Will Labour introduce Self ID & curb free speech?

I live in the city; am an ex Labour party member: I like to take photographs of urbanism and urban events; and I was listening to women speak.

Really good point. And made in the Telegraph article on JKR in a parallel way.

Bloody awful behaviours, values and ideologies are a cross party issue. They are not any better when being done by a socially high value group such as TQ+ or left wing parties. They are symptomatic of bloody awful extremist politics on both left and right.

And it's going to take cross party sanity to throw out these awful ways of thinking and behaviours and go back to what is right.

When we have Jews screaming for death to muslims on our streets; or threatening to shut down parliament; or when teachers have to go into hiding because they've inadvertently offended the sensibilities of the Jewish community, then maybe we could talk about equivalence with Islamists.

When was the last murder of an MP in Britain carried out by a Jew or even 'a zionist'? Which group is it that calls out Fatwahs on people and stabs authors in the face when on stage?

That Labour is trying to draw equivalence between anti semitism and being critical of Islamism ( which is responsible for all of the above and more) is downright manipulative.

I've never voted Conservative & I can't see that I'm likely to, so tbh the internal politics of the Tories are less of my concern beyond what they actually do in power. Anderson is awful, but to pretend there isn't a problem in Labour with racists (and indeed misogynists) suggests you either haven't been paying attention or you have no long term experience of local Labour politics (I have).

Specifically in relation to gender politics, all the intimidation I've come up against, at Women's Place meetings etc has come from organised demonstrations from the left. Identifiable as such, and generally very proud of being on the left.

You know undermining public systems (like schools and education) and eroding trust in experts (like teachers) is one of the hallmarks of fascism, right?

You know it's also one of the hallmarks of communism? Also that control of education and separation of child from parent is also a tactic of those on the far right and the far left. It is not just fascists who seek to undermine systems of power, control children and separate them from their parents.

The Labour Party have been pretty ruthless in dealing with anti semitism.

Really? You think? From the river to the sea?

You can't get rid of people for "thought crimes" though.

The Labour Party has been doing that to women across the country, as you well know.

What were you doing outside the conference? Protesting yourself perhaps?

Where do you hang out? I was outside of a Labour party conference in Liverpool when subject to a deranged and decidedly 'progressive' mob.

Bernie Sanders, the darling of the American Left, was also subject to a demented left wing mob when he came to Liverpool last week. It is not enough he opposes war in the Middle East - he has to utter specific words or else have people " hunt him down" in order to get in his face and scream that he is "a genocide denier". Local MPs have been warned too that they " will be held accountable".

I'm very familiar with Left wing bullying and intmidation where I live; even some of those in the Labour party are at the sharp end of it...which is why some MPs have had to be given extra police protection this week.

If you think the threats are coming only from Islamists who are 'right wing' you surely have to wonder why so many on the Left are hanging out, and joining forces, with them?

Do you have anything to say about the Conservatives support for Anderson? His comments and subsequent doubling down were all during media appearances and he's had vocal support from a number of MPs. Plus the whip was suspended because "he refused to apologise" not because he was racist.

The Labour Party have been pretty ruthless in dealing with anti semitism. You can't get rid of people for "thought crimes" though. You can't assume those Labour activists saw nothing wrong with it. In fact I assume the opposite as someone went to the trouble of covertly recording a private meeting and leaking it.

The hypocrisy of attacking Labour over racism at the moment is astounding.

Without derailing. The only reason that the Labour Rochdale candidate went was that a recording of the meeting he spoke at was leaked. A meeting filled with other Labour activists who presumably saw nothing wrong with what he said. Labour activists who are all still in place.

"Lost" is a very passive way to describe it too. I prefer "Labour has literally just got rid of a PPC & an actual candidate because they were racist."
Good work Labour, I say

Yes. Shame you can't say the same for the Conservatives who refuse to actually outright condemn Anderson and leave other racists in place.

You know undermining public systems (like schools and education) and eroding trust in experts (like teachers) is one of the hallmarks of fascism, right?

https://world101.cfr.org/contemporary-history/world-war/what-fascism

I'm not angry about what's being said about schools because of any position I might hold on gender politics. I'm angry because undermining schools is a fascist tactic.

Same with undermining the civil service. Or scientists.

I don't want to see the UK slide into fascism.

This is an interesting analysis of De Santis' policy on controlling education in Florida and how it mirrors what Mussolini did in Italy. Quite long though.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fascisms-history-offers-lessons-about-todays-attacks-on-education/

x.com/furiousbanshee/status/1762872332731765087?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

gendercriticalwoman.blog/2022/04/05/labour-party-anthony-watson/

This £80k to Labour (first link) is significant as it's from August 2023. Probably needs its own thread but relevant here. Second link gives further background.

Yes, this is what I fear.

And schools and the NHS and other organisations will be even more riddled.

Labour has literally just lost a PPC & an actual candidate because they were racist.

As unquestionable things go, I'd say transitioning kids behind their parents' back is one of the more questionable.

Hmmm. OK. Maybe that's to do with where we both hang out. From my perspective, it's the right wing that are now being openly racist, backing violent protesters like Tommy Robinson, and targeting people who won't say what they want (there's no such thing as a trans woman, they are men).

The right are in power more and the totalitarianism is what I hear directly coming out of MPs mouths, not what's inferred based on my politics.

But we'll probably have to agree to disagree on that.

You think children only don't tell their parents things because they are 'afraid'. Oh bless your sweet summer soul.

From that The Critic piece:

Nicola Sturgeon’s reform of the Gender Recognition Act, which would allow people legally to change their sex, with minimal checks, from the age of sixteen.

Even the more decent sectors of the media continue to use these kinds of formulations, I wish they wouldn't. People can't change sex! As bad as 'sex-change operations'. No such thing.

More generally, the piece certainly paints a bleak picture of the Labour Party these days.

I watched it. There is nothing in this clip that supports your claim that Starmer was aware of the undercover police who were operating in activist groups and having abusive relationships with female activists at the time he was assisting HS and DM with the McLibel case. There is zero evidence to support this claim because if there was it would be headline news.

How is the current Tory party totalitarian? If anything, they are committed to destroying the State. They are creating a kind of anarchy, in which only the interests of the rich prevail, and where civil society has been broken down through underfunding and neglect.

I'm no fan of the Tories, but the Left is infinitely more totalitarian in its ideology and operations.

Yes, I do.
I think a lot of Labour voters are going to be very disappointed.
They'll bring in Self ID by the backdoor by making a GRC easier to get.
They'll follow Canada and Ireland on the hate-speech laws, which will shut down free speech.
I also think there will be a backlash following a Labour term with a big swing to the right, just as has happened in Europe and may happen in the USA and Canada.