Will Labour introduce Self ID & curb free speech?

If you think toilets are more important than women dying giving birth or being murdered by serving Police Officers, then yes i call BS.

This is your false assumption. Concern for one thing does not preclude concern over others.

It was also your false assumption ‘That it is all about toilets”. It isn’t.

So what is the rest, the things other than toilets that some people here are concerned about? There are thousands of pages here about those.

Well, i can't put down everything!!! people don't read long posts.

I happen to agree with you, my argument though is "Why is Labour blamed for this?"

Its time after time, vote Tory to save womens rights..... completely ignoring the destruction that is still happening under Sunak.

Hunt is openly offering tax cuts, funded by public service cuts.. who will be disproportionately affected by these? clue: not men.

GC women on here are silent.

If you think toilets are more important than women dying giving birth or being murdered by serving Police Officers, then yes i call BS.

The report yesterday made it clear there is nothing stopping another Cousins being recruited.
Don't you find that even a tiny bit more important?

This is why the trans issues don't cut through with a majority of women, intelligent enough to see what is really happening.

We have a form of self ID right now, 1000s of GRC have been handed out over recent years or by the back door as you put it.

I'm entitled to my opinion, same as you are, i don't take offence that you call me arrogant etc or who you vote for, you'll be in the minority.

PP82 paints a grim picture of a potential Labour win but considering (if I am remembering correctly) that PP82 is not resident in the UK, they want a stateless society with no prisons, and they have not provided any evidence of their assertion that Labour intend to criminalise people for stating biological fact, I think we can take his / hers / they’s opinion with a pinch of salt.

That was in reply to this post:

PP82 · Yesterday 14:28

Hilary Cass has been 'captured' by you lot.

Children should be free to socially transition at school without their parents knowledge. It should be a place where they can explore their identities without parental interference

My response is:

Do you really think children grow up in a vacuum that means that, so long as their parents do not interfere with them, they will remain uninterfered with?

What is the realistic alternative to prisons? Genuine question. How would that work? I can't imagine someone like that piece of shit Cousens doing community service.

If you're biologically female and not a woman, you're a girl.

Do you really think children grow up in a vacuum that means that, so long as their parents do not interfere with them, they will remain uninterfered with?

So what is the difference, PP? Seriously, what makes someone a woman other than the fact that they’re born female?

Well, I'd say the question posed in the thread title has been well and truly answered, with icing on top.

Of course. Because parents want to harm their children. The children should go with those nice men who offer them sweeties.

And choice of the word 'regime ' is very very interesting.

Or maybe this is more what you had in mind @PP82?

I'm just imagining handsmaid tale like scenes of sinner women, being forced to perform community services for not agreeing that woman gender men are woman sex. Because that's what easier self ID, under Labour's proposals could do in conjunction with your proposed punishments.

Pretty fucking dystopian.

I'm with JKR on this. I'm not prepared to be compelled to tell harmful lies.

You may not understand matters of criminal justice system but you must have some understanding of human nature.

Think of something you believe to be an absolute fact and that has significant importance in your life. Do you think that “awareness training” telling you that this thing you believe is not true or important will change this?

I believe that TWAM. You could hold a gun to my head and I will still believe that TWAM. So a mandatory awareness course and a spot of community service (alongside all the other wrong thinkers and heretics) isn’t really going to achieve anything is it?

You may not be an expert in matters of criminal justice but you must see that laws that criminalise more than half the population will seriously undermine the system?

Or perhaps that is exactly what you want, as someone who describes themselves as (I can’t remember the exact phrase) anti-state.

'Reasoned debate???' Is that what you call what happens here?

OK. Well good luck under the new regime 😉

@Alexandra2001
For me, it boils down to priorities: Wayne Cousins, the Mets response to the protest, Police Whatsapp groups, maternity deaths of women and babies, cancer treatments, lack of DV refuges... VS Toilets and Park run results.

This is a false dichotomy though. No one here thinks the former group aren't important. They are a mix of things that are very hard to change (male violence) and things that are in a poor state because of underfunding (which there's no guarantee any political party will address).

Putting males into women's toilets, & parkrun results (and you somehow forgot to mention here all the other sports, changing rooms, prisons, hospital wards etc) is a conscious decision based on a flawed and harmful ideology. Politicians and other influential people think that it is right and good that men have the right to intrude on women's services, and that children can be taught about anti-scientific concepts like being born in the wrong body. There are few issues remaining in society where the solution to a great injustice is just for reasoned debate to take place, most of our problems sadly require billions of pounds of investment to tackle adequately, but this issue is one of those issues, so it is worth focussing on.

@SinnerBoy care to write again in such way as it doesn't breach guidelines for any reason? I'm curious.

PP82 · Today 07:55

OK, fair enough. I just made that assumption as it was a reply to you.

If a man saying he is a woman gender gives him the right to falsify the sex on his documents with a GRC then I have every right to say that's a load of bollocks he is not female.

If falsifying those documents gives him the right to be in women's single sex spaces I have every right to say no I won't go along with this fiction.

You can claim that it is gender and not sex IF this doesn't erode on women's sex based provisions.

As it is I call bullshit and I won't go along with lies or agree that women should face actual punishment for saying that a person is a man when they are a man.

At the risk of repetition, these issues don’t exist in isolation. You seem to think you’re occupying some kind of political high ground because, for example, you prioritise maternity care. But you disparage voters who suggest that women also deserve the right to same-sex intimate care or that female mental health patients should be on single-sex wards. You’re dismissing a vast tranche of concerns that directly impact many of the things you claim are important as ‘just toilets and park run’. And many women aren’t saying they are voting Tory at all, many are saying they won’t vote or that the decision is very difficult.

I really don't understand why you all feel the need to be so literal about everything. There is a difference between being biologically female and a woman. They often coincide but not always.

For not believing that men can be women because they say so?

Absolutely insanity.

It's like punishing a person who won't agree the sky is green or the earth is flat.

It's a nice sunny Friday and there is about as much point arguing with some people as there is in hoovering a beach.