor to this board but find the need to say that whilst I am vehemently opposed to the trans ideology of calling men women because they fancy it .. and stand four square behind EVERY campaign to obliterate this nonsense.. it is not the be all ..

I want FUNDED public services
I want this bunch of corrupt incompetent grifters OUT ..

ANOTHER five years of this bunch is an abomination.. and all threads like this do is take away the.chance of it happening..

This is ONE issue which I will be campaigning on .. BUT with a Labour government in power ..

Do you all not see that this is ALL the Tories have .. and I doubt they care about it much anyway .. it just might get them a few more votes

Don't forget ALL this GR nonsense has happened ON THEIR WATCH !!

It's just like in the 70s. Huge overlap between certain feminists and the natural childbirth crew who insisted on a very narrow and restrictive vision of motherhood and family life. No formula, no caesareans, no pain relief, and no time for yourself because the baby must be attached to you 24/7.

I was around in the 1970s, and it wasn’t like this at all, except on the extreme fringes where you always find fanatics and oddballs.
(I will say that maternity care then, for all its faults, mostly looked after mothers well, kept them in until properly rested after the birth, with breastfeeding established if they wished to - which I did - before sending them home.)

Many important services for women were founded in the 1970s, by disparate groups of feminists. They did not always agree with one another politically or philosophically, but they always centred women. Being “just like the 1970s” is not necessarily a bad thing, though that time appears to be seen by some people as a sort of latter day Dark Ages.

You'd honestly support using young babies as a kind of experiment to satisfy male desire to feel more feminine? That's a bit sick, isn't it?

The reason isn’t always for men to feel more feminine as a transwoman, it can be sexual.

Only Mumsnet gets to decide what views are expressed on here. What you're getting is feedback from women, many of us mothers, based on your rather naive and lacking in credibility, assertions.
I admit to finding many of your posts hostile when you describe women on here as anti trans, transphobic and spout all the tropes that we see from transactivists. But your comments are actually welcome as their intense hostility to women, mothers and safeguarding children is a useful example of how some transactivists view the family, women and children's rights - always subservient to the demands of transactivistm to reshape society for their own benefit.

@ForCoralFox

You do know that the drug that is used to induce lactation in men is linked (in smaller concentrations) to heart issues in babies when it is given to lactating mothers? It's often refused on the NHS to mothers struggling to breastfeed for that reason.

You'd honestly support using young babies as a kind of experiment to satisfy male desire to feel more feminine? That's a bit sick, isn't it?