Judith Butler describes the October 7 attacks by Hamas as "armed resistance"

I don't subscribe to the concept of left and right and therefore I make up my own mind about different subjects. I completely support the rights of women over trans people and I don't support the existence of Israel in the place it is and the way it was created. I can explain both of these things for as long as you would like.

I did. See above. Israel is a racist state, founded on racism that continues to be racist. It is an apartheid state because different people have different rights and treatment depending on their religion and ethnicity.

Israel is a racist, occupying, apartheid state that plays the constant victim whilst committing warcrimes on a yearly basis.

Yeh, and the moon is made of blue cheese and transwomen really are women.

Total ignorance. You are just repeating routine anti Israel mantras, I suggest, with little awareness or knowledge of what you are talking about.

I'd like to hear your detailed explanation of how and why you make thiis claim.

That's partly because the British Left has always focused on Israel as the main repository for its ire. A lot of this ire is rooted in the history of Soviet anti semitism. The Jews can never be forgiven for prioritising their Jewish identity over their identity as 'International Socialists' and a commitment to the Russian motherland. But who could blame them given the number of pogroms they were subject to in Russia and the Pale - and Stalin's very thinly disguised Jew hatred.

Furthermore, Israel gained a lot of support from the U.S.A ( And American Jews) and of course, the U.S is always the enemy of the Left/Russia. The West is associated with 'capitalism' and 'imperialism' and Israel has come to embody ( even if most haters have little awareness of the reality of life in Israel) everything they oppose.

The 'International Socialists' - such as Jeremy Corbyn predicated their movement on joining forces with the Bathist parties of the Middle East ( Saddam Hussein led a Bathist party, for example) in the attempt to over-throw the various Arab monarchies, as well as western interests in the region.

Malyasia doesn't cut it - neither do any other of the world's conflicts.

If its nothing to do with what Hamas did, why are you posting it on a thread about what Hamas did? If you want to talk about how Israel and Israelis are the absolute worse there are plenty of threads about that, believe me.

But you havent been upset about both things have you? You are here primarily to sock it to the jews murdered and raped.

It’s not a belief it’s a provable fact. And it has nothing to do with what Hamas did. I can be upset about two things at once.

Even if that’s what you believe, nothing justifies rape and sexual assault as a way of pushing back against that, and nothing justifies minimising such actions as part of an “armed resistance.”

It’s a racist apartheid ethnostate.

The twisting and turning is rather humorous isnt it?

And the political system of Israel does?

I know this is a rather parochial view but what's happening in Malaysia doesn't threaten security or harmony in the UK to quite the same extent.

I'm just posting this in responce to the OP because quoting a tweet which quotes something out of context is rarely useful.

So not posting this in anyway supporting JB but this is an article from an independent Jewish paper which has a rather different interpretation of what she said. (NB it is irriatating to read as it constantly uses they when referring to JB)

https://forward.com/culture/589334/judith-butler-israel-zionism-hamas/

Obviously this situation is a minefield because how you say things doesn't allow for the fact that words have so many different interpretations, particularly in relation to existing beliefs, politics of the listener / reader.

Look at the trouble that Million Women Rise have landed themselves in by posting the link to a statement from women's groups in the US.

Whatever they thought it was about, it has in fact led some women to assume that MWR is somehow a supporter of Hamas. Unfortunatley instead of clarifying or making their own statement, they have just turned comments off on the facebook page.

Malaysia is a more "apartheid" state which has practised a wholly discriminatory ethno-religious supremacy policy against its minorities for the last 5 decades - yet none of the the Social Justice warriors here have said a word against the country. Malaysia's minorities are greater in number and suffer far more injustice than Israel's - where is the great outcry?

Israel is not alone in being especially supportive of a particular religion or culture ( even as it has no law that forbids a PM of any of the national religions). To be a state ( the only state) in which Judaism and Jews are protected was the whole point of the project.

There are numerous states which do stipulate a certain religion for the Head of State, most of those are Muslim countries; but add to that the U.K, Sweden, Denmark and Norway that stipulate that the Head of State has to belong to a particular denomination. Are these countries also 'apartheid' countries?

The girl who was paraded round by Hamas, naked and beaten, in a truck. Another girl who was dragged into a truck by her hair by them, with blood on her pants.

So beating, raping and showing off the atrocities committed against young women at a festival were “acts of resistance”? And justified or acceptable in some way?

No matter what side we are on in this conflict, this is wrong, totally and unequivocably.

You just lost an argument in addition to being a rape apologist.

This is so horrific

Barbaric and medieval

There’ll always be posters on these threads excusing it sadly (SM is of extremes) but Butler is a shocker

Fascinating to see your repeated attempts to deny the brownness of the majority of the population of Israel and to portray them solely as a European interlopers. I really dont get involved in the I-P conflict (this thread is the only one in MN where I have expressed my views) and it is scary to see the monomania of the palestinian partisans. It is almost like something deep and ugly drives you lot. Please dont tell me it is dead babies, because there have always been dead babies elsewhere and it hasnt roused this much er, passion.

Torturing and raping women to death, torturing and burning children alive in front of their parents, none of that is resistance, it's a self-indulgent, sadistic rampage. It's vengeful people having fun. Can you imagine, say, any of the resistance movements in Occupied Europe wasting time and resources in raiding into Germany on a rape and murder spree? The only purpose of this attack was to infect the Israeli psyche with the constant threat of a truly terrible death, which is an all-too-familiar tactic men use to curtail women's freedom and enjoyment of the world.

I'm sick of women calling themselves feminists when all they do is act like the cronies of the nastiest and most intimidating of men. The likes of Judith Butler should have 'Do it to Julia!' as their slogan because it's how they live their lives.

You came to distract from rape apologia from a side you have picked. Congrats, you are an apologist for rape of women and children.

Are you offering more context for rape? Thank you for showing your true colours.

Again, calling it apartheid is just a way of turning a complex situation into good vs bad. Not accurate and helps no one.